Staple pull……

[Monstro]

i'm wondering how much a staple pull affects the grade of a book

like this. as you can see the top staple has been pulled through the cover.

it's such a nice book other then that.

what do you all think?

 

[nik]

CGC will assign a Qualified Grade for the book.

 

I have the same issue with this copy

 

 

[drbanner]

There is no single answer, but I thought I read somewhere that a book cannot be better than VF with a staple pull...

[Inhuman Fiend]

Since the cover is technically detached at one staple, doesn't that automatically drop it down to the Good-Very Good range? I know the otherwise high-grade quality of the book should count for something, but Good/Very Good is the highest grade listed by Overstreet as allowing that defect...

[Monstro]

that seems harsh for a nice book otherwise. but it is what it is

[Moondog]

I have a Herbie 19 with a bottom staple pull. It's a Green 9.4...

 

What a beautiful book...sigh.

[VintageComics]

I could be wrong but i think VG range (so VG/F 5.0) is about the highest you can go with a staple pulled cover. With a centerfold pulled at one staple I've seen books as hi as 8.5. I had a TOS #40 that was a phenominal looking book and thought it would come back a 8.5 or 9.0 if not for the popped bottom staple. The cover was still attached at the bottom staple because there was some paper stuck under it, but the paper did pop from the staple and technically was detached.

Any thoughts?

[Ze-man]

I have a PGX BA Tec #395 7.0 with a top staple pull, on what was otherwise a 9.0' ish looking book.

 

Got it for a song.

 

Ze-

[Inhuman Fiend]

I have a PGX BA Tec #395 7.0 with a top staple pull, on what was otherwise a 9.0' ish looking book.

 

Got it for a song.

 

Ze-

 

Was it a qualified 7.0 or any notation about the staple pull? If not, that is kind of disturbing...it is a shame when HG books have that problem, but unfortunately it is a MAJOR defect that I feel should be noted.

[Inhuman Fiend]

I could be wrong but i think VG range (so VG/F 5.0) is about the highest you can go with a staple pulled cover. With a centerfold pulled at one staple I've seen books as hi as 8.5. I had a TOS #40 that was a phenominal looking book and thought it would come back a 8.5 or 9.0 if not for the popped bottom staple. The cover was still attached at the bottom staple because there was some paper stuck under it, but the paper did pop from the staple and technically was detached.

Any thoughts?

 

Really...an 8.5 with a partially detached centerfold!

 

In Overstreet VG is the highest grade where that defect is specifically mentioned. I guess that is where the really subjective nature of grading comes into play. I have no clue how to rate high grade books with one killer defect...I wish there was some sort of deduction system/scale that shows you how many points to take off for a book. In other words, if you have a copy that would otherwise grade as a 9.0 but has a partial centerfold detachment you deduct 1.5, or if it has a pulled cover staple, you deduct 3.0 and so forth...

[Ze-man]

I have a PGX BA Tec #395 7.0 with a top staple pull, on what was otherwise a 9.0' ish looking book.

 

Got it for a song.

 

Ze-

 

Was it a qualified 7.0 or any notation about the staple pull? If not, that is kind of disturbing...it is a shame when HG books have that problem, but unfortunately it is a MAJOR defect that I feel should be noted.

 

I broke it outta the slab when I bought it, and would have to really dig around to find the label...it might even be gonzo. I dont remember is it was listed on there or not. However the SELLER did mention it....scaring off alot of bidders in the process.

It was the main reason I bid on it though, if I were to buy a similar condition issue w/o the pull, I would have to pay alot more for the book.

 

So I went with what I could live with, and afford.

 

Ze-

[Aman619]

I hate this whole pulled staple thing! Ive seen a lot of pristine unread books with a popped staple. How on Earth can these be graded 7.0 or worse VGs? Just seems to me that a pulled staple should have had to have been actually PULLED through reading or mishandling the book to be considered more than a simple printing issue like a missed staple or "badly miscut" or miswrap. I think books were manufactured in similar numbers with these defaults, dont all of you?? Even is fare more scarcely, thats MORE of a reason to consider it a minor printing defect and not a fatal flaw.

[Monstro]

I hate this whole pulled staple thing! Ive seen a lot of pristine unread books with a popped staple. How on Earth can these be graded 7.0 or worse VGs? Just seems to me that a pulled staple should have had to have been actually PULLED through reading or mishandling the book to be considered more than a simple printing issue like a missed staple or "badly miscut" or miswrap. I think books were manufactured in similar numbers with these defaults, dont all of you?? Even is fare more scarcely, thats MORE of a reason to consider it a minor printing defect and not a fatal flaw.

 

now your talking!!!

[VintageComics]

I hate this whole pulled staple thing! Ive seen a lot of pristine unread books with a popped staple. How on Earth can these be graded 7.0 or worse VGs? Just seems to me that a pulled staple should have had to have been actually PULLED through reading or mishandling the book to be considered more than a simple printing issue like a missed staple or "badly miscut" or miswrap. I think books were manufactured in similar numbers with these defaults, dont all of you?? Even is fare more scarcely, thats MORE of a reason to consider it a minor printing defect and not a fatal flaw.

 

So you're saying that a 9.4 SA book with a pulled staple is o.k.? I guess you'd pay FMV for this 9.4 book? Or should the book be downgraded for it?

