CGC FORUM TOP BRONZE AGE COVERS - #10

[whetteon]

This makes the top ten???

 

Let the Marvel bashers begin...........

As for me, I'm a Marvel Junkie and this cover doesn't make my top 40/50 covers.

 

The concept of Hulk vs Thor is fine but this cover isn't that dynamic. Heck, they could probably redo those poses in a Greek sauna and not have to change positions.

 

I agree. I am a Marvel guy, but this cover really doesn't do anything for me.

 

I like the premise of two power houses about to duke it out in the Bronze Age and I love the colors on the cover but I can't see any real beauty beyond these two points. The position both characters are in seems awkward and off. I have this book in my collection and wouldn't trade or sell it anytime soon but I would of liked to seen this as a top 30, not a top 10.

[WernerVonDoom]

I love this book, but come on people. Not in the top 20.

[namisgr]

I love this book, but come on people. Not in the top 20.

 

Wasn't me. Not after owning a JIM 112.

[BronzeBruce13]

For those of you not in favor of Defenders 10 being in the top 10, just a few considerations to explain my nomination...

 

With all respect to Jason and Scott for undertaking this enjoyable project, I personally found "Top" to be too vauge for me to really to sink my teeth into it.

 

For me, there would need to be several "sub-categories" to better credit covers that appeal to me on different levels.

 

For example, I would propose:

 

1. "Favorite" Cover– (with emphasis to impact it has in your memory) This is the category Defenders 10 falls in for me. For that matter, ASM 123, 124 as well... although I feel that the latter 2 are much more "dynamic" from a design/layout POV. None really compare to many, many "better" illustrated covers in illustration quality, but they were so dramatic and memorable at the time they were introduced that they are burned into my memory forever.

 

2. Best Illustrated– This is the criteria I had the most difficulty really choosing covers over one another. If I was using "Illustrative quality" (anatomy accuracy- rendering quality, etc.) as the primary concern… Gil Kane and Neal Adams would have virtually swept "my" 20 with maybe (5-7) exceptions that include other artists known for their rendering ability... Smith, Byrne, Perez, etc.

 

3. Most Dynamic/Unique Design– This is harder to expain. What I'm driving at is covers that are designed in some atypical/unique/original fashion compared to what is more common and expected in comic art design for the most part. As an example, although Green Lantern 76 is certainly illustrated very well, what impacts me the most is the COLOR and how only green and black is used to awesome effect. I'm not a big Steranko fan, but I imagine others would use him as an example too.

 

Anyway that's how and why I chose Defnders 10.

 

 

 

OT: A similar problem would arise (no puns please) for me if I was asked to choose my top 20 women of all time. I would need sub-categories... Most impact around the time of my sexual awakening (Dorthy Stratten, Candy Loving, Barbie Benton, Farrah) ... Most beautiful face, Hottest body, whom I'd want a weekend of sin with the most... who I could see permanently spending all my time with... who would be the best between the sheets (Angelina Jolie, Madonna) etc. etc.

[jbud73]

Hey Bruce Great post - my simple rebuttle is this. As narrow as you could ever make the criteria, the decision and voting based on that criteria would STILL be subjective in nature. With that in mind I specifically used a generic term like "Top" and had the voters do what they would have done anyway, which is rank their preferences based on decision making mechanism unique to each individual.

 

Thanks again for participating

[BronzeBruce13]

No criticism intended for the record Jason. It worked fine for evrybody but me it seems. I just struggled from what perspective to approach "Top" or "Best". To me at least, there is a huge difference regarding great covers that impacted my memory for various reasons (favorites) vs. those that are just awesome pieces of art.

 

Thanks to you and Scott for taking the time to make the poll. Would you be OK with running a synopsis and the results in an upcoming GPA newsletter? PM me if interested.

 

[divad]

OT: A similar problem would arise (no puns please) for me if I was asked to choose my top 20 women of all time. I would need sub-categories... Most impact around the time of my sexual awakening (Dorthy Stratten, Candy Loving, Barbie Benton, Farrah) ... Most beautiful face, Hottest body, whom I'd want a weekend of sin with the most... who I could see permanently spending all my time with... who would be the best between the sheets (Angelina Jolie, Madonna) etc. etc.

 

Uh, weren't there any real women in your life . . . or only starlets?

