BA773 Posted September 30, 2023 Share Posted September 30, 2023 I never bought to an other place than ebay or the webshop of one my friend. I get a really good deal for a book that i just want so much but the disscusion is began with him after that i posted an announce on facebook comic group. If we do the deal we re going to process by paypal. So now im in in a really great hesitation if i take the bet or not... Maybe someone can share if he already bought on fb forum or marketplace, and maybe too if you had a bad expérience if you had can saved the situation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post SOTIcollector Posted September 30, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted September 30, 2023 (edited) I buy primarily from eBay, but I also buy from reputable dealers and from some other platforms like Facebook and the CGC message boards right here. There are two critical components to EVERY online transaction: 1) trust between buyer and seller, and 2) a method for remedy if things go wrong. That "something goes wrong" can be anything from outright fraud on the seller's part to fraud on the buyer's part to a lost or damaged package or unknown/undisclosed preexisting damage. Never conduct ANY online transaction without carefully considering both trust and remediation, often called "buyer protection". Ebay provides a mechanism to establish trust (their feedback system, which generally works well unless a seller's account was hacked). EBay also provides the ability to file a dispute when something goes wrong, and they typically side with the buyer in a dispute. BUYER PROTECTION To make sure that you are covered in case something goes wrong, always use a payment system that provides a dispute mechanism. PayPal's Goods & Services payment provides this, and I understand their protection is pretty good. NEVER use PayPal's "Friends and Family" to pay for goods, because F&F surrenders all of your buyer protection. Venmo claims to offer buyer protection in some cases, but I have not had any personal experience with the Venmo buyer protection. PayPal charges the seller about 4% to accept a "Goods & Service" payment. Sometimes you'll see a seller who asks you to pay via PayPal Friends & Family. When they do that, they are either trying to save 4% or they are trying to scam you. If the seller asks for Friends and Family payment, then offer to pay 4% extra if they will accept Goods & Services. If they refuse Goods and Services payment with a 4% surcharge, then you know they were trying to scam you all along. For added protection, you may also want to fund your PayPal with a credit card that offers buyer protection. That way, if things go wrong, and if somehow PayPal doesn't cover you, there's another layer of protection that might be available to you. One more important consideration is your location. If you and the seller live in different countries, I'm guessing that consumer protection laws and buyer protection may vary between the countries. Be sure that any protection you're relying on applies to both countries involved. TRUST Now to the issue of trust. Even with buyer protection in place, your safest bet is to avoid troubling sellers. How do you know you can trust somebody on Facebook or any online platform? Here are some ways that can help you figure out if a seller is trustworthy. There's no one thing that says a person is absolutely trustworthy, and there's rarely one single thing that says a person is a scammer. Typically, you need to look at a number of things, and weigh them carefully to determine how much you trust a seller. - Ask for references. The best sellers will be able to provide numerous references. - Look at the seller's online profile. Have they been on Facebook for years, with photos through the year of a spouse and kids and parents and friends? That's a plus in the "legit" column. Did they just sign up for Facebook recently, and their account shows almost no public activity? That's a warning sign that they could be a scammer. - How responsive are they to your questions? The most reputable sellers will answer reasonable questions. Many scammers will block you for asking reasonable and polite questions about their products or their legitimacy. - Have they created a sense of urgency in their posting? That's a tactic that scammers use. - Is the post too good to be true? You can get bargains on low-demand, non-key books. A motivated seller might sell you $100 worth of non-key books for $20 or $10. But if somebody offers you a $5,000 high-demand key book for just $2,000, it's probably a scammer. - What else are they offering for sale? If they have a number of items for sale, and others are buying those items, particularly if you can see a history of recent successful sales, that might help build your confidence in the seller. - How well do they know about what they're selling? Sometimes the scammers clearly know nothing about comics. A person who knows nothing about comics could be an honest person who just happened to inherit a box that had Hulk 181 in it, but in my experience 9 times out of 10 that person who knows nothing about comics is a scammer. - Some people ask for a photo of the person with their merchandise and a note indicating the date and time. Personally, I don't put much faith in those because photos are easily faked and even the merchandise can be faked for a photo. If I really want an extra layer of assurance, and if the book is an expensive one, I'd consider asking for a video. Videos can be faked as well, but not nearly as easily as photos. - Talk to the seller on the phone or with video call. This can help provide some assurances. - What's the risk if something goes south? For a $10 item, I only look for a few assurances that a person is legit. For a $1000 item, I look a lot closer at these things to make sure I can trust the seller. - What is their return policy? If they say, "no returns, ever", I'm a lot less likely to buy from them. Any reasonable seller should be willing to accept a return for a legitimate reason, such as undisclosed restoration or damage. Another thing to consider is smaller transactions before larger ones. If somebody has an expensive book you want, try buying something cheaper from them first, and then as they gain your trust you could buy more expensive items. These are just some of the things to look at. I'm