Would you be okay with the company, CGC, buying and selling raw comics?

[RockMyAmadeus]

There was something written above that I thought was odd. I imagine someone working for a comic grading company likes comics but they aren't allowed to buy them if they work there? Really?

 

Clarification: Commercial buying or selling, which means they can't buy or sell them as a "dealer." The official verbiage is: "CGC does not buy or sell comic books and does not have a financial interest in the comic books that we certify. In fact, employees of CGC are prohibited from buying and selling comic books commercially."

 

Yes, they can buy them personally.

 

Here's an explanation from Scott Schechter, VP at NGC:

 

Most of the people who work at NGC genuinely love coins. Some are collectors and joined NGC so that they could pursue their passion full time. Others, if they are not actively collecting, appreciate coins enough to buy something now and again when it strikes their fancy.

 

If we prohibited all full-time employees from buying or selling coins, period, that policy would make it impossible for collectors to work for NGC. Instead, full-time employees cannot own or have financial interest in a dealership or buy or sell coins for a commercial account.

 

The reason for this is simple: to eliminate potential conflicts of interest. Just imagine grading coins for a customer that are nicer than the coins you have in your own inventoryhow impartial could you be? Thats a situation that we would never let happen at NGC.

 

We think this policy is an important and meaningful discriminator among grading services, which is why we post it on our website. The reason that we word it with the qualifier, commercially, is simply to be honest and accurate. Certified Collectibles Group employees do follow a detailed compliance procedure to aid enforcement of this policy, but despite that inconvenience (and it can be a headache) we dont want to preclude anyone who is truly passionate about rare coins from joining NGC.

 

Substitute "CGC" for "NGC", and there you go.

Good thing Mark is a consultant and not a full-time employee AND that he can't grade his own books, because that man can buy and sell some books just from what I've witnessed on the con floors. He always manages to beat me to most of the good books at dealers.

 

So either he's not doing it commercially or that loophole of not being a fulltime employee makes it okay.

 

Hey, I didn't say there aren't cracks in the wall....

 

 

[Transplant]

You don't say?

[Transplant]

Steve B. said that was one of the rules he insisted on when he set this up, and was why he collected OA. He also said that there were changes when Mark came back. Edit: Steve was long gone by then.

I was told by someone else, it was part of Mark's new contract, he is doing this above board.

 

There were rumours about others buying and selling before, but as with all rumours, who knows. I do know I was on line behind Mark a few times at shows, so he's certainly never hidden anything..

 

Completely agree. I wasn't insinuating anything was being done surreptitiously. Just pointing out to folks that at least one of the CGC "consultants" who does grade books, also buys and sells commercially.

 

But we've been assured by the press release that he never grades his own books. Of course, that begs the question as to how anyone would know that it's his book to be able to enforce this? Or what the effect of Mark refusing to grade a particular book (because it's his) has on the other graders who might be aware of that action (and, consequently, the fact that the book is Mark's)?

[skypinkblu]

Steve B. said that was one of the rules he insisted on when he set this up, and was why he collected OA. He also said that there were changes when Mark came back. Edit: Steve was long gone by then.

I was told by someone else, it was part of Mark's new contract, he is doing this above board.

 

There were rumours about others buying and selling before, but as with all rumours, who knows. I do know I was on line behind Mark a few times at shows, so he's certainly never hidden anything..

 

Completely agree. I wasn't insinuating anything was being done surreptitiously. Just pointing out to folks that at least one of the CGC "consultants" who does grade books, also buys and sells commercially.

 

But we've been assured by the press release that he never grades his own books. Of course, that begs the question as to how anyone would know that it's his book to be able to enforce this? Or what the effect of Mark refusing to grade a particular book (because it's his) has on the other graders who might be aware of that action (and, consequently, the fact that the book is Mark's)?

 

No, I know you weren't...I just figured I'd add something. I have no idea how anyone knows anything. All I know is I went to a forum dinner and one of the graders came over and told me that when he graded my book, it had blazing colors. I'm not naming names. I was kind of surprised he knew it was mine...but I did hand it in, in person at the show. Maybe he asked someone at the dinner whose book it was, I had it up on the shelf.

 

I think like anything else, there are optimal practices, and practical practices. Weren't we also promised something about 3 graders at one time?

 

 

[Transplant]

Steve B. said that was one of the rules he insisted on when he set this up, and was why he collected OA. He also said that there were changes when Mark came back. Edit: Steve was long gone by then.

I was told by someone else, it was part of Mark's new contract, he is doing this above board.

 

There were rumours about others buying and selling before, but as with all rumours, who knows. I do know I was on line behind Mark a few times at shows, so he's certainly never hidden anything..

 

Completely agree. I wasn't insinuating anything was being done surreptitiously. Just pointing out to folks that at least one of the CGC "consultants" who does grade books, also buys and sells commercially.

 

But we've been assured by the press release that he never grades his own books. Of course, that begs the question as to how anyone would know that it's his book to be able to enforce this? Or what the effect of Mark refusing to grade a particular book (because it's his) has on the other graders who might be aware of that action (and, consequently, the fact that the book is Mark's)?

 

No, I know you weren't...I just figured I'd add something. I have no idea how anyone knows anything. All I know is I went to a forum dinner and one of the graders came over and told me that when he graded my book, it had blazing colors. I'm not naming names. I was kind of surprised he knew it was mine...but I did hand it in, in person at the show. Maybe he asked someone at the dinner whose book it was, I had it up on the shelf.

 

I think like anything else, there are optimal practices, and practical practices. Weren't we also promised something about 3 graders at one time?

