AZ News, "unrestored" Hulk#1 bought from LCS was actually restored, buyer angry 1 1

[MichelleCohen]

Hey everyone - this is my local LCS for the last few decades. I can tell you with 100% honesty, these are incredibly honorable people, who are one of the best comic book stores in the country. I have purchased numerous high-end books from them that CGC has even graded higher. There has NEVER been anything shady with these folks - they are loved in this community as small business owners. 

This man seems to be out for retribution and is simply trying to defame them. Please read the entire statement at the end of the news article - they tried to mitigate any issues, and make this customer happy, but he refused. 

The statement truly shows that this man is out for revenge. As one of their loyal customers for decades, I know them - this guy doesn't. 

[DavidTheDavid]

Time for this community to do what it does best: Thinking for other people!

No need to have more than cursory knowledge of the situation. No need to have anything akin to situational insight or intimacy with a case. Just grab a few scraps of information and weave together a tapestry of woulda coulda shoulda's!

 

[kav]

27 minutes ago, MichelleCohen said:

Hey everyone - this is my local LCS for the last few decades. I can tell you with 100% honesty, these are incredibly honorable people, who are one of the best comic book stores in the country. I have purchased numerous high-end books from them that CGC has even graded higher. There has NEVER been anything shady with these folks - they are loved in this community as small business owners. 

This man seems to be out for retribution and is simply trying to defame them. Please read the entire statement at the end of the news article - they tried to mitigate any issues, and make this customer happy, but he refused. 

The statement truly shows that this man is out for revenge. As one of their loyal customers for decades, I know them - this guy doesn't. 

Ok so why wont he refund a guy who got an undisclosed restoration book then?  Giving store credit for a high dollar book fiasco wouldn't make me 'happy'.

Edited August 14, 2018 by kav

[MichelleCohen]

17 minutes ago, kav said:

Ok so why wont he refund a guy who got an undisclosed restoration book then?  Giving store credit for a high dollar book fiasco wouldn't make me 'happy'.

If you read the statement, you will see that the owners already paid the consignor. This guy came back a full month later to complain when he reviewed the book in person himself. 

[kav]

26 minutes ago, MichelleCohen said:

If you read the statement, you will see that the owners already paid the consignor. This guy came back a full month later to complain when he reviewed the book in person himself. 

That is irrelevant-the customer is not on the hook for the deal between the consignor and the shop-he gave his money to the shop-they are responsible for giving it back.  Then they can take it up with the consignor-small claims court or whatever.  Thats part of the risk when you deal in consignments.  I find it hard to believe that if this happened to you and you spent thousands on a book and it turned out it was restored and only worth about half that you'd just say gee oh well-the store is top notch!  It's easy to discard someone else's mishap but if it was your wallet-

Edited August 14, 2018 by kav

[AJD]

2 minutes ago, MichelleCohen said:

If you read the statement, you will see that the owners already paid the consignor. This guy came back a full month later to complain when he reviewed the book in person himself. 

This might be a good time to not defend the indefensible.

[conan09279]

I had a similar issue recently.  My brother lives in TN and he came across an unslabbed ASM#1 in his local comic shop.  He called and sent me photos of the book.  I talked with the owner and he stated that the books were unrestored.  I ended up buying it over the phone along with an ASM#3.  Mind you, at the time I was very new to the hobby.  A year goes by and I find out about these boards.  I post a pic of the ASM#3 and some of the boardies point out that its been color touched.  I call the owner, he claims not to have known, but agrees to a refund.  Things are good.  At the same time, I sent the ASM#1 to CGC.  Guess what - comes back trimmed.  Things are not so good.  So I call the owner again and this time he tells me he cant do anything.  He didn't know and the ASM#1 is too much to refund.  Also, a year has gone by.  At the end of the day, I blame myself and chalk it up to lesson learned.  Just wish I had found out about these boards before shelling out money for what turned out to be two restored books.  Now I need to upgrade ASM#1.  

