lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 7 hours ago, kav said: 9 hours ago, lizards2 said: No it wasn't were you even collecting comics in the 70s? Yes - I began buying back issues in 1972. Senormac 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 9 hours ago, kav said: 9 hours ago, lizards2 said: No it wasn't WELL WHAT WAS THEN??? It was somewhere below a Fine and somewhere above a Good. When the grade "Very Good" came into existence, any book with a sub-crease had VG as a maximum grade, unlike today, where it seems like higher grades (up to VG/Fine to Fine-?? 5.0/5.5) are often assigned to books with sub creases. kav 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01TheDude Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 it always seems sort of counter intuitive to me that sub creases get hammered so hard compared to other types of things like date stamps, printing defects, and other production/distribution flaws. Seems like if the books were sent from the publisher directly and that action caused a subscription crease, it would be part of the process. I accept that is the way it is but it seems a little off somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, 01TheDude said: it always seems sort of counter intuitive to me that sub creases get hammered so hard compared to other types of things like date stamps, printing defects, and other production/distribution flaws. Seems like if the books were sent from the publisher directly and that action caused a subscription crease, it would be part of the process. I accept that is the way it is but it seems a little off somehow. Sub-creases wreck every, single page. Date stamps? Get serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
01TheDude Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 1 minute ago, lizards2 said: Sub-creases wreck every, single page. Date stamps? Get serious. I am not saying it is not damage-- just that the degree to which the grade gets hammered seems harsh. Date stamps are nothing-- agreed (I actually like them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 19 minutes ago, 01TheDude said: 22 minutes ago, lizards2 said: Sub-creases wreck every, single page. Date stamps? Get serious. I am not saying it is not damage-- just that the degree to which the grade gets hammered seems harsh. Date stamps are nothing-- agreed (I actually like them). Maybe that's why some people have loosened up on the straight VG call. I agree there has to be some way to differentiate between a sub-copy that has been hammered with other wear and one that was just removed from the mailer, and has no other wear. 01TheDude 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 17 hours ago, kav said: 17 hours ago, lizards2 said: No it wasn't WELL WHAT WAS THEN??? In my experience Mint books were what today might pass as anything from a VF range to a NM range, depending on the defects. It's why I consider VF range to still be high grade. There's no way what you posted was considered a Mint book. lizards2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kav Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, VintageComics said: In my experience Mint books were what today might pass as anything from a VF range to a NM range, depending on the defects. It's why I consider VF range to still be high grade. There's no way what you posted was considered a Mint book. Well there is a way, if you went to the LCS I went to in 1976. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 3 minutes ago, kav said: Well there is a way, if you went to the LCS I went to in 1976. Ah, OK. I thought you meant it as an accepted standard. Yeah, there are a lot of people who have no clue how to grade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kav Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, VintageComics said: Ah, OK. I thought you meant it as an accepted standard. Yeah, there are a lot of people who have no clue how to grade. yep I was just speaking about one LCS and their wacky grades. The worst grader I ever encountered though was an ebay seller. He had a coverless book listed as 'mint'. I messaged him wtf he rebutted that the part of the book that was still there, was mint. I replied that I had an Action #1 mint I would sell him. It consisted of a scrap of page 19 that was absolutely white pages!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFifthHorseman Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 4 minutes ago, kav said: I had an Action #1 mint I would sell him. It consisted of a scrap of page 19 that was absolutely white pages!!!! kav 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kav Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, TheFifthHorseman said: Lets see...price guide...action #1...mint......AHA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFifthHorseman Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 @kav Actually I only want it if you promise to send it via media mail in a manilla envelope with no backing board or cardboard support kav 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 26 minutes ago, VintageComics said: In my experience Mint books were what today might pass as anything from a VF range to a NM range, depending on the defects. It's why I consider VF range to still be high grade. Exactly my experience in a different country/region! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 29 minutes ago, lizards2 said: 56 minutes ago, VintageComics said: In my experience Mint books were what today might pass as anything from a VF range to a NM range, depending on the defects. It's why I consider VF range to still be high grade. Exactly my experience in a different country/region! If you've never heard of the story of John Verzyl purchasing the Mile High // Edger Church Marvel Comics #1, he went with the intention of finding defects on the book to haggle the price down. He ended up paying full asking price because he couldn't find a defect on the book. He figures it will grade a CGC 9.8 if he ever grades it. It's still raw. TheFifthHorseman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 1 minute ago, VintageComics said: 32 minutes ago, lizards2 said: 59 minutes ago, VintageComics said: In my experience Mint books were what today might pass as anything from a VF range to a NM range, depending on the defects. It's why I consider VF range to still be high grade. Exactly my experience in a different country/region! If you've never heard of the story of John Verzyl purchasing the Mile High // Edger Church Marvel Comics #1, he went with the intention of finding defects on the book to haggle the price down. He ended up paying full asking price because he couldn't find a defect on the book. He figures it will grade a CGC 9.8 if he ever grades it. It's still raw. Hopefully his grading has improved since the old Comic Heaven auctions, or it might be an 8.0. Larryw7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 23 minutes ago, lizards2 said: Hopefully his grading has improved since the old Comic Heaven auctions, or it might be an 8.0. I've never bought a raw book from him so I can't comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lizards2 Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, VintageComics said: 24 minutes ago, lizards2 said: Hopefully his grading has improved since the old Comic Heaven auctions, or it might be an 8.0. I've never bought a raw book from him so I can't comment. I never expected you to, as you have more class than I do. His grading skills have been discussed here before, usually in the "I will never buy from again" context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageComics Posted September 2, 2017 Share Posted September 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, lizards2 said: I never expected you to, as you have more class than I do. His grading skills have been discussed here before, usually in the "I will never buy from again" context. It's funny, we always talk comics when I see him and he just seems to be this happy go lucky, super positive, I love everyone dude who actually believes most of his slabbed books are undergraded. I guess we learn from trial and error what works and what doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senormac Posted September 4, 2017 Share Posted September 4, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 6:20 AM, lizards2 said: On 9/1/2017 at 9:09 PM, kav said: On 9/1/2017 at 9:07 PM, lizards2 said: No it wasn't WELL WHAT WAS THEN??? It was somewhere below a Fine and somewhere above a Good. When the grade "Very Good" came into existence, any book with a sub-crease had VG as a maximum grade, unlike today, where it seems like higher grades (up to VG/Fine to Fine-?? 5.0/5.5) are often assigned to books with sub creases. sub creases were the death blow to me. I hated them.....still do, and I agree..... no sub crease book can ever be a fine or better . Never Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
