Pedigrees

[Slacker]

I am hoping some of of my fellow forumites could share their viewpoints on my pedigree question.

 

I am aware that there are several widely recognized and a few not so recognized pedigrees. I was hoping to gain some insight on three in particular. Bethlehem, Spokane, and River City. Particularly cover color and page quality and possibly a bit of history on all three. Lastly which of the three is the most desireable in the comic collecting community.

 

Please forgive me if this post has been addressed elsewhere and kindly point me in the right direction.

[Scrooge]

Most every one would recommend you read Matt Nelson's article on pedigrees that will contain all the information you're looking for.

 

First follow this link . Then select Pedigree from the top menu and Click here to view Pedigree Article (at bottom left of page). It's a fantastic read

[Slacker]

 

It's a fantastic read

 

Thank you for the link Scrooge

[Slacker]

It's a fantastic read

 

Didn't see any mention of Spokane or River city...

[Scrooge]

Maybe in the book? if it even comes out. The article was written a while back and needs to be updated or Matt does not recognize those collections as pedigrees? I am not the best person to answer that specific question really.

[sfilosa]

Don't know too much history, but I'm pretty sure that the Bethlehem's and Sponkane were discovered in the mid to late 90's.

 

As far as which one's are the most desirable, it's my opinion that Spokane's are. Most are in terrific shape and have excellent page quality. Metro has some Spokane books, and they are all priced a lot higher then similar Bethlehem issues.

 

ComicCollectors.net has a lot of info on the Bethlehem collection. And while I own a number of them, many have dust shadows on the back which diminishes the quality (if not the grade), to me.

 

Honestly know nothing about the River City, other then I need a copy to add to my pedigree collection. Seems like there are lots of doubles, of the issues that were in the collection.

[adamstrange]

CBM -- wonderful resource. I highly recommend purchasing a complete set.

 

[adamstrange]

There was a Spokane article in issue 74 or later. Mine are scattered or I'd have found it. There's also the original Fishler/Vinny ad in CBG.

[Scrooge]

Adam, a quick check shows the Spokane article is in CBM 73.

[Thegoldenage]

Don't know too much history, but I'm pretty sure that the Bethlehem's and Sponkane were discovered in the mid to late 90's.

 

As far as which one's are the most desirable, it's my opinion that Spokane's are. Most are in terrific shape and have excellent page quality. Metro has some Spokane books, and they are all priced a lot higher then similar Bethlehem issues.

 

ComicCollectors.net has a lot of info on the Bethlehem collection. And while I own a number of them, many have dust shadows on the back which diminishes the quality (if not the grade), to me.

 

Honestly know nothing about the River City, other then I need a copy to add to my pedigree collection. Seems like there are lots of doubles, of the issues that were in the collection.

 

What do you want to know about the Spokane Collection?

[adamstrange]

Adam, a quick check shows the Spokane article is in CBM 73.

 

Most helpful!

 

I flew right past the article after pausing to look through the color gallery.

[PedigreeMan]

Adam, a quick check shows the Spokane article is in CBM 73.

 

There's also a quick blurb about its discovery in CBM #58. It talks about how Fishler and Zurzulo paid "six figures" for the collection. This was, of course, after Haspel and Faraci raided it first, as described in the CBM #73 article.

 

As for the other pedigrees "Slacker" asks about:

 

Bethlehem is pretty much covered in CBM #7 as shown above, as well as Matt Nelson's ubiquitiously referred to article. In my oh-so-humble opinion, the only thing really outstanding about the pedigree is its size. The books I've seen from it have done little for me, but when you get into a collection consisting of five-figures worth of books, you have to sit up and take notice.

 

As for River City ...? What's the story behind that one? Anyone? I believe a number of the books have grease pencil on the covers and/or some nasty sun-burning along their edges. But they're still above-average books, from what I've seen. Nice colors on the covers and such....

 

Alan

[lou_fine]

CBM -- wonderful resource. I highly recommend purchasing a complete set.

 

 

 

Hmmm......

 

Collectibles or Investibles.....Funding Your Retirement with Comic Books.

 

Hopefully, Gene does not see this post or we will never hear the end of it.

 

The only thing funnier is if we saw this story on the cover of a Fortune or Money magazine.

[adamstrange]

CBM -- wonderful resource. I highly recommend purchasing a complete set.

 

 

 

Hmmm......

 

Collectibles or Investibles.....Funding Your Retirement with Comic Books.

 

Hopefully, Gene does not see this post or we will never hear the end of it.

 

The only thing funnier is if we saw this story on the cover of a Fortune or Money magazine.

 

Perhaps. But if you had "invested" in quality comics back then you'd have made out like a bandit. That's an objective observation, not conjecture. From my reading of Gene's posts, he seems to be most concerned about extrapolating from that trend indefinitely into the future. But perhaps he'll join us here and make this thread as "exciting" as the one over in the general forum.