sure others will have more suggestions. Edited September 30, 2023 by SOTIcollector Dr. Balls, Nschenks, MattTheDuck and 4 others 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted September 30, 2023 Author Share Posted September 30, 2023 On 9/30/2023 at 8:25 PM, SOTIcollector said: I buy primarily from eBay, but I also buy from reputable dealers and from some other platforms like Facebook and the CGC message boards right here. There are two critical components to EVERY online transaction: 1) trust between buyer and seller, and 2) a method for remedy if things go wrong. That "something goes wrong" can be anything from outright fraud on the seller's part to fraud on the buyer's part to a lost or damaged package or unknown/undisclosed preexisting damage. Never conduct ANY online transaction without carefully considering both trust and remediation, often called "buyer protection". Ebay provides a mechanism to establish trust (their feedback system, which generally works well unless a seller's account was hacked). EBay also provides the ability to file a dispute when something goes wrong, and they typically side with the buyer in a dispute. BUYER PROTECTION To make sure that you are covered in case something goes wrong, always use a payment system that provides a dispute mechanism. PayPal's Goods & Services payment provides this, and I understand their protection is pretty good. NEVER use PayPal's "Friends and Family" to pay for goods, because F&F surrenders all of your buyer protection. Venmo claims to offer buyer protection in some cases, but I have not had any personal experience with the Venmo buyer protection. For added protection, you may also want to fund your PayPal with a credit card that offers buyer protection. That way, if things go wrong, and if somehow PayPal doesn't cover you, there's another layer of protection that might be available to you. One more important consideration is your location. If you and the seller live in different countries, I'm guessing that consumer protection laws and buyer protection may vary between the countries. Be sure that any protection you're relying on applies to both countries involved. TRUST Now to the issue of trust. Even with buyer protection in place, your safest bet is to avoid troubling sellers. How do you know you can trust somebody on Facebook or any online platform? Here are some ways that can help you figure out if a seller is trustworthy. There's no one thing that says a person is absolutely trustworthy, and there's rarely one single thing that says a person is a scammer. Typically, you need to look at a number of things, and weigh them carefully to determine how much you trust a seller. - Ask for references. The best sellers will be able to provide numerous references. - Look at the seller's online profile. Have they been on Facebook for years, with photos through the year of a spouse and kids and parents and friends? That's a plus in the "legit" column. Did they just sign up for Facebook recently, and their account shows almost no public activity? That's a warning sign that they could be a scammer. - How responsive are they to your questions? The most reputable sellers will answer reasonable questions. Many scammers will block you for asking reasonable and polite questions about their products or their legitimacy. - Have they created a sense of urgency in their posting? That's a tactic that scammers use. - Is the post too good to be true? You can get bargains on low-demand, non-key books. A motivated seller might sell you $100 worth of non-key books for $20 or $10. But if somebody offers you a $5,000 high-demand key book for just $2,000, it's probably a scammer. - What else are they offering for sale? If they have a number of items for sale, and others are buying those items, particularly if you can see a history of recent successful sales, that might help build your confidence in the seller. - How well do they know about what they're selling? Sometimes the scammers clearly know nothing about comics. A person who knows nothing about comics could be an honest person who just happened to inherit a box that had Hulk 181 in it, but in my experience 9 times out of 10 that person who knows nothing about comics is a scammer. - Some people ask for a photo of the person with their merchandise and a note indicating the date and time. Personally, I don't put much faith in those because photos are easily faked and even the merchandise can be faked for a photo. If I really want an extra layer of assurance, and if the book is an expensive one, I'd consider asking for a video. Videos can be faked as well, but not nearly as easily as photos. - Talk to the seller on the phone or with video call. This can help provide some assurances. - What's the risk if something goes south? For a $10 item, I only look for a few assurances that a person is legit. For a $1000 item, I look a lot closer at these things to make sure I can trust the seller. - What is their return policy? If they say, "no returns, ever", I'm a lot less likely to buy from them. Any reasonable seller should be willing to accept a return for a legitimate reason, such as undisclosed restoration or damage. Another thing to consider is smaller transactions before larger ones. If somebody has an expensive book you want, try buying something cheaper from them first, and then as they gain your trust you could buy more expensive items. These are just some of the things to look at. I'm sure others will have more suggestions. Are you working for the FBI? Nschenks and SOTIcollector 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaard Posted September 30, 2023 Share Posted September 30, 2023 I've bought exactly one thing off FB ...a Stratego game. I got home and started setting it up in anticipation of showing my son how much of an expert I was ... it was missing pieces. Haven't bought anything since. BA773 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted October 1, 2023 Author Share Posted October 1, 2023 (edited) Why this world is full of sh*t?... And the next messages really start to be strange and confirmed my doubt... Edited October 1, 2023 by BA773 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvelmaniac Posted October 1, 2023 Share Posted October 1, 2023 I have sold my Son's books on Facebook, not in the Marketplace but in comic book groups that allow sales and are well