An idea ... Input needed 3 3

[fmaz]

This whole idea comes from my inability to find a copy of New Thunderbolts #18.   That book is haunting me!

Hi folks and Happy New Year!

I wanted to run an idea by everyone... for something I've been thinking about over the last few days.  I think, perhaps, this might be a nice community-type service for the board... something that those of us who collect comics would enjoy and participate in from time to time.

However, what I'd like to do is lay out the basic idea and then get input from you all to see what you think.   I'll give you the details first, and ask the questions at the end.

Ok, basically, my idea is that we host a junk book swap.  Board members post their need list of relatively low-value books and then, where possible, send books to others to fill their needs.

Pretty simple, right?

I'd anticipate it working as follows:

1. Every participating member posts a need list, which they keep updated.
2. If another member has a book on someone's need list and wants to fill a certain member's need, he/she contacts that member, gets their address and sends them the book ... no charge for the book, nor for shipping.
3. One of them then posts the transaction in the thread so it becomes a public transaction
4. Every transaction is also recorded by both parties at the bottom of their need list.  They keep a list of all books sent, and all books received.  (probably in a spoiler tag, so chat is easier)
5.  The goal is that every member should attempt be at EVEN in terms of books sent/received... but when someone is at PLUS TWO no forum member will send them another book until  they improve their rating.
6. Anyone can participate.

My thought is that.. unlike past programs like Pay It Forward, etc... there's no community judgement here.  An individual has to CHOOSE to send someone a book.  No one CLAIMS anything.    So as long as people are honest with the tracking of their sends/receives (the only violation) there should be no issues.
If you come here looking for a copy of Amazing Spider-Man #14... this isn't for you.   If you're looking for a copy of Web of Spider-Man #14, though... someone might have one kicking around.   These are the kind of books that no one would ordinarly sell on their own in a sales thread... but that you have to go digging for at a LCS.  And when you can't find stuff you need, it's frustrating.   I just figured we all have a few piles of misfit books which I bet contain a few books that others here need for some particular reason, so I'd be happy to move them along, especially if I can track down that New Thunderbolts #18 -- for example -- which is the ONE book I need to complete the 174-book series run!

Anyway that's the basis of the idea.

So here are my questions for any of you who wish to discuss it further:

1.  Do you think this is a good idea? (If you answer "No"... you can skip the rest.)

2. Does it violate any board policies?

3. Do you think there are enough people who collect books who would be interested / participate to make it worthwhile to run?

4. Any additional rules / changes you think make sense?

5.  If you're still here at this point... What should we call it?

I don't want to jump the gun and start anything until we really get a sense that a) it'll work, b) there's enough interest and, of course c) there's no rules we'd be violating to do it.

So please chime in with your thoughts.  

If it's a terrible idea, all it will be is my first one of those for 2018.  Always good to get that out of the way anyway.

Frank

[Artboy99]

the idea has merit. It is likely to heavy a burden to be incorporated within the boards current software/database though. So who would create it, and then "police" it?

[Get Marwood & I]

You've put a lot of thought into this Frank and the spirit of it is sound. But I agree with artboy that it would be difficult to control and, if it had traffic, would need somone to own it and keep it in check. 

The boards are fairly quiet at the moment so you may have picked a bad time to ask the question. Maybe adding a poll would help get you more feedback?

My instinct tells me take up would be low. If the books are low value its hard to imagine why people wouldn't just buy them online if they wanted them. There are a few NT's 18's on ebay now for example. 

Apart from the warm glow of helping people out, who would really scan down a thread looking to see who wanted one of their spare Power Pack number 5's? 

How are you defining low value? There could be arguments on that if someone pushes their want list luck.

Anyway, I applaud your kind spirit, but I don't think it will fly, alas. 

[fmaz]

26 minutes ago, Marwood & I said:

You've put a lot of thought into this Frank and the spirit of it is sound. But I agree with artboy that it would be difficult to control and, if it had traffic, would need somone to own it and keep it in check. 

The boards are fairly quiet at the moment so you may have picked a bad time to ask the question. Maybe adding a poll would help get you more feedback?

My instinct tells me take up would be low. If the books are low value its hard to imagine why people wouldn't just buy them online if they wanted them. There are a few NT's 18's on ebay now for example. 

Apart from the warm glow of helping people out, who would really scan down a thread looking to see who wanted one of their spare Power Pack number 5's? 

How are you defining low value? There could be arguments on that if someone pushes their want list luck.

Anyway, I applaud your kind spirit, but I don't think it will fly, alas. 

My thought was books of $10-$15 max.  Otherwise we're talking about a sales thread.  Or then we get into the comparitive issues where member A took a book valued at $30 but only sent a book worth $5... THAT's where problems start.