[Aman619]

I hate this whole pulled staple thing! Ive seen a lot of pristine unread books with a popped staple. How on Earth can these be graded 7.0 or worse VGs? Just seems to me that a pulled staple should have had to have been actually PULLED through reading or mishandling the book to be considered more than a simple printing issue like a missed staple or "badly miscut" or miswrap. I think books were manufactured in similar numbers with these defaults, dont all of you?? Even is fare more scarcely, thats MORE of a reason to consider it a minor printing defect and not a fatal flaw.

 

So you're saying that a 9.4 SA book with a pulled staple is o.k.? I guess you'd pay FMV for this 9.4 book? Or should the book be downgraded for it?

 

Yes. I think so. Maybe knock it down a notch to 9.2. all else being equal on the 2 books.

 

as for what I would pay for the book, in the world we live in? No I wouldnt. Because the common wisdom is that a 9.4 book with a pulled staple from its manufacturing is equal in value to a VG (or whatever) so obviously I wouldnt pay FMV for it.

 

But in MY world as I see this issue, I think the value should be way more than it is today. Maybe as high as a 9.2 of the same book. I feel strongly about it because in many cases, you just cannot see the pull. Its not like other forms of damage. For that matter, in this vein, I really disagree with CGC about downgrading for "invisible" creases that are only visible with effort.

[VintageComics]

I hate this whole pulled staple thing! Ive seen a lot of pristine unread books with a popped staple. How on Earth can these be graded 7.0 or worse VGs? Just seems to me that a pulled staple should have had to have been actually PULLED through reading or mishandling the book to be considered more than a simple printing issue like a missed staple or "badly miscut" or miswrap. I think books were manufactured in similar numbers with these defaults, dont all of you?? Even is fare more scarcely, thats MORE of a reason to consider it a minor printing defect and not a fatal flaw.

 

So you're saying that a 9.4 SA book with a pulled staple is o.k.? I guess you'd pay FMV for this 9.4 book? Or should the book be downgraded for it?

 

Yes. I think so. Maybe knock it down a notch to 9.2. all else being equal on the 2 books.

 

as for what I would pay for the book, in the world we live in? No I wouldnt. Because the common wisdom is that a 9.4 book with a pulled staple from its manufacturing is equal in value to a VG (or whatever) so obviously I wouldnt pay FMV for it.

 

But in MY world as I see this issue, I think the value should be way more than it is today. Maybe as high as a 9.2 of the same book. I feel strongly about it because in many cases, you just cannot see the pull. Its not like other forms of damage. For that matter, in this vein, I really disagree with CGC about downgrading for "invisible" creases that are only visible with effort.

 

I understand what you are saying, but i'd rather have a staple missing from production than one that has pulled through the cover

You don't see a missing centerfold in a CGC slab either, but it still affects the grade. The issue is not always abot eye appeal, but also about the over all condition. A loose cover is a pretty big issue in my books as the cover sells more than 90% of the comic.

JMO.

[Aman619]

my remark about not seeing stuff didnt really refer to things hidden by the slab. I was thinking of other manufactring defects like Marvel chipping. I dont mind a pulled staple so much (far less than CGC) but Marvel chipping is ugly and obvious, so while its ALSO due to vaguaries in the manufacturinbg process, I AGREE with serious downgrading for it. Im trying to narrow down my view and defense of pulled staples as a very benign and minor manufacturing defect. Like the invisible cover creases that NONE of us ever saw or worried about until CGC came along.

[VintageComics]

my remark about not seeing stuff didnt really refer to things hidden by the slab. I was thinking of other manufactring defects like Marvel chipping. I dont mind a pulled staple so much (far less than CGC) but Marvel chipping is ugly and obvious, so while its ALSO due to vaguaries in the manufacturinbg process, I AGREE with serious downgrading for it. Im trying to narrow down my view and defense of pulled staples as a very benign and minor manufacturing defect. Like the invisible cover creases that NONE of us ever saw or worried about until CGC came along.

 

I see what you are saying....I am not bothered as much by pre-chipping...being a Marvel fanboy, i guess i kinda over romanticize overhang and chipping

(heck i even like date stamps) because they add to the character of the book and the era they came from...to me a pulled staple is very un appealing, but i have to admit, i do have a couple of PERFECT looking books that i have in my collection and they have pulles staples

[blowout]

I was thinking of other manufactring defects like Marvel chipping. I dont mind a pulled staple so much (far less than CGC) but Marvel chipping is ugly and obvious, so while its ALSO due to vaguaries in the manufacturinbg process, I AGREE with serious downgrading for it. Im trying to narrow down my view and defense of pulled staples as a very benign and minor manufacturing defect. .

 

This type of comment is exactly why grading is so subjective though.

 

You don't mind a staple pull? Well I hate them, and the fact is they can lead to far more serious defects as the cover is no longer properly attached to the book!

[Aman619]

I dont li e them, but I think they are not as serious a defect as others and CGC consider them. And, just how can a loose staple on an otherwise NM book (which is never coming out of its mylar to be read or for any other reason) ever going to cause further defects to the rest of the book??

 

keep in mind Im really talking only about otherwise NM copies, not a midgrade book that has had its staple pulled thru as one of many defects from handling.