moderated. If you find a book you are interested in ask for (if not already posted) pictures with a name/date stamp, ask, on the site for references for the seller and only use PayPal Goods and Services for payment. If you do find a book in the marketplace and it is local be sure to meet at a public place, do not go alone, go during the day (we meet folks at the Police Station) and do not make payment until you see the actual item, then pay with cash or PayPal G&S, I am an old guy and do not trust Venmo and Zelle, too many scammers. BA773 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kromak Posted October 1, 2023 Share Posted October 1, 2023 On 9/30/2023 at 6:25 PM, SOTIcollector said: PayPal charges the seller about 4% to accept a "Goods & Service" payment. Thats true only for local US-US transactions (perhaps for more local deals). This was going to be a international transaction, and the % PayPal charges on these cases is significantly larger. BA773 and SOTIcollector 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCOComics Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 On 9/30/2023 at 2:47 PM, BA773 said: Are you working for the FBI? If he is an FBI agent, it seems he's been compling collaborating evidence in Frederic Wrentham's investigation. SOTIcollector 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marvelmaniac Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 "PayPal charges the seller about 4% to accept a "Goods & Service" payment." 2.9% + .30 cents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semicentennial Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 On 10/1/2023 at 5:09 AM, BA773 said: Why this world is full of sh*t?... And the next messages really start to be strange and confirmed my doubt... I'm not sure why the joker image was posted but if you posted that then the seller probably thought you were just wasting their time. What the heck does "Is a killing joke"supposed to mean? That indeed is weird that someone should send that. Do you mean it was a joke because you didn't know what "friends and family" meant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 On 10/3/2023 at 3:49 AM, Semicentennial said: I'm not sure why the joker image was posted but if you posted that then the seller probably thought you were just wasting their time. What the heck does "Is a killing joke"supposed to mean? That indeed is weird that someone should send that. Do you mean it was a joke because you didn't know what "friends and family" meant? No i sent to him the killing joke to make him understand that I knew he was a scammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 And after that he try to keep me in his nets with proposing to me to do a better than the one we already maked and even ask me my phone number for any reason and no sense because he can call me on messanger So that definitly lost my trust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semicentennial Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 (edited) On 10/2/2023 at 10:18 PM, BA773 said: And after that he try to keep me in his nets with proposing to me to do a better than the one we already maked and even ask me my phone number for any reason and no sense because he can call me on messanger So that definitly lost my trust Honestly, if some dude off the internet sent me an "killing joke" image after asking about a book I was selling, I'd definitely avoid. Honestly, that a psycho thing to do. Edited October 3, 2023 by Semicentennial BA773 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 (edited) On 03/10/2023 at 14:44, Semicentennial said: Honestly, if some dude off the internet sent me an "killing joke" image after asking about a book I was selling, I'd definitely avoid. Honestly, that a psycho thing to do. One more time, i sent the killing joke to show him that i understood he wanted to fool me... there is nothing psycho... Edited October 3, 2023 by BA773 Semicentennial 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flchris Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 I'm a little confused. Was the image you replied with a copy of the Killing Joke? Or were you saying the whole sale was a killing joke? Is there an image of what he was offering for sale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semicentennial Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 On 10/3/2023 at 9:27 AM, BA773 said: One more time, i sent the killing joke to show him that i understood he wanted to fool me... there is nothing psycho... If someone sent me that I'd think they were crazy. I definitely wouldn't want to deal with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BA773 Posted October 4, 2023 Author Share Posted October 4, 2023 On 10/3/2023 at 9:15 PM, flchris said: I'm a little confused. Was the image you replied with a copy of the Killing Joke? Or were you saying the whole sale was a killing joke? Is there an image of what he was offering for sale? It was for a bat 423 but the seller wanted to fool me with not secure method of payement and when i finally be sure this was a scam i sent him the killing joke pics Semicentennial 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCOComics Posted October 4, 2023 Share Posted October 4, 2023 On 10/4/2023 at 3:38 AM, BA773 said: It was for a bat 423 but the seller wanted to fool me with not secure method of payement and when i finally be sure this was a scam i sent him the killing joke pics You did the right thing to not buy through PayPal friends and family. I wouldn't either. To be clear, Friends and Family doesn't necessarily mean it's a scam. Many sellers sell through Facebook because the platform allows them to avoid fees. That said, it's a gamble and your the only one with something to lose, so I wouldn't do it either. As for the killing Joke, I do understand what you are trying to say after you explained it. In the message it wasn't explicitly clear. My recommendation for all people, in all walks of life is, be direct, be clear and leave nothing open for interpretation. Otherwise your intention will get lost and people on the internet will call you crazy. Had you said, "I don't feel comfortable with PayPal FF" and he was legit perhaps you could have worked out an arrangement. Split the fees or something. Semicentennial, BA773 and SOTIcollector 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
