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Would you be okay with the company, CGC, buying and selling raw comics?

Started by thirdgreenham,

100 posts in this topic

VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted

I agree it's will have it place...but it is not a cure all. Not even a slabbed book is a guarantee as many have been sent back in and come back restored.

 

While not a guarantee (and I think we all agree that nothing is perfect), it does eliminate the 'majority' of resto that people miss. So even if 1 or 2 or 3 % sneak through, it's still much more assurance than nothing. And I think that's what people are looking for when they are looking for assurance.

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Ditch Fahrenheit

Ditch Fahrenheit

Posted
Posted
I get it, guys, but they never did guarantee any grade to begin with, right? And the grading process is supposed to be the same, so there shouldn't be any wild grade swings. No fewer than if you cracked a book out and did a straight resub.

 

If it catches on, they could offer grading of comics without going through the encapsulation process. They could charge $5-10 less, per book, or whatever they felt the retail cost of that hard case should be.

 

 

Who is really going to pay $5 - $10 less as opposed to just buying it slabbed? Seems like that would be a very small group of people.

 

That would be only an option for those who want it. Yes, the group is small, but there are some out there who only want CGC's resto check and opinion, and when they receive their slabs, they crack them right out.

 

Why not have an option for just resto check program in which books could be checked for resto by CGC and not slabbed. Mind you I would rather them fix their TAT's than add new services or gimmicks like fancy signature exclusive labels.

 

This.

 

In my local comic book collecting community in the Bay Area this has come up many times. Most collectors I know aren't very interested in professionally graded comics, but would be VERY interested in professional restoration checks as an aid in transactions. The bottom line here is they feel more comfortable with their ability to grade comics than their ability to detect restoration. In my opinion, this is a large, untapped market.

 

This works based on the honesty of the seller. I could have a book checked for resto and obtain a certificate, and then substitute a restored book in place of the unrestored book.

 

Unless you are doing this for your own piece of mind regarding books in your private collection...the less than desirables will find a way to exploit it.

 

The majority of the collectors I've talked to want it as a simple aid to a transaction. In other words, the seller agrees to accept a return if the buyer submits the book for resto screening and it fails. So the honesty of the seller doesn't really come into question since it's a condition of the sale.

 

I agree it's will have it place...but it is not a cure all. Not even a slabbed book is a guarantee as many have been sent back in and come back restored.

 

Totally agree. Errors occur with any service or product. In this case, I think it gives buyers and sellers more options and some degree of assurance (as Roy mentioned).

 

As a side note...the really interesting thing to me about this market segment (at least the people I've talked to), is that it's comprised mostly of collectors who don't particularly appreciate graded comics or CGC in general, but would be willing to pay CGC for this service. An example of growing the pie, not the share. :)

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the blob

the blob

Posted
Posted

I would have a problem with it (the original post). Maybe not as much on a new issue limited edition signed book enslabulated and SSd by CGC or something like that, but they already have a comic pressing division, etc., which creates some issues in my head too. pretty sure most certification companies don't dabble in selling, but i might be wrong.

 

As for a non-slabbed resto check...send book to CGC, CGC checks and then forwards it to the buyer....charge something less than encapsulation costs and do not assign a grade.... yes, that would be a good service i think. dunno if cgc wants to be the middle man like that.

 

of course, they get the opportunity to make money on the book multiple times because the certification from 5 years ago isn't worth much if you want to sell it again, so while they make less upfront, they may make a lot more over the life of the book

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revat

revat

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Posted

I can't believe there's so much discussion about this. CGC is a company who's main asset is it's integrity. To take an action which would even remotely cause a perception of a conflict of interest would be to risk the entire business.

 

Would a coin grading company sell coins? Could AFC ref's own teams in the NFC?

 

If you need to think about this for more than a second, please take an econ class or business class or *place reserved for something very insulting but probably best left unsaid*

 

 

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mikenyc

mikenyc

Posted
Posted

Why would they cannibalize their main revenue source? As Revat posted it's an unbelievable conflict of interest that should be dismissed on the initial contemplation. Their margins must be rather robust in slabbing and damaging goodwill for a lower margin business would be foolish.

 

Also, as a buyer, why would you pay for buying a book free of resto if you had no way of assuring the next buyer of the same thing?

 

Bad idea, period.

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thirdgreenham

thirdgreenham

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Posted
Why would they cannibalize their main revenue source? As Revat posted it's an unbelievable conflict of interest that should be dismissed on the initial contemplation. Their margins must be rather robust in slabbing and damaging goodwill for a lower margin business would be foolish.