[The Lions Den]

8 hours ago, NoMan said:

not sure i understand here. store broke opened the slab, kept CGC's printed grade label, kept book in inner well but assigned their own grade to it?

[kav]

3 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

They're incredibly honorable though-"Michelle" said so.

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, MichelleCohen said:

Hey everyone - this is my local LCS for the last few decades. I can tell you with 100% honesty, these are incredibly honorable people, who are one of the best comic book stores in the country. I have purchased numerous high-end books from them that CGC has even graded higher. There has NEVER been anything shady with these folks - they are loved in this community as small business owners. 

This man seems to be out for retribution and is simply trying to defame them. Please read the entire statement at the end of the news article - they tried to mitigate any issues, and make this customer happy, but he refused. 

The statement truly shows that this man is out for revenge. As one of their loyal customers for decades, I know them - this guy doesn't. 

Do you work for the store, run it, or own it?  A suggestion. Kill 2 birds with one stone. Give the buyer a refund and a $100 store credit for the missed restoration mistake. You'll solve a PR problem, a potential civil one and while I understand that probably doesn't sound like fun, here's the upshot. The benefit. You'll not only have done the right thing and remedied your error in representing the book as unrestored, but you'll come out ahead. Way ahead.  In PR and financially! Have the book graded by the CGC. According to eye witness accounts I've read here, the "book looks like approx. a 3.5". Now if this is true, and it slabs 3.5, even with the restoration, you will come ahead at least $2000 on the worst of ebay days. Give back the $5500 + $100 sore credit = about $5550 and you'll get $7500 on ebay for a restored CGC 3.5, minus the fees. Even if it grades at least 2.5, after the fees, you'll still come ahead!

Take the book back, refund the buyer, and do what you should have done in the first place to make the most $$$ on it. CGC it, then right to ebay, fresh out of the box.

Or, if you're not in a hurry to recoup your $$$, list it on Link or Connect for $10,000 and field offers, which are the sales venues I'd go with.

Edited August 14, 2018 by James J Johnson

[kav]

15 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

Do you work for the store, run it, or own it?  A suggestion. Kill 2 birds with one stone. Give the buyer a refund and a $100 store credit for the missed restoration mistake. You'll solve a PR problem, a potential civil one and while I understand that probably doesn't sound like fun, here's the upshot. The benefit. You'll not only have done the right thing and remedied your error in representing the book as unrestored, but you'll come out ahead. Way ahead.  In PR and financially! Have the book graded by the CGC. According to eye witness accounts I've read here, the "book looks like approx. a 3.5". Now if this is true, and it slabs 3.5, even with the restoration, you will come ahead at least $2000 on the worst of ebay days. Give back the $5500 + $100 sore credit = about $5550 and you'll get $7500 on ebay for a restored CGC 3.5, minus the fees. Even if it grades at least 2.5, after the fees, you'll still come ahead!

Take the book back, refund the buyer, and do what you should have done in the first place to make the most $$$ on it. CGC it, then right to ebay, fresh out of the box.

Or, if you're not in a hurry to recoup your $$$, list it on Link or Connect for $10,000 and field offers, which are the sales venues I'd go with.

Wait if the book is worth $7500 and the buyer got it for $5500-whats the complaint here?  Why doesnt he just sell it on ebay?  I'm confused.

[James J Johnson]

56 minutes ago, kav said:

Wait if the book is worth $7500 and the buyer got it for $5500-whats the complaint here?  Why doesnt he just sell it on ebay?  I'm confused.

The last 1.5 restored sale noted on GP in March is $5100. Now get this. In July, 2018, a restored and trimmed, incomplete CGC 0.5 sold for $2800!  A restored, complete, non-trimmed 2.5 would bring more than $5500. A 3.0 or 3.5 would fetch significantly more. The store owner was foolish to sell it for $5500. The buyer is foolish to want to return it. And to compound matters, the store owner is now even ridiculously remiss as a businessman to refuse to take it back, "You want to give me back a $20 bill that I mistakenly sold to you for $12? No way. Forget it! All sales final".