 

"CGC guarantees that Collectibles encapsulated in a CGC holder are authentic and have been inspected by at least two professionals."

[Guardian Comics]

There was something written above that I thought was odd. I imagine someone working for a comic grading company likes comics but they aren't allowed to buy them if they work there? Really?

 

Clarification: Commercial buying or selling, which means they can't buy or sell them as a "dealer." The official verbiage is: "CGC does not buy or sell comic books and does not have a financial interest in the comic books that we certify. In fact, employees of CGC are prohibited from buying and selling comic books commercially."

 

Yes, they can buy them personally.

 

Here's an explanation from Scott Schechter, VP at NGC:

 

Most of the people who work at NGC genuinely love coins. Some are collectors and joined NGC so that they could pursue their passion full time. Others, if they are not actively collecting, appreciate coins enough to buy something now and again when it strikes their fancy.

 

If we prohibited all full-time employees from buying or selling coins, period, that policy would make it impossible for collectors to work for NGC. Instead, full-time employees cannot own or have financial interest in a dealership or buy or sell coins for a commercial account.

 

The reason for this is simple: to eliminate potential conflicts of interest. Just imagine grading coins for a customer that are nicer than the coins you have in your own inventoryhow impartial could you be? Thats a situation that we would never let happen at NGC.

 

We think this policy is an important and meaningful discriminator among grading services, which is why we post it on our website. The reason that we word it with the qualifier, commercially, is simply to be honest and accurate. Certified Collectibles Group employees do follow a detailed compliance procedure to aid enforcement of this policy, but despite that inconvenience (and it can be a headache) we dont want to preclude anyone who is truly passionate about rare coins from joining NGC.

 

Substitute "CGC" for "NGC", and there you go.

Good thing Mark is a consultant and not a full-time employee AND that he can't grade his own books, because that man can buy and sell some books just from what I've witnessed on the con floors. He always manages to beat me to most of the good books at dealers.

 

So either he's not doing it commercially or that loophole of not being a fulltime employee makes it okay.

 

Hey, I didn't say there aren't cracks in the wall....

 

 

Well at first you didn't

 

Jim

[RockMyAmadeus]

You don't say?

 

I don't. And you didn't see nothing, either, see...?

 

[jcjames]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

That is what I was thinking for a long time.

 

But not one side of CGC's house selling their own "graded raw" books while the other house grades+slabs your own raws for a fee. That's a recipe for a bad reputation.

 

But I do like the idea of submitting books for grading w/o encapsulation.

 

 

 

 

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

[Transplant]

Doesn't CCS offer a resto check only service?

[joeypost]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

 

This works based on the honesty of the seller. I could have a book checked for resto and obtain a certificate, and then substitute a restored book in place of the unrestored book.

 

Unless you are doing this for your own piece of mind regarding books in your private collection...the less than desirables will find a way to exploit it.

[vaillant]

But again (since no one worried about my post ) – why the plastic case?

These are not coins, wouldn’t have been possible to devise a sealed container less cumbersome?

[Iceman399]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

 

This works based on the honesty of the seller. I could have a book checked for resto and obtain a certificate, and then substitute a restored book in place of the unrestored book.

 

Unless you are doing this for your own piece of mind regarding books in your private collection...the less than desirables will find a way to exploit it.

 

If someone was actively looking at doing this I have a few suggestions that would make what you are suggesting not possible to some degree.

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

Doesn't CCS offer a resto check only service?

 

They offer a screening service to determine resto or resto removal candidacy.

 

LINK

 

It doesn't appear that this would be a full restoration check by the way it's worded. Also, the fee structure based on value leaves a little to be desired.

 

The screening fee is 1% of the fair market value ($5 minimum) of the comic at the time of screening.

[Ditch Fahrenheit]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

 

This works based on the honesty of the seller. I could have a book checked for resto and obtain a certificate, and then substitute a restored book in place of the unrestored book.

 

Unless you are doing this for your own piece of mind regarding books in your private collection...the less than desirables will find a way to exploit it.

 

The majority of the collectors I've talked to want it as a simple aid to a transaction. In other words, the seller agrees to accept a return if the buyer submits the book for resto screening and it fails. So the honesty of the seller doesn't really come into question since it's a condition of the sale.

[thirdgreenham]

But again (since no one worried about my post ) – why the plastic case?

These are not coins, wouldn’t have been possible to devise a sealed container less cumbersome?

 

If there isn't already, there will be one eventually.

[vaillant]

But again (since no one worried about my post ) – why the plastic case?

These are not coins, wouldn’t have been possible to devise a sealed container less cumbersome?

 

If there isn't already, there will be one eventually.

Thanks for considering me…

[Iceman399]

But again (since no one worried about my post ) – why the plastic case?

These are not coins, wouldn’t have been possible to devise a sealed container less cumbersome?

 

If there isn't already, there will be one eventually.

 

Mini force fields

[joeypost]

I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

 

This works based on the honesty of the seller. I could have a book checked for resto and obtain a certificate, and then substitute a restored book in place of the unrestored book.

 

Unless you are doing this for your own piece of mind regarding books in your private collection...the less than desirables will find a way to exploit it.

 

The majority of the collectors I've talked to want it as a simple aid to a transaction. In other words, the seller agrees to accept a return if the buyer submits the book for resto screening and it fails. So the honesty of the seller doesn't really come into question since it's a condition of the sale.

 

I agree it will have it place...but it is not a cure all. Not even a slabbed book is a guarantee, as many have been sent back in and come back restored.

[Transplant]

 

I agree it's will have it place...but it is not a cure all. Not even a slabbed book is a guarantee as many have been sent back in and come back restored.