 

Also, as a buyer, why would you pay for buying a book free of resto if you had no way of assuring the next buyer of the same thing?

 

Bad idea, period.

 

Just trying to wrap my head around this. I know there would be a perceived conflict of interest by some, but would there truly be a conflict of interest?

 

Here's my thoughts:

 

CGC continues being the third-party grading company for those that wish to have their books slabbed. They also offer a new service of grading, that doesn't hit the encapsulation stage. The books are returned in a mylar/full-back combo with tamper evident tape at the top to seal the deal. The cost is $5-10 less than their encapsulation service. Whether tons of people go for this idea or not, it doesn't matter right now. We're just talking. :D

 

On the new submission forms, they're now be a check-box for resto-check/raw/return. So, all people that want their books graded by CGC, checked for restoration, and return to them in mylars now have this option.

 

So, it's business as usual for the administrative staff that opens the packages. They enter all books into their system, and proceed to put the books in mylar with their internal UPC code.

 

The books travel down the hall to the resto-check room, then the grader's room. Again, as it's always been, the graders don't know who's books these are, and they would also have no idea if these books were for the RRR service or encapsulation. That doesn't concern them one bit, as their job is to grade them.

 

After they leave the grader's room, the next guy that handles them scans them to see if they are off to encapsulation or to be mylar/tamper taped.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So, after typing all of that out, it looks like CGC could add another service, if they wanted to. And that this conversation is now shifting away from whether they can sell their own raw books or not.

 

I did type this out:

 

A new arm from CCG sprouts out, let's call it CGC-RR, or CGC-RawRetail. The people that work at CGC-RR have knowledge and expertise in buying and selling and will not be affiliated with the graders. They'll work down the hall, just like CCS. ;)

 

...but after typing it, I see the perceived conflict of interest quite clearly. It really doesn't matter if it is a completely separate arm of CCG, the general public likely wouldn't believe that the books that CGC-RR sells didn't get preferential treatment.

 

I guess this begs the question, if we question CGC's integrity in regards to grading their raw books for sale, wouldn't we/shouldn't we question their integrity on the whole anonymity of comics as they go to the graders?

 

----if my post doesn't make sense, don't blame me, I'm tired. :shy:

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joeypost

joeypost

Posted
Posted

Oo

Why would they cannibalize their main revenue source? As Revat posted it's an unbelievable conflict of interest that should be dismissed on the initial contemplation. Their margins must be rather robust in slabbing and damaging goodwill for a lower margin business would be foolish.

 

Also, as a buyer, why would you pay for buying a book free of resto if you had no way of assuring the next buyer of the same thing?

 

Bad idea, period.

 

Just trying to wrap my head around this. I know there would be a perceived conflict of interest by some, but would there truly be a conflict of interest?

 

Here's my thoughts:

 

CGC continues being the third-party grading company for those that wish to have their books slabbed. They also offer a new service of grading, that doesn't hit the encapsulation stage. The books are returned in a mylar/full-back combo with tamper evident tape at the top to seal the deal. The cost is $5-10 less than their encapsulation service. Whether tons of people go for this idea or not, it doesn't matter right now. We're just talking. :D

 

On the new submission forms, they're now be a check-box for resto-check/raw/return. So, all people that want their books graded by CGC, checked for restoration, and return to them in mylars now have this option.

 

So, it's business as usual for the administrative staff that opens the packages. They enter all books into their system, and proceed to put the books in mylar with their internal UPC code.

 

The books travel down the hall to the resto-check room, then the grader's room. Again, as it's always been, the graders don't know who's books these are, and they would also have no idea if these books were for the RRR service or encapsulation. That doesn't concern them one bit, as their job is to grade them.

 

After they leave the grader's room, the next guy that handles them scans them to see if they are off to encapsulation or to be mylar/tamper taped.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So, after typing all of that out, it looks like CGC could add another service, if they wanted to. And that this conversation is now shifting away from whether they can sell their own raw books or not.

 

I did type this out:

 

A new arm from CCG sprouts out, let's call it CGC-RR, or CGC-RawRetail. The people that work at CGC-RR have knowledge and expertise in buying and selling and will not be affiliated with the graders. They'll work down the hall, just like CCS. ;)

 

...but after typing it, I see the perceived conflict of interest quite clearly. It really doesn't matter if it is a completely separate arm of CCG, the general public likely wouldn't believe that the books that CGC-RR sells didn't get preferential treatment.

 

I guess this begs the question, if we question CGC's integrity in regards to grading their raw books for sale, wouldn't we/shouldn't we question their integrity on the whole anonymity of comics as they go to the graders?

