Unethical?

[Bugaboo-migration]

Right....

Well I guess if I have to ask - I really know the answer and just hope some people would talk me into doing the wrong thing....

It's just the damn purple label - they don't sell unless it is a AF 15 or X-Men 1....

Actually......Lie lie lie lie lie lie lie lie....Look! I'm Scrubaboo...not bugaboo...I know for a fact Ubiquiti is a shill bidder...but I'm not Bugaboo...Who's that??? lie lie lie lie Here's my proof...my own word....Bugawho?lie lie lie lie

Ug ook........eek mooga.......ug pug........can I cheat people and think it's ok?.......ook......eek mooka.........I want to lie and not be called a liar.......ook.....pooka mugluk.

It's odd, Ubiquiti........you just seem to talk gibberish unless you're lying.....talking about lying.......or talking about cheating people. I guess you're only clear about things that your good at.

[greggy]

Shut yer piehole.

 

BTW...I noticed that Arch cut off your other nut today!

[Bugaboo-migration]

Shut yer piehole.

 

BTW...I noticed that Arch cut off your other nut today!

How could he.......he's already had both of them for a long time.

[greggy]

Shut yer piehole.

 

BTW...I noticed that Arch cut off your other nut today!

How could he.......he's already had both of them for a long time.

 

So...it's not a coincidence that you are aguing in a more "friendly" way today?

 

LIAR....LIAR....LIAR

 

[Bugaboo-migration]

Shut yer piehole.

 

BTW...I noticed that Arch cut off your other nut today!

How could he.......he's already had both of them for a long time.

 

So...it's not a coincidence that you are aguing in a more "friendly" way today?

 

LIAR....LIAR....LIAR

 

Nah........it's been slow up in the Water Cooler today........and nobody's said anything to set me off. Ariamus has actually been almost normal today and has been asking some decent questions. I don't mind discussing and answering intelligent questions or "what if" scenarios that aren't just obvious liberal or anti-Bush garbage. Arch hasn't even said anything to me up there other than, "Yeah....what he said".

[greggy]

Bug ariamus

[Bugaboo-migration]

Bug ariamus

Whoa.......slow down there Tex.......it's not like he still doesn't need a hot poker shoved into his eye socket on a daily basis.

[greggy]

Bug ariamus

Whoa.......slow down there Tex.......it's not like he still doesn't need a hot poker shoved into his eye socket on a daily basis.

 

Bug araich

[Bugaboo-migration]

Bug ariamus

Whoa.......slow down there Tex.......it's not like he still doesn't need a hot poker shoved into his eye socket on a daily basis.

 

Bug araich

I've gotta be nice to him.......he's my prag.

[musicmeta]

Yeah thats what I thought.

The book is a Tomb of Dracula 1 - 9.0.....

It is actually almost flawless looking - but is the most mis-cut book I have ever seen in my life - the top "Marvel Comics Group" banner that runs along the top of the book is almost cut in half the alignment is so far off....

 

I have a cgc 9.2 copy with almost same kind of miscut and it does not have the purple label of death.

[Zonker]

ubiquiti, I think you have the answer to your question, and I also think you'd be perfectly justified in liberating the book from the Purple Label of Death. I'd probably crack it open, scan it, and clearly identify it in an auction listing as being color-touched (no "suspected," or "believed" limited disclosures), and avoid the whole stigmatization of the book as Restored or Purpled.

 

This way you're actually giving more information to the buyer by specifying the book as color-touched. Simply labeling it Purpled or Restored obscures the facts, since those labels could apply equally well to a completely re-built and rice-papered specimen. And of course that's the reason buyers are shying away from anything so labelled/stigmatized.

 

Cheers,

Z.

[sfilosa]

OK, now here's a scenario that is the situation I'm involved in:

 

I bought a book several years ago from very well known collector/dealer. The book was from this person's "original collection" and this person is someone who's name is sometimes associated with his books.

 

When I bought the book, I thought that there was a tiny tear (on the right side of the book) and thought there might be a "very small amount of color touch". I called the seller and he assured me that he never "color touched any of his books".

 

I just got the book back from CGC and of course it's got a Barney label with "a very small amount of color touch".

 

I emailed the seller and even sent scans of the book, and he still assures me that he never color touched his books.

 

 

Questions:

1) Is it possible that CGC is wrong (i.e. has anyone had this happen to them)?

2) Would it be unethical to crack the slab and state that the original owner says that there is no restoration (but not disclose that CGC says there was)?

