High Grade Hoarding

[joe_collector]

>>That's the reason he got the collection--one or two other dealers in his area didn't want to go out to see a collection the owner couldn't describe to them. They were just trying to get rid of the books; that part is plausible.

 

Of course it is, and most estates are run that way.

 

It's just that Chuck's self-induced fantasy of proferring an Overstreet Guide to these potential clients is quite amusing, especially for a guy with $1K in his bank account, and one step removed from living in his car.

 

Maybe he tells himself that fairy tale each and every night, so that the Ghost of Edgar Church won't visit him in his dreams?

 

"But Edgar... I offered them a Guide... yezzzzzzz Iiii diiiiiiiiid....... No, stay back... Aiiieeee"

[Foolkiller]

well, i'm not a dealer... and there's many dealers I know personally who would make an unfair deal without informing the seller completely about their options... if they didn't have the funds to broker the deal, they'd find someone who did. but i admit, today's environment is different and there's a lot more comics dealers with more money. that being said, I doubt there's a lot of dealers trying to fleece the seller in a deal. Of course you want to turn a high profit margin, but there's that line between doing something that's just good business and what amounts to complete unfairness.

 

Although, no one really knows what the whole deal is... it sounds to me as if it is very suspect and chuck fully took advantage of the situation (he says, he feels like he won the lottery, he knew his life was changing) so he knew he was taking advantage of the situation.

 

the question is how much do you sell your character for? for chuck, it was the price of the church collection

[joe_collector]

>>Nice. You managed to combine sycophancy, sanctimony, and ad hominem all in one post.

 

Yo Chuck, I think there's some more VG comics in the bin that need to be re-marked as NM. Get to it, time's a wasting.

[FlyingDonut]

Can we just stop this thread now - we've had this argument here before and it was just as pointless then as it is now. What's done is done.

[joe_collector]

Tell Chuck to stop posting, and I'm sure we'll all back down.

[fantastic_four]

It's just that Chuck's self-induced fantasy of proferring an Overstreet Guide to these potential clients is quite amusing, especially for a guy with $1K in his bank account, and one step removed from living in his car.

Even though I agree with the analysis, your accusation is the very definition of libel. None of us know what happened except Chuck and the Churches.

 

It would be interesting to see a transcript of the supposed trial, though, to hear the Churches' side of the story...anybody know whether court transcripts are legally part of the public domain?

[joe_collector]

>>Even though I agree with the analysis, your accusation is the very definition of libel.

 

You're kidding right?

 

Chuck has posted those articles in an open forum, and must accept some feedback as such. My statements are not directed at Chuck personally, but as counterpoints to the articles he posted of his own free will, both in print and on his website.

 

And plus, my comments are basically parody in the true sense.

 

I do agree with Dan on the "this is getting us nowhere" thread, and everytime this starts up I get a huge headache. Like I said before, I just wish Chuck wold let sleeping dogs lie, instead of dredging up the past.

[joe_collector]

So to walk the walk and talk the talk, how's about we get back to the real meat of the thread, which potential comics were hoarded in the MH 2 collection?

 

I find that conversation interesting, while the Church collection has been covered many, many times before.

[fantastic_four]

No, I wasn't kidding...I mean, I'm not saying "watch your butt, you'll get sued," but I'm saying that you're disputing facts with nothing to back it up but hypotheticals. You're not costing the guy money in here, so of course he wouldn't sue if he saw it--those of us saying he grades like [!@#%^&^] are doing more to hurt him than this Church collection talk--but at least when we're saying he grades like [!@#%^&^], at least some of us are doing it from experience. All of the conjecture about what did and didn't happen in the physical world between Church and Rozanski is assumption, which is never a good idea without qualifying it as such.

[joe_collector]

I need some EXCEDRIN!

[Polyphemus]

A question I have to the dealers or professional hobbyists on the board:

 

Is it worth making the distinction between someone who comes to you to buy their collection hoping they will make "(fair market value) minus (wholesale/dealer's price)" and a person who comes to you to buy their collection just so they can get rid of it?

 

I have purchased 2 collections recently (each about 1000 books, so not very big) that had some valuable books (for me that is i.e. Hulk 181, GS x-Men 1, XMen 94, JIM 83, etc) and the sellers did not really know fair market value. They were both much more interested in getting rid of it and both gave me a price before I gave them one. Each price was well below F.M.V. (one even had a Wizard to help them figure it out). I didn't feel obligated to tell them that I was going to turn it arund for about 900%. I don't feel that is unethical, I feel it is good business: buy low, sell high.

 

I'm not trying to be combative. I agree that Chuck's revisionism is offensive and leaves a bad taste but I don't know how I would act in that situation. I think I'd try to get the best deal possible for me.

[fazman]

As I read thru these threads , I have to ask: Is this for real ?? Man , talk are being able to manipulate a whole market. If a certain number of books are available in mass quantities , and collectors are absorbing these books, even slowly , does this not render these books as artifically valued ? Do these collectors really believe that there is value in these books ? Hey, if there were thousands of Action #1's out there, does anyone thing they would be worth $400.000 grand ??

 

[Foolkiller]

in my opinion, there's nothing wrong with that transaction... but it's a question of personal integrity. however if a seller asks for a price and you meet it, it's like selling anything else. I personally would feel badly if the mark up were tremendous (if i paid $100 and made $900, i'm not sure i would lose any sleep) If I paid $1000 and made $100,000 I might be more inclined that my conscience would bother me. To me though, the sale sounds like a basic sales contract... offer, acceptance, consideration... there's no fraud here because as long as the price was reasonably close to price that might be paid by others similarly situated, i don't see a problem... but if my profit was 900% i might not feel the greatest about never being honest with the seller... but from a business standpoint, i don't see a problem with it.

[fantastic_four]

Don't think I'll be able to express to you before I go to bed the folly and de-legitimizing effect to people who understand the nature of truth and our perceptions of it which comes from basing arguments upon assumption, so just forget it for now; you do it often enough to where I'll just elucidate the next time it happens.

[joe_collector]

That's a great point, and it's already started affecting some hoarded books that used to sell for a Mint in CGC 9.4-and above condition, but as the Census grew, prices fell hard.

 

Like I said in a previous post, in 5-10 years time we could all be in here laughing about the crazy prices paid for Silver and Bronze CGC comics in 2000-2010, while taking the $10 BIN on a Hulk 181.

[Polyphemus]

For sure there are thousands (ten's of thousands? anyone have knowledge of how many were printed?) out there. They may not be mint, but how many people who own this book a) collect comics, b) know there is such a thing as CGC, or c) care?

[fantastic_four]

Hey, if there were thousands of Action #1's out there, does anyone thing they would be worth $400.000 grand ??

It'd be worth much less, but 60 years of collecting haven't turned out thousands of copies of Action #1, so the market is propped up on the reality of the low supply that has stood a pretty fair amount of time.

[joe_collector]

Oh yeah, Golden Age to the early-60's is a different story and supply is not going to mushroom anytime soon. That said, there are dealers and collectors who jumped on the Marvel and DC bus in the 60's-on and have large hoards of books.

 

The key will be time, and although the dealers are careful not to let too many NM copies out and flood the market, one or two hoarders kicking the bucket and the subsequent discover of said hoards, would do some real damage.

 

As long as it's hidden, collectors are none the wiser, but time tends to reveal all.

[joe_collector]

Speakng hypothetically, what do you think the affect of this headline in CBG would be:

 

"Collector Dies, Unopened Case of Hulk 181 Found"

[ninanina]

$10.00 BIN prices on Hulk 181 in 2010?