[BronzeBruce13]

... yes, but if I listed them you wouldn't know who they were.

ah.. what do you expect from a guy that spells his name backwards.

[divad]

... yes, but if I listed them you wouldn't know who they were.

ah.. what do you expect from a guy that spells his name backwards.

 

it just sounded like a lot of wrist action to me

 

 

[BronzeBruce13]

no more than the next guy... give or take

 

just trying to make a point about choosing the "best" when there could be many criteria to judge from. I was conflicted with the covers on which approach really represented "top" to me... maybe I'm thinking too hard.

 

I love the Defenders 10 cover for reasons explained and also the "nostalgia factor" that I really did not get into... it takes me back to the day I bought and read it. Which really brings another category possibility to light.

 

I could easily select 20-30+ Gil Kane covers that I feel are both better illustrated ("rendered" followiing the criteria I already explained) and are more dynamic layed-outs (from a design pov). Tough call fro me which path to go down.

[Scheradon]

no more than the next guy... give or take

 

just trying to make a point about choosing the "best" when there could be many criteria to judge from. I was conflicted with the covers on which approach really represented "top" to me... maybe I'm thinking too hard.

 

I love the Defenders 10 cover for reasons explained and also the "nostalgia factor" that I really did not get into... it takes me back to the day I bought and read it. Which really brings another category possibility to light.

 

I could easily select 20-30+ Gil Kane covers that I feel are both better illustrated ("rendered" followiing the criteria I already explained) and are more dynamic layed-outs (from a design pov). Tough call fro me which path to go down.

 

I know what you mean Bruce. I ended up with a mixture, where I basically covered (or tried to) the topics you brought up. Deciding between an artistically impressive cover and one like Defenders #10 which was more of nostalgia pick with a couple of my favorite characters made for some tough choices. I'm happy with the picks I made and the mixture. It's been neat to see what others voted for and why.

[divad]

no more than the next guy... give or take

 

just trying to make a point about choosing the "best" when there could be many criteria to judge from. I was conflicted with the covers on which approach really represented "top" to me... maybe I'm thinking too hard.

 

I love the Defenders 10 cover for reasons explained and also the "nostalgia factor" that I really did not get into... it takes me back to the day I bought and read it. Which really brings another category possibility to light.

 

I could easily select 20-30+ Gil Kane covers that I feel are both better illustrated ("rendered" followiing the criteria I already explained) and are more dynamic layed-outs (from a design pov). Tough call fro me which path to go down.

 

All points well made . . . I agree

[jbud73]

No criticism intended for the record Jason. It worked fine for evrybody but me it seems. I just struggled from what perspective to approach "Top" or "Best". To me at least, there is a huge difference regarding great covers that impacted my memory for various reasons (favorites) vs. those that are just awesome pieces of art.

 

Thanks to you and Scott for taking the time to make the poll. Would you be OK with running a synopsis and the results in an upcoming GPA newsletter? PM me if interested.

 

 

I'd call your post constructive commentary rather than crticism and it got me to think about a few things with respect to BA art. First being the huge differences between DC and Marvel in this period. A lot of people have commented that DC with its artists studio was really making a move towards the classic artistry of canvas/painting compositions. I think the counterpoint to that might be - did the art stray so far so as to make it indistinguishable from comic art??

 

In the end there are MANY great things that make up a great comic book cover. Composition and rendering are just a few of those elements. Other elements that are important IMO are what is actually depicted on the cover and IS IT COOL. Call me crazy but Thor and the Hulk prominently displayed in a classic battle pose rendered by John Romita has a lot going for it. In the end it appealed to enough ppl on enough levels to have them rank it high on their list and thats why its there at #10.

 

As for GPA - hey I will post all the information from the Poll here, what people do with it after that is entirely up to them. Its public info, not my information, just something I compiled for the boards, feel free to use it as you will.

[Zonker]

A lot of people have commented that DC with its artists studio was really making a move towards the classic artistry of canvas/painting compositions. I think the counterpoint to that might be - did the art stray so far

 

I think you're on to something Jason. John Byrne has made the argument that as much as us old fogeys love the changes brought about by books like GL 76, it was the beginning of the end for comics as a mass-market medium for children. Just as the more grown-up storytelling of the GL/GA series was probably something of a turn-off for most of the kids, so too was something like the "painterly" HoS 88 cover.