 

----if my post doesn't make sense, don't blame me, I'm tired. :shy:

 

:idea: they could get Zaid to smooth out the transition.

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newshane

newshane

Posted
Posted
I can't believe there's so much discussion about this. CGC is a company who's main asset is it's integrity. To take an action which would even remotely cause a perception of a conflict of interest would be to risk the entire business.

 

Would a coin grading company sell coins? Could AFC ref's own teams in the NFC?

 

If you need to think about this for more than a second, please take an econ class or business class or *place reserved for something very insulting but probably best left unsaid*

 

 

My thoughts exactly. Can't even believe this is being discussed.

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Badger

Badger

Posted
Posted
Why would they cannibalize their main revenue source? As Revat posted it's an unbelievable conflict of interest that should be dismissed on the initial contemplation. Their margins must be rather robust in slabbing and damaging goodwill for a lower margin business would be foolish.

 

Also, as a buyer, why would you pay for buying a book free of resto if you had no way of assuring the next buyer of the same thing?

 

Bad idea, period.

 

Just trying to wrap my head around this. I know there would be a perceived conflict of interest by some, but would there truly be a conflict of interest?

 

Here's my thoughts:

 

CGC continues being the third-party grading company for those that wish to have their books slabbed. They also offer a new service of grading, that doesn't hit the encapsulation stage. The books are returned in a mylar/full-back combo with tamper evident tape at the top to seal the deal. The cost is $5-10 less than their encapsulation service. Whether tons of people go for this idea or not, it doesn't matter right now. We're just talking. :D

 

On the new submission forms, they're now be a check-box for resto-check/raw/return. So, all people that want their books graded by CGC, checked for restoration, and return to them in mylars now have this option.

 

So, it's business as usual for the administrative staff that opens the packages. They enter all books into their system, and proceed to put the books in mylar with their internal UPC code.

 

The books travel down the hall to the resto-check room, then the grader's room. Again, as it's always been, the graders don't know who's books these are, and they would also have no idea if these books were for the RRR service or encapsulation. That doesn't concern them one bit, as their job is to grade them.

 

After they leave the grader's room, the next guy that handles them scans them to see if they are off to encapsulation or to be mylar/tamper taped.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So, after typing all of that out, it looks like CGC could add another service, if they wanted to. And that this conversation is now shifting away from whether they can sell their own raw books or not.

 

I did type this out:

 

A new arm from CCG sprouts out, let's call it CGC-RR, or CGC-RawRetail. The people that work at CGC-RR have knowledge and expertise in buying and selling and will not be affiliated with the graders. They'll work down the hall, just like CCS. ;)

 

...but after typing it, I see the perceived conflict of interest quite clearly. It really doesn't matter if it is a completely separate arm of CCG, the general public likely wouldn't believe that the books that CGC-RR sells didn't get preferential treatment.

 

I guess this begs the question, if we question CGC's integrity in regards to grading their raw books for sale, wouldn't we/shouldn't we question their integrity on the whole anonymity of comics as they go to the graders?

 

----if my post doesn't make sense, don't blame me, I'm tired. :shy:

Thirdgreenham, as you apparently have not met, let me introduce the CGC Boards. CGCBoards this is Thirdgreenham who apparently has never read a Friday thread in CG.

 

 

 

 

 

:jokealert:

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thirdgreenham

thirdgreenham

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Posted
I can't believe there's so much discussion about this. CGC is a company who's main asset is it's integrity. To take an action which would even remotely cause a perception of a conflict of interest would be to risk the entire business.

 

Would a coin grading company sell coins? Could AFC ref's own teams in the NFC?

 

If you need to think about this for more than a second, please take an econ class or business class or *place reserved for something very insulting but probably best left unsaid*

 

 

My thoughts exactly. Can't even believe this is being discussed.

 

Believe it, baby.

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VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
I can't believe there's so much discussion about this. CGC is a company who's main asset is it's integrity. To take an action which would even remotely cause a perception of a conflict of interest would be to risk the entire business.

 

Would a coin grading company sell coins? Could AFC ref's own teams in the NFC?

 

If you need to think about this for more than a second, please take an econ class or business class or *place reserved for something very insulting but probably best left unsaid*

 

 

The integrity is in the opinion.

 

And what Andy is proposing is no different than a respected dealer offering a grading opinion and then selling a book on consignment with them, which has happened a zillion times in the past half century.

 

As long as something doesn't compromise that grading opinion, I don't see the problem.

 

I'm not saying the idea is not without hurdles, but before encapsulation this is the way business was handled. A reputable source was sought out to appraise a collection and then sell it.

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