I just figured that people are looking for books for various reasons and don't always have access to a good LCS, so this was a nice resource.    But if there isn't interest,  then it won't work.

@Artboy99 your question is a good one.  I'm not sure how we'd police it.  My hope is that if people self reported transactions and kept track of them in their wish lists, that's all we'd need.  People simply wouldn't send a book to someone who had a negative transation balance.

[01TheDude]

Spoiler

 

I'm sure there is interest but it seems anytime we try doing something like this on the board, along come a bunch of people who want to complain about how things are being done or that something wasn't fair. It is as if some folks love causing problems.

I think the problem with that whole pay it forward was that it wasn't about doing anything for the good-- just an arms race of let's make this huge offering and then have people get mad if someone offers something less. If you put a cap on it-- I guess it could work. Seems to me that the people who put up their list and have others who help find a book should be the ones who care about outcomes of various transactions. But history seems to repeat itself here and eventually someone has to declare someone a junk donkey or the like.

The example you give sounds like something copper age (not familiar with that particular book). That got me thinking-- and this might be a little too involved-- but what if there were four different groups set up-- each one in the various ages forums (GA, SA, Copper, modern) so that whoever has interest in those specific age ranges might do some book swapping around?

I only say that because you might be more likely to have similar interests at least at the comic age level than you would across the whole spectrum. Just an idea.

Kudos for putting this out there. I am pulling for you to get it going as it might be fun but am wary of the typical outcomes.

 

Edited January 4, 2018 by 01TheDude

[Artboy99]

32 minutes ago, fmaz said:

My thought was books of $10-$15 max.  Otherwise we're talking about a sales thread.  Or then we get into the comparitive issues where member A took a book valued at $30 but only sent a book worth $5... THAT's where problems start.

I just figured that people are looking for books for various reasons and don't always have access to a good LCS, so this was a nice resource.    But if there isn't interest,  then it won't work.

@Artboy99 your question is a good one.  I'm not sure how we'd police it.  My hope is that if people self reported transactions and kept track of them in their wish lists, that's all we'd need.  People simply wouldn't send a book to someone who had a negative transation balance.

There will always be those that take advantage of the kindness / willingness of others and abuse it.

[wolverine180]

This is a great idea. But as said above. I think there are people that will take complete advantage of someone when kindness occurs. I believe from what I read on here that there are plenty of actual comic book fans. But there are also plenty of people out to make a buck.  If people don't follow trends of what is actual price of book and only using the guide as judge , there can be a lot of people getting taken advantage for being nice or helpful. How many people know the series Adam the blue marvel 1-5? How many know is actually valuable? It guides for 3 bucks a piece but reality its a 50.00 set and sometimes 1 sells for 40 to 50 alone.  I have attached pic of recent sales. This is 1 of many many examples of under the radar books that people could put on there list of needs. Not trying to be negative at all. I think this is an amazing idea and very well intended.  And on the flip side. Using above example books. If someone did put that on there list not knowing its value, they might be scrutinized or judged ?  Not trying to be negative. Just helpful. If this was to happen. I would be up for joining. I have plenty of doubles and many needs. 

Edited January 4, 2018 by wolverine180
Forgot to add picture

[fmaz]

1 hour ago, wolverine180 said:

This is a great idea. But as said above. I think there are people that will take complete advantage of someone when kindness occurs. I believe from what I read on here that there are plenty of actual comic book fans. But there are also plenty of people out to make a buck.  If people don't follow trends of what is actual price of book and only using the guide as judge , there can be a lot of people getting taken advantage for being nice or helpful. How many people know the series Adam the blue marvel 1-5? How many know is actually valuable? It guides for 3 bucks a piece but reality its a 50.00 set and sometimes 1 sells for 40 to 50 alone.  I have attached pic of recent sales. This is 1 of many many examples of under the radar books that people could put on there list of needs. Not trying to be negative at all. I think this is an amazing idea and very well intended.  And on the flip side. Using above example books. If someone did put that on there list not knowing its value, they might be scrutinized or judged ?  Not trying to be negative. Just helpful. If this was to happen. I would be up for joining. I have plenty of doubles and many needs. 

 

As as few of you have correctly mentioned... no matter what we try, people will attempt (and succeed) to game the system for personal profit.  The question you have to ask is whether or not you simply don't even attempt to do something because that will eventually happen.

As for people requesting under the radar high value books?  Well, first of all... someone else would have to choose to send it to them, so it's not like they can actively coerce someone to give them the book.  They won't even know a particular member HAS the book, you know?  But if you're saying is the mere ASKING for a high value book a violation?  I wouldn't think so but I don't know.

It makes me think that maybe people could have books that they would be willing to TRADE for other books, which would allow higher value books to exchange hands... but THAT seems like an invitation for trouble.  

