Label Modifications

[Ze-man]

 

What bugs me is when companies try and make things as complicated as possible, just to serve their own incestuous needs.

 

 

What lies at the heart of this is one company setting the standard for an entire market to deal with. (and many people not liking it.)

CGC is the benchmark, and until somebody comes along and knocks them off the hill they will set the rules for how the game is played, not just for how they choose to sell THEIR product(which is their right), but the inevitable trickledown effect it will no doubt have on every aspect of buying, selling, and grading in our hobby for years to come forcing everyone to comply, or be left behind.

 

Ze-

[nearmint]

Call my "scared of change" comment a "strawman" all you like,

 

But it is a strawman, and something supporters of a plan use to try and slam down logical debate.

 

I remember being on a few re-org committees where employees were asked to take significant pay cuts under the new job descriptions. When they didn't, the in charge always went back to the same old "they're just scared of change" BS.

 

They weren't "scared of change", these people just saw no use in going along with a plan that was pure madness. In the end, most employees quit and got jobs at higher-than their old salary, the department was in a shambles, and a few big guys got canned.

 

I guess they ended up being "scared of change" too.

 

Again, you're focusing on my "afraid of change" comment rather than addressing the reality that newbies accept change far easier than people who are used to how things have been done in the past. Your and awe4one's concern for newbies is misplaced.

 

And, come on, when I used the analogy of a change in a buiness environment, I meant bringing in a new manager, or a shift in a long-standing policy, not asking employees to take signifcant pay cuts. That's apples and oranges.

[Mr. Zipper]

CGC is the benchmark, and until somebody comes along and knocks them off the hill they will set the rules for how the game is played...

 

Actually, the ONLY power CGC has is that which dealers and collectors have willingly handed over to them.

 

The guest couldn't have taken over the house if we didn't invite him in...

[Ze-man]

CGC is the benchmark, and until somebody comes along and knocks them off the hill they will set the rules for how the game is played...

 

Actually, the ONLY power CGC has is that which dealers and collectors have willingly handed over to them.

 

The guest couldn't have taken over the house if we didn't invite him in...

 

I never said HOW they got that power.. just that they have it.

[Mr. Zipper]

CGC is the benchmark, and until somebody comes along and knocks them off the hill they will set the rules for how the game is played...

 

Actually, the ONLY power CGC has is that which dealers and collectors have willingly handed over to them.

 

The guest couldn't have taken over the house if we didn't invite him in...

 

I never said HOW they got that power.. just that they have it.

 

Yes, but it can be taken back at any time... if enough people only had the will.

[Ze-man]

CGC is the benchmark, and until somebody comes along and knocks them off the hill they will set the rules for how the game is played...

 

Actually, the ONLY power CGC has is that which dealers and collectors have willingly handed over to them.

 

The guest couldn't have taken over the house if we didn't invite him in...

 

I never said HOW they got that power.. just that they have it.

 

Yes, but it can be taken back at any time... if enough people only had the will.

 

As long as $$$ is involved.. well I guess we both know where this is going.

 

[awe4one]

Not true, collectors who want to avoid restored comics simply need to avoid apparent labels. That's it. They don't need to consider the numbering system at all.

 

And Apparent labels are different from unstored labels how? Oh yeah...a small notation under the grade...what...that may not be right...

 

Some long-time collectors still don't fully understand this new system...but it's it'll be totally easy for newbies? I don't think so...

 

Jim

[awe4one]

"Most" customers of slabs. Not the general comic customer. The question is why are they further limiting their customer base? It's a self defeating business model.

 

Jim

 

I don't understand your argument. The general comic customer isn't their customer base. Their customer base is people who buy and use their services.

 

Exactly...and by further complicating their system, CGC is in danger of losing some of that loyal customer base. A business should be making their product more accessible not cater to very limited segment. Do that and you very likely will alienate that other segment of your customer base.

 

Again...I think CGC has listened a tad too much to this Forum and high profile clients on this change and have lost sight of the big picture...

 

Jim

[nearmint]

Not true, collectors who want to avoid restored comics simply need to avoid apparent labels. That's it. They don't need to consider the numbering system at all.

 

And Apparent labels are different from unstored labels how? Oh yeah...a small notation under the grade...what...that may not be right...

 

Some long-time collectors still don't fully understand this new system...but it's it'll be totally easy for newbies? I don't think so...

 

Jim

 

Wrong again, Jim. Apparent labels are marked "APPARENT" in large letters at the top of the label, where it used to read "UNIVERSAL" or "RESTORERD".

[drbanner]

Folks - if you don't like the proposed changes, you need to have your voice heard and email Scott with your suggestions.

 

A quick review of "the other" label threads will quickly show you that CGC does listen, and will make changes based on suggestions from US! Note that originally, the proposed scale was inverted such that a book with a Resto Level of 1 had the greatest level of restoration, and 10 had the least. There was the predictable uproar (predictable b/c there's always an uproar when CGC "...shifts (their) foot 2 millimeters to the left..." ), and lo and behold, the official draft proposal has reversed the scale such that "0" is the lowest level of resto, and 10 reflects the greatest level.