[lou_fine]

Adam;

 

You've been collecting for awhile now.

 

Did you happen to pick up a copy of that softcover book that came out in the 80's (?) and I believed it was called Investing in Comics or something like that? Quite interesting and I believe the final conclusion was to invest in DC's, Timelys, EC's, along with the early key Marvels and to generally avoid everything else.

 

Must have been in the early or mid 80's because I believe it came out before the big explosion in back issue comic book prices which didn't really begin to take hold until the late 80's.

[adamstrange]

This one?

 

[adamstrange]

Don't know too much history, but I'm pretty sure that the Bethlehem's and Sponkane were discovered in the mid to late 90's.

 

As far as which one's are the most desirable, it's my opinion that Spokane's are. Most are in terrific shape and have excellent page quality. Metro has some Spokane books, and they are all priced a lot higher then similar Bethlehem issues.

 

ComicCollectors.net has a lot of info on the Bethlehem collection. And while I own a number of them, many have dust shadows on the back which diminishes the quality (if not the grade), to me.

 

Honestly know nothing about the River City, other then I need a copy to add to my pedigree collection. Seems like there are lots of doubles, of the issues that were in the collection.

 

What do you want to know about the Spokane Collection?

 

I'll bite. Here's a few questions that I have:

 

How did word of the collection get out? I've heard a couple different stories.

 

What exactly were they stored in? I've heard refrigerated, but do we know what and why they were put there and for how long?

 

Why and how were they being sold? I've heard "unusual" reasons. I've heard nephew/family members in NO were selling for real owner in Spokane.

[lou_fine]

This one?

 

 

Nope, not this one Adam.

 

It was a small white cover book with an imprint of one of the major financial buildings (possibly NYSE building?). The book approach the topic from a more serious financial point of view.

 

Since I am on holidays for the next two weeks, I'll look for it and post the exact title and name of the author when I find it.

[PedigreeMan]

This one?

 

 

Wow! A blast from the past! I've owned that book forever!

 

I don't recall there being any real investment advice in it, though. I seem to remember getting about as much info out of it as one would going through an Overstreet.

[AlphaOmega]

I'll give you my personnal, shortened version on the Spokane & River City pedigrees and when I have time, I'll dig up some more info and post it (if there is any interest).

 

As I recall, Metropolis Comics is largely responsible for finding the Spokane Pedigree. Around 97 or so, an article was listed in the Comics Buyers Guide describing the story behind this find as well as a list of available books. I promptly purchased a few of them at what was very resonable prices (near guide). From what I recall, the books were stored in old refrigerators and the collection mainly consisted of 50's horror & sci-fi books along with some very nice GA superhero titles. I'll see if I can dig up the article and ads that Metro ran and post them here. Vinny Z is also around on these boards so maybe he can add some background.

 

The River City pedigree is an interesting one. In 1998, I stumbled upon a real nice early DC book on ebay and won it. In the same week, I won a similarly nice late 50's horror book from a different seller in Arizona. As strange as it may sound, as soon as I put both books side by side, I knew they were from the same collection. I e-mailed both sellers (one lived in CA, the other in Arizona) and asked them if they knew each other and where these books came from. Neither answered but continued to list some high grade 50's horror & sci-fi books. I won a number of them from both sellers in the first few weeks before other ebayers 'discovered' these books. The prices quickly spiralled through the roof and the auctions disappeared after a few weeks (sellers were bought out?). One buyer especially stood out and is still going strong on ebay (cougar85). He outbid me at the last minute on a number of these books and I was so ticked that for awhile I would put in some punishment bids on his auctions.... Ummm, you're not on these boards, are you Cougar85?.

 

Fast forward a few months. I started to see some of the books that I didn't win reappear on ebay encased in slabs with the "River City" pedigree noted. I read an article somewhere shortly thereafter that described the story behind this collection. From what I recall, these books were divided up and sold through several venues, one that was mentioned was ebay. The article stated that there were probably several thousand if not more books in this collection but because of how it was disbursed, it was impossible to tell. I do recall the one ebay sellers alias was 'tinsoldier' and his real name was Charlie and was an antique dealer. I have both ebay sellers name & aliases written down along with a number of books that I won (some I resold) as well as books I didn't win. Every once in a while I'll see a River City book in a Heritage auction and kick myself! Back then I was very leary of bidding any where near guide on precode horror that was listed as 'near mint' let alone newer books. As it turns out many of these books were darned close to near mint.

 

I think I have 2 or 3 Spokane books and about a dozen River City books around. I scanned a few a month or so ago and posted them in the 'Raw Pedigree Books' thread. I'll dig up some info and post more later this week.

 

-Mike