I just thought the "hey you need some books to fill a run?"  ... "you need a book to complete an artist set?"  ... "you collect books with fish on the cover"?  etc...   Whatever random acts of generosity won't break people's banks on a day to day basis.

But from the limit response and the number of views, I'm thinking there isn't the appetite for this. Which is fine, and exactly why I'm glad I asked for input.  I thought/think it was worth exploring anyway.

 

 

[wolverine180]

Wish I could come up with a viable suggestion as to how to make this work without somehow monitoring this in some fashion. I think a lot of people would have a good honor system and use this for good intentions. But as soon as someone can find a way to manipulate the situation it would in my opinion run people out. 

[flikhype]

I think the idea is great but require a few tweak. I think it is real tough to ask for things for free from strangers.  Many of us may have known each other for years, but have never met in person. And with the natural guarding instinct of an average human being, it gets even tougher to convince one or believing in one that he/she really need a book to fill a collection.

What if you gift a few books to a fella and later finds that he's listing for sale?

Perhaps we could look into starting a thread for Books Xchange.  With consideration that the books are of lower value, as much as there is a list we want, we should have a list we don't want. Why not bring them out to trade?

With each managing own listing. Under each listing comes 2 categories - Books wanted, Books up for trade according to exchange ratio.

For example:

Books Wanted

Book A

Book B

 

Books for Trade (1:1)

Book A

Book B

 

Books for Trade (1:2)

Book A

Book B

 

and so on....  How's that?

[aszumilo]

What about making it a trade type of scenario?  Where people put up their want lists, then someone would work a trade for one of their needed books for one of the other persons needed books.  This way there wouldn't be a +/- situation, it would be a 1 for 1 straight trade.  And possibly, there could be a 3 way trade.

[01TheDude]

Edited January 4, 2018 by 01TheDude

[oakman29]

Cool idea!  Food for thought.

[fmaz]

56 minutes ago, 01TheDude said:

guess I am on ignore -- oh well, good luck with that

I swear I wasn't ignoring you... although you now count officially as the first person to have their feelings hurt by this idea.... so... congrats on that.  That's a real feather in your cap.

[fmaz]

58 minutes ago, aszumilo said:

What about making it a trade type of scenario?  Where people put up their want lists, then someone would work a trade for one of their needed books for one of the other persons needed books.  This way there wouldn't be a +/- situation, it would be a 1 for 1 straight trade.  And possibly, there could be a 3 way trade.

I love the trade idea... just afraid that gets really scary and now you really need monitoring.  But I mean, if both/all people agree to it... why not?  Maybe we could even count a trade as a same things as a gift in terms of it being a positive transaction.... the only difference being that a trade would be a positive transaction for BOTH parties?

 

[01TheDude]

12 minutes ago, fmaz said:

I swear I wasn't ignoring you... although you now count officially as the first person to have their feelings hurt by this idea.... so... congrats on that.  That's a real feather in your cap.

blow me

[skypinkblu]

I think if you just put the book in your profile, people who have it will let you know.

Trading is better in person, I think.  Some people are looking for very high grade examples and if they are not happy with what they get, then it creates problems.

 

[fmaz]

4 minutes ago, skypinkblu said:

I think if you just put the book in your profile, people who have it will let you know.

Trading is better in person, I think.  Some people are looking for very high grade examples and if they are not happy with what they get, then it creates problems.

 

Yeah, Sha, I think I agree with that.   As much as trading SOUNDS good... it would just be easier to avoid it.

 

[DeadOne]

14 minutes ago, fmaz said:

1 hour ago, aszumilo said:

What about making it a trade type of scenario?  Where people put up their want lists, then someone would work a trade for one of their needed books for one of the other persons needed books.  This way there wouldn't be a +/- situation, it would be a 1 for 1 straight trade.  And possibly, there could be a 3 way trade.

I love the trade idea... just afraid that gets really scary and now you really need monitoring.  But I mean, if both/all people agree to it... why not?  Maybe we could even count a trade as a same things as a gift in terms of it being a positive transaction.... the only difference being that a trade would be a positive transaction for BOTH parties?

There's a Want To Buy section so it seems like it would be pretty easy for a new "Wanting To Trade" or "Willing To Trade" section to be placed along side of it.
People could post their trade offerings along with their want lists and see how it goes.
Policing seems like it would be no more difficult than any other board transaction. Most of it would take place through PM and if one party didn't follow through, let the probation discussions begin.

[01TheDude]

It is almost shocking to me that there isn't a Trading post forum. Most of us started out in the hobby trading our books with buddies.

WANT IT

GOT IT TO TRADE

Two lists-- let people throw offers at each other.

Not to shoot down this idea (it can work and be fun too) but not sure I understand why we have a selling forum, and wanted to buy forum--- but no trading forum