Subscription Crease

[drsone]

Hi,

Could someone tell me what effect a subscription crease has on a comic's grade? What grades are this defect acceptable in?

[Aces]

If the book is in the VG range or lower it doesn't affect the grade.

 

Here's what I do with nicer books with sub-creases:

If its Fine then drop it to VG+.

If it's VFish then drop it to VGF.

If it's VF-NMish then call it Fine.

I don't think a book can "look NM" with one of those...

 

Mind you this is for clean sub-creases that don't break color in a major way, or have rolled up the book, or have collected dirt/soiling along the crease over the years.

[drsone]

That answered my question, thanks much!

[divad]

If the book is in the VG range or lower it doesn't affect the grade.

 

Here's what I do with nicer books with sub-creases:

If its Fine then drop it to VG+.

If it's VFish then drop it to VGF.

If it's VF-NMish then call it Fine.

I don't think a book can "look NM" with one of those...

 

Mind you this is for clean sub-creases that don't break color in a major way, or have rolled up the book, or have collected dirt/soiling along the crease over the years.

 

More or less a good guideline, except that technically, a book with a subscription crease can grade no higher than the VG "range", thus VG/FN 5.0 But, it is rare to find otherwise NM books with subscription creases, so exceptions should be made.

[Zanarkand]

I myself wouldn't call any comic with an obvious long crease higher than VG. I have graded comics as high as Fine though if the long crease mostly does not break color, and the book is otherwise high grade.

[jmg3637]

would these books be good candidates for pressing?

[rube11]

Ok, here is a very nice book with a "small" subscription type crease at the middle top and going down into the name "Daredevil" How would this affect the grade in your opinions. The rest of the book is extremely sharp.

 

Thanks,

Steve

 

[divad]

Rube,

 

A perfect example of an exception to the general rule

 

Clearly NOT a VG

 

-divad

[divad]

I myself wouldn't call any comic with an obvious long crease higher than VG. I have graded comics as high as Fine though if the long crease mostly does not break color, and the book is otherwise high grade.

It's hard to tell from your choice of words if you are agreeing with us, or not

[gozer]

>> technically, a book with a subscription crease can grade no

>> higher than the VG "range"

 

And CGC seems to adhere to this idea also.

 

>> it is rare to find otherwise NM books with subscription

>> creases

 

Probably true. Although ...

 

I had two wonderful looking GA Fiction House books that had mild

subscription creases -- the books laid flat, no color break on the crease,

you had to hold the book at just the right angle to even SEE the crease.

 

And oddly, if you picked the book up and held it with two hands on either

side, you could "feel" the crease more than you could see it. Nevertheless,

very sharp books.

 

Came back 5.0 and 5.5 -- and I was expecting 8.0 or better.

 

Thus we learn ...

 

gozer

-------------------------

Once something has been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.

[VintageComics]

>> technically, a book with a subscription crease can grade no

>> higher than the VG "range"

 

And CGC seems to adhere to this idea also.

 

>> it is rare to find otherwise NM books with subscription

>> creases

 

Probably true. Although ...

 

I had two wonderful looking GA Fiction House books that had mild

subscription creases -- the books laid flat, no color break on the crease,

you had to hold the book at just the right angle to even SEE the crease.

 

And oddly, if you picked the book up and held it with two hands on either

side, you could "feel" the crease more than you could see it. Nevertheless,

very sharp books.

 

Came back 5.0 and 5.5 -- and I was expecting 8.0 or better.

 

Thus we learn ...

 

gozer

 

That's where a person may buy the book and not the grade....obviously would be a nice filler for someone with a nice mid/hi grade run....I personally have started to enjoy nice mid grades that looker better than their grade because of just such technical flaws, rather than pay insane amounts of money for CGC'd 9's and better....

Roy.

 

 

[Zanarkand]

I myself wouldn't call any comic with an obvious long crease higher than VG. I have graded comics as high as Fine though if the long crease mostly does not break color, and the book is otherwise high grade.

It's hard to tell from your choice of words if you are agreeing with us, or not

 

I conditionally agree. An obvious book length crease would get a VG. A non-obvious book length mark of some kind that does not break color, or only breaks a little bit could grade higher.

 

The thing about subscription creases is that they were caused by Mr. Postman folding the whole book in half, so you get a crease on the front, some kind of fold/crease/mark on the back, and maybe on pages in between too.

 

On the DD above, that might be a flattened out bundling dent. It doesn't look much like a sub crease to me. I think it could be a 7.5, if that's just a production crease extending from the Matador's right knee and not something else.

[Aces]

Rube,

 

A perfect example of an exception to the general rule

 

Clearly NOT a VG

 

-divad

 

That is not a VG! *need a ditto graemlin*

 

Fine!

[rube11]

Actually, there isn't any other marks on the book. Not sure what your seeing by the Matadors knee.

 

Rube

[divad]

The thing about subscription creases is that they were caused by Mr. Postman folding the whole book in half, so you get a crease on the front, some kind of fold/crease/mark on the back, and maybe on pages in between too.

 

Don't blame the Postman, he had nothing to do with it. Sub books were folded at the printer / distributor, wrapped with brown paper and mailed. All Mr. Postman did was drop it in your mailbox.

[Nefaria]

Nope Diva's got it right, I got enough of them in the mail in the mid-sixties to know that. Funny thing is I have some that aren't distinguishable even in the light or a sensitive feel job. Must be the pressing over the years of being tightly packaged with bags and backerboards for forty years.

[Mr. Zipper]

I had two wonderful looking GA Fiction House books that had mild

subscription creases -- the books laid flat, no color break on the crease,

you had to hold the book at just the right angle to even SEE the crease.

 

Do comic book mail subscriptions date back this far?

 

I have a few older books with mild book length vertical bends that do not break color. I always presumed the bends were from being folded in half and inserted into a back pocket rather than a real subscription crease. In any case, I do not judge them as harshly as I would if the crease broke color, and I would grade them as high as 6.0/6.5 if the rest of the book was VF-ish.

[uclapeterg]

If the book is in the VG range or lower it doesn't affect the grade.

 

Here's what I do with nicer books with sub-creases:

If its Fine then drop it to VG+.

If it's VFish then drop it to VGF.

If it's VF-NMish then call it Fine.

I don't think a book can "look NM" with one of those...

 

Mind you this is for clean sub-creases that don't break color in a major way, or have rolled up the book, or have collected dirt/soiling along the crease over the years.

 

Same, except

 

Fine ---> VG

VF/NM or better ---> F or FVF

[Mister_Comics]

The highest I have seen is 8.5 on a folded comic. It was in absolute excellent shape other then the fold.

[rube11]

You know after all this I still haven't gotten any suggested grades from the book

 

Rube