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THE MARVELS starring Brie Larson, Iman Vellani and Teyonna Parris (2023)
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Started by paperheart,

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

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On 11/13/2023 at 2:00 PM, N7 M31 said:

A quick reminder to myself ...and anyone else who might need it

 

On 11/13/2023 at 2:32 PM, namisgr said:

I should have paid heed to your post.  My bad.  It won't happen again.

I mean, we all know what he is but his kind should never go unchecked.   I stand by what I said about and to him earlier. 

The issue with debating the messaging is that some forget that with many of these stories from yesteryear, what is now seen as common sense was taboo at the time that they were first making waves. 

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Buzzetta

Buzzetta

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On 11/13/2023 at 4:12 PM, Mr Sneeze said:

Totally serious! It was also surprising to find out that not all frenchmen were short but great cooks and that not all rabbits were rascals.

You dooooooooon't saaaaaay...... 

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RedRaven

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Just spit-balling here...

Maybe the genre is stale, the formula is tired, the characters do not have mass appeal, and phase 4 and 5 were a narrative mess giving no compelling framework to tell this story within. I think the number of movie-goers that would see/not-see this movie because of some overriding ideology is vanishingly small when compared to the number of people who just wish to be entertained. 

 

 

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paqart

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On 11/13/2023 at 5:38 PM, RedRaven said:

Just spit-balling here...

Maybe the genre is stale, the formula is tired, the characters do not have mass appeal, and phase 4 and 5 were a narrative mess giving no compelling framework to tell this story within. I think the number of movie-goers that would see/not-see this movie because of some overriding ideology is vanishingly small when compared to the number of people who just wish to be entertained. 

 

The problem with the explanation you provide is that it assumes that the appeal of MCU movies is related to genre, formula, and characters. Those are the superficial trappings of the movies but all are a distraction from what made the films attractive in the first place, and what led to the recent spate of failing or under-performing films. In reverse order:

  1. Characters: if this was the initial appeal, none of the films would have been as successful as they were. Compare the MCU to earlier superhero movies. Some were successful, some not, and at differing levels for sequels (see Superman or Spider-Man). The MCU films had to reach beyond the characters to appeal to the audience they captured. They did this with the stories, which were about morals in conflict. Iron Man: betrayal, Thor: obedience, Captain America: loyalty, Doctor Strange: humility. Later films were about getting from point A to point B, with a few scrapes in between.
  2. Formula: The MCU "formula" of putting universal themes and morals center stage worked fine for about twenty movies in a row. If they hadn't changed the formula, they have continued to enjoy the same level of success.
  3. Genre: Every supposedly dead genre is always one good movie away from being resuscitated. Witness Star Wars and how it reinvigorated sci-fi.

You'd be surprised how many people don't like to eat poisoned food, no matter how minute the quantity. I readily admit that the proportion of offensive to perfectly acceptable moments in recent MCU films is maybe 1% of the screen time, but that's enough to make me not want to sit there waiting for that one percent to reveal itself. I like roller coasters, but wouldn't ride them at all if I knew that each ride would result in a random small cut to my body somewhere. Who needs the hassle?

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Bosco685

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image.thumb.png.10aa6ef3168a17c4bd757be645ae2643.png

‘The Marvels’ Meltdown: Disney MCU Posts Lowest B.O. Opening Ever At $47M — What Went Wrong

Quote

No, The Marvels meltdown isn’t about superhero fatigue. It’s about Disney’s overexposure of the Marvel Cinematic Universe brand on Disney+, and those moth holes are beginning to show: Keep what’s meant for the cinema in cinemas, and keep what’s meant for in-homes in the home. Meaning, this whole crossover streaming-into-film master plan isn’t working, nor is it really connected in a jaw-dropping way, and with Ms. Marvel not being one of the OTT services better series (ala WandaVision and Loki season one), there’s a whole quad of fans who either didn’t catch Ms Marvel, or who were too turned off by it that they sure as heck don’t want to see The Marvels. Per PostTrak, 64% of the The Marvels audience have Disney+.

 

But more to the point, Marvel Studios, The Marvels — with its crossover streaming series blah-blah — looks like it was built to be seen in homes, not to get audiences off the couch.

 

Edited by Bosco685
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jsilverjanet

jsilverjanet

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On 11/13/2023 at 5:06 PM, Bosco685 said:

image.thumb.png.10aa6ef3168a17c4bd757be645ae2643.png

‘The Marvels’ Meltdown: Disney MCU Posts Lowest B.O. Opening Ever At $47M — What Went Wrong

 

I agree it's mainly about fatigue, but some people want to write the narrative about how a type of content is being forced and this is the general public rejecting it

the problem is when Endgame ended, they were left with b level characters, and instead of building them up, they just threw them against the wall

they have no original ideas, the ideas they have are all taken from previous storylines, existing comic stories and made to fit in a universe that has been painted into a corner based on what they created from the start

no mutants, no FF

they have created a bigger mess with the multiverse

so let me hear what they should have done after endgame

what are the movies they should have made? because none of the ones that Disney/Marvel made worked - same for the tv shows - what should they have done instead?

what was left to choose from?

BP2 was going to fail without it's star and they probably should have scrapped it

They doubled down on Thor because of the love for the previous movie, which I thought was a mistake for the character

they made bad decisions on the movies for 4 and now 5 - it's a complete mess from a creative story and cohesive world

and it's only going to get worse

what outside of FF/X-men does anyone look forward to? Kang?

 

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Bosco685

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On 11/13/2023 at 6:45 PM, jsilverjanet said:

I agree it's mainly about fatigue, but some people want to write the narrative about how a type of content is being forced and this is the general public rejecting it

the problem is when Endgame ended, they were left with b level characters, and instead of building them up, they just threw them against the wall

they have no original ideas, the ideas they have are all taken from previous storylines, existing comic stories and made to fit in a universe that has been painted into a corner based on what they created from the start

no mutants, no FF

they have created a bigger mess with the multiverse

so let me hear what they should have done after endgame

what are the movies they should have made? because none of the ones that Disney/Marvel made worked - same for the tv shows - what should they have done instead?

what was left to choose from?

BP2 was going to fail without it's star and they probably should have scrapped it

They doubled down on Thor because of the love for the previous movie, which I thought was a mistake for the character

they made bad decisions on the movies for 4 and now 5 - it's a complete mess from a creative story and cohesive world

and it's only going to get worse

what outside of FF/X-men does anyone look forward to? Kang?

I wonder if it came down to no central link across all the stories from the studio that made that its biggest marketing message how Kevin Feige had this huge chalkboard spelling everything out for years to come.

If there was a central plan to link this all together, Phase IV and Phase V are not driving that point home. No matter how much money Multiverse of Madness and Wakanda Forever made.

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Buzzetta

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On 11/13/2023 at 6:48 PM, Bosco685 said:

I wonder if it came down to no central link across all the stories from the studio that made that its biggest marketing message how Kevin Feige had this huge chalkboard spelling everything out for years to come.

If there was a central plan to link this all together, Phase IV and Phase V are not driving that point home. No matter how much money Multiverse of Madness and Wakanda Forever made.

This is a major issue.  For the first twenty movies we were of the understanding by the time Avengers rolled around in 2011 that everything was leading to something.   When that credits tag dropped and Thanos was revealed, we swooned.  They were leading us to 'something'.  The Marvel storytelling has created a disjointed unorganized effort (cough Star Wars sequels) where it is no longer must see but how much can I miss and still get the idea of what is going on.

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