 

Stand up and be counted, Power to the People!!

[nearmint]

Now if only they'll change the lowest level of resto to one instead of zero.

 

Zero resto is unrestored!

[mica]

Now if only they'll change the lowest level of resto to one instead of zero.

 

Zero resto is unrestored!

Jeff and I have found common ground.

[awe4one]

Not true, collectors who want to avoid restored comics simply need to avoid apparent labels. That's it. They don't need to consider the numbering system at all.

 

And Apparent labels are different from unstored labels how? Oh yeah...a small notation under the grade...what...that may not be right...

 

Some long-time collectors still don't fully understand this new system...but it's it'll be totally easy for newbies? I don't think so...

 

Jim

 

Wrong again, Jim. Apparent labels are marked "APPARENT" in large letters at the top of the label, where it used to read "UNIVERSAL" or "RESTORERD".

 

You're missing the point...how does this new change help the casual collector? Under the old system seeing a restored book was clear as a bell, as it should be. Now the chance of confusion will more than likely make them shy away from slabs altogether. The more I think about it...the more that this looks like a terrible business decision on CGC's part.

 

I'm not against change...I've fully supported more info on the labels for years. It's the new format that I disagree with...CGC needs to seriously relook into this change and see if it's good for their business down the road. I don't see this format attracting new customers to their product. Just the opposite...

 

Jim

[whetteon]

I don't mind the extra information on the label but I don't understand the color change or anything listed as "CONSERVATION". Either it had work done on it or it didn't. "CONSERVATION" means nothing to me.

[nearmint]

You're missing the point...how does this new change help the casual collector? Under the old system seeing a restored book was clear as a bell, as it should be. Now the chance of confusion will more than likely make them shy away from slabs altogether. The more I think about it...the more that this looks like a terrible business decision on CGC's part.

I'm not against change...I've fully supported more info on the labels for years. It's the new format that I disagree with...CGC needs to seriously relook into this change and see if it's good for their business down the road. I don't see this format attracting new customers to their product. Just the opposite...

Jim

 

I'm not missing the point at all. I was responding to a post where you said collectors who think restored books are taboo, and used to be able to just bypass purple labels, now have to deal with a complicated numbered system. I corrected you, saying that they don't have to deal with the numbering system at all. They merely have to avoid "APPARENT" labels, just as they used to avoid purple labels. Very simple.

[awe4one]

You're missing the point...how does this new change help the casual collector? Under the old system seeing a restored book was clear as a bell, as it should be. Now the chance of confusion will more than likely make them shy away from slabs altogether. The more I think about it...the more that this looks like a terrible business decision on CGC's part.

I'm not against change...I've fully supported more info on the labels for years. It's the new format that I disagree with...CGC needs to seriously relook into this change and see if it's good for their business down the road. I don't see this format attracting new customers to their product. Just the opposite...

Jim

 

I'm not missing the point at all. I was responding to a post where you said collectors who think restored books are taboo, and used to be able to just bypass purple labels, now have to deal with a complicated numbered system. I corrected you, saying that they don't have to deal with the numbering system at all. They merely have to avoid "APPARENT" labels, just as they used to avoid purple labels. Very simple.

 

Simple to the seasoned collector maybe...don't assume everyone has your keen eagle eyes...

 

Jim

[nearmint]

You're missing the point...how does this new change help the casual collector? Under the old system seeing a restored book was clear as a bell, as it should be. Now the chance of confusion will more than likely make them shy away from slabs altogether. The more I think about it...the more that this looks like a terrible business decision on CGC's part.

I'm not against change...I've fully supported more info on the labels for years. It's the new format that I disagree with...CGC needs to seriously relook into this change and see if it's good for their business down the road. I don't see this format attracting new customers to their product. Just the opposite...

Jim

 

I'm not missing the point at all. I was responding to a post where you said collectors who think restored books are taboo, and used to be able to just bypass purple labels, now have to deal with a complicated numbered system. I corrected you, saying that they don't have to deal with the numbering system at all. They merely have to avoid "APPARENT" labels, just as they used to avoid purple labels. Very simple.

 

Simple to the seasoned collector maybe...don't assume everyone has your keen eagle eyes...

 

Jim

 

As I said before, this transition will be EASIER for the unseasoned collector. They're not used to 6 years of the old way.

[Flaming_Telepath]

I don't mind the extra information on the label but I don't understand the color change or anything listed as "CONSERVATION". Either it had work done on it or it didn't. "CONSERVATION" means nothing to me.

 

Conservation is work that is undertaken by Chris Friesen. Chris only 'conserves' books, never restores them. Other amateurs 'restore' books.

[action1kid]

Craftfully wriiten re-writing of the dictionary.

 

Chris only 'conserves' books, never restores them. Other amateurs 'restore' books.

[Flaming_Telepath]

Craftfully wriiten re-writing of the dictionary.

 

Chris only 'conserves' books, never restores them. Other amateurs 'restore' books.

 

This is one of the main points to all of this...the label change and Chris' PCS set-up are deeply connected. They are component parts of the 'business model'.