3) Sell the book in the slab, but name the Original Owner and say there is a difference of opinion between CGC and the Original Owner?

 

OK, what should I do?

 

[chrisco37]

CGC is going to catch the color-touch (even if minor) 95% (OK, I pulled that # out of my a**) of the time. If you break it out of the slab and sell it, you must disclose the restoration. You can say that the original owner said no color touch, but you'd better make the buyers aware of the resto.

 

You even stated that before you bought the book, you suspected color-touch. CGC confirmed it for you.

 

If I were going to sell though, I'd free it from the PLOD, and give an accurate description of the book.

 

Chris

[sfilosa]

It just doesn't make any sense that if I crack the slab and say that CGC gave it this grade and found this restoration, that would make the book worth more than selling it with a Purple label.

 

If you think about it, I should at least get the same amount. At least the buyer would know the real CGC grade of the book (so I'm not selling an overgraded and restored book).

 

 

Just doesn't make sense.

[chrisco37]

It just doesn't make any sense that if I crack the slab and say that CGC gave it this grade and found this restoration, that would make the book worth more than selling it with a Purple label.

 

Welcome to eBay!

 

Chris

[Darthdiesel]

Shut yer piehole.

 

BTW...I noticed that Arch cut off your other nut today!

How could he.......he's already had both of them for a long time.

 

 

You're E.T. - the "Extra- testicle" BWAHAHAHAHA!

[fantastic_four]

1) Is it possible that CGC is wrong (i.e. has anyone had this happen to them)?

2) Would it be unethical to crack the slab and state that the original owner says that there is no restoration (but not disclose that CGC says there was)?

3) Sell the book in the slab, but name the Original Owner and say there is a difference of opinion between CGC and the Original Owner?

 

1) Yes, CGC is made up of fallible humans and their being wrong is built into their business model. CGC stands for Comics GUARANTY Corporation, not GUARANTEE corporation; they don't guarantee the grade or the statement of restoration. A guaranty is a good-faith best effort, not a legally binding promise.

 

2) Yes, it'd be unethical. Even though CGC is sometimes wrong, their opinion is professional, and to disclose a non-professional's opinion over a professional one is a breach of ethics. If the original owner were a dealer with some sort of relevant experience with restoration, it's a different matter, but if they're just your average collector or dealer who can't detect restoration, then the issue is much more clear. If you further stated that the book was unrestored in your own opinion, it could even be illegal unless you had specific evidence to refute CGC's opinion.

 

3) This sounds ethical because it lets the buyer make his own decision. It'd definitely be interesting to see how unslabbed restored books like this match up price-wise to slabbed restored books...they might sell for more outside the slab. Hard to say.

[sfilosa]

Thanks for all your input.

 

As a follow-up, I would never crack the slab and sell the book as unrestored (and I agree it would be unethical). If I really wanted to do that, I would never haven't sent it to CGC in the first place. I actually got a higher grade from CGC then I thought I would get so I'm glad it is graded.

 

 

Also, the person I bought the book from is (in my opinion) not your every day dealer. He is a long-time (40 year) collector and this book is from is "original collection". Therefore, it is not a case of him not being a restoration expert, it is more of a case of him, 1) lying 2) forgetting about color touching the book 3) CGC being wrong.

 

I betting on number two which would then lead to the assumption that he could have forgotten about other color touched books also.

 

 

 

 

 

[nochips]

CGC makes mistakes, we all do. Remember that Heritage Superman 5?? or was it 7? It was cleaned and resubmitted to CGC. The new label did not have restoration noted and we all can see the book went to Mr. Clean!It was the one with the letter"P" on the cover, plain as day it was a nicer copy than the first time it was slabbed and sold.

 

They missed that one, so they can also make an error and say a book has it, when in fact it may not??

 

The only thing you are obligated to disclose is restoration that you did/paid for on the book. Everything else may or may not be restoration? Who knows what went on with a book before you had it?

 

I am not saying cheat anyone, but why bring up something that can't be seen and or verifed with 100% certainty.

 

 

[LordRahl]

CGC makes mistakes. I'm sure resto'd books get by from time to time. But in your case I'm inclined to think the book is color touched. YOU suspected color touch before sending it in. CGC says there is color touch. The seller CLAIMS he never resto'd it. That adds up to a color touched book that he sold as unresto'd. If you, without the high tech equipment that CGC has, suspected color touch then who are you going to believe?