[kav]

2 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

The last 1.5 restored sale noted on GP in March is $5100. Now get this. In July, 2018, a restored and trimmed, incomplete CGC 0.5 sold for $2800!  A restored, complete, non-trimmed 2.5 would bring more than $5500. A 3.0 or 3.5 would fetch significantly more. The store owner was foolish to sell it for $5500. The buyer is foolish to want to return it. And to compound matters, the store owner is now even ridiculously remiss as a businessman to refuse to take it back, "You want to give me back a $20 bill that I mistakenly sold to you for $12? No way. Forget it! All sales final".

Truly baffling.  I think its the human instinct to say 'no' when someone wants you to do something.  Like if someone walked up to me and said want this $100 bill?  I would say no.

[kav]

Another baffling feature is the owner didnt know it was restored-which makes it a around $15,000 book-why was he selling it for $5500?  

[James J Johnson]

5 minutes ago, kav said:

Truly baffling.  I think its the human instinct to say 'no' when someone wants you to do something.  Like if someone walked up to me and said want this $100 bill?  I would say no.

This might be a case where the buyer feels he was defrauded. "The seller said it was unrestored and it is so I want to return it. He can't put one over on me and get away with it". But in this case, even if the seller willfully misrepresented the book, knew it was restored, and was trying to get over on the buyer, in fact, due to market values of a ragingly hot Hulk 1, a book constantly trending up in value, month after month, the only one the seller put one over on is himself! He undersold it by a bunch, even with the resto, which does not as critically affect the value of restored books vs unrestored in these lower grades, the same way it drastically widens the gap of values, restored vs. unrestored in mid and high grades.

Edited August 14, 2018 by James J Johnson

[James J Johnson]

3 minutes ago, kav said:

Another baffling feature is the owner didnt know it was restored-which makes it a around $15,000 book-why was he selling it for $5500?  

Going by a published price guide? Maybe the seller has never seen a GP chart.

[kav]

2 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

Going by a published price guide? Maybe the seller has never seen a GP chart.

I'm just doubling your estimated value for a restored book.  Mileage may vary.

[James J Johnson]

1 minute ago, kav said:

I'm just doubling your estimated value for a restored book.  Mileage may vary.

I know every book is different, but IMO, the values for restored vs. unrestored on books that average 2.5 to 3.5 is pretty close, maybe 70% for restored at the widest part of that ratio, unless trimmed, which lowers it some. As you get into the FN range, then the ratio gets into the 50% range restored vs. unrestored, on average, exceptions made of course for the amount of work and eye appeal factoring in one way or the other.

[revat]

4 hours ago, TheVonGallop said:

15 hours ago, MichelleCohen said:

Hey everyone - this is my local LCS for the last few decades. I can tell you with 100% honesty, these are incredibly honorable people, who are one of the best comic book stores in the country. I have purchased numerous high-end books from them that CGC has even graded higher. There has NEVER been anything shady with these folks - they are loved in this community as small business owners. 

This man seems to be out for retribution and is simply trying to defame them. Please read the entire statement at the end of the news article - they tried to mitigate any issues, and make this customer happy, but he refused. 

The statement truly shows that this man is out for revenge. As one of their loyal customers for decades, I know them - this guy doesn't. 

Post a picture of yourself with the store owner if you want some credibility.

or some pics/receipts of books you bought from them that graded higher at CGC.

 

Until we can explain WHY IT WASN'T GRADED to begin with, I would have a tough time getting on the side of the LCS. 

[James J Johnson]

1 hour ago, revat said:

or some pics/receipts of books you bought from them that graded higher at CGC.

 

Until we can explain WHY IT WASN'T GRADED to begin with, I would have a tough time getting on the side of the LCS. 

Not just a few books. "Numerous" books that graded higher! God only knows how many as there are just too many examples for her to even offer a number!  "Michelle" is overselling this inversely proportionate to how she undersold the Hulk 1.    

Edited August 14, 2018 by James J Johnson