Manipulation and the Collector Appeal of High Grade

[tth2]

Alright, So High grade for a golden age book starts at 8.5 in your opinion.

Thanks TTH2 !

Just to be clear, high grade for ALL comic books starts at 8.5 in my opinion.

[Flaming_Telepath]

8.5 has always been the start of high grade for me too...irrespective of age.

 

Oh, and the GA 'grading curve' is nonsense...

[kc120us]

Alright, So High grade for a golden age book starts at 8.5 in your opinion.

Thanks TTH2 !

Just to be clear, high grade for ALL comic books starts at 8.5 in my opinion.

 

That's a good point, tth2. Age should not be a factor.

[action1kid]

All good answers and interesting. Thanks!

[Monstro]

my 2 reasons for collecting higher grade (or i should say the highest grade i can afford at the particular time of the purchase) are.

first i like owning a real nice example of what the book looked like when it was printed.

second even though i have no intention of selling my books. it just makes it easier for me to spend the money when i know i could

probably get it back. (if for some reason i had to....god forbid

).

 

this is the range i currently collect.

 

golden age 4.5 or better

early silver age 6.5 or better

silver age 8.0 or better

bronze 9.0 or better

[batman_fan]

F CGC's grade for GA, they are pretty clueless. A high grade golden age book is one that is clean of dust shadow, no foxing, clean edges a spine with minimal creases, at least some gloss remaining and nice off-white to white pages. That could be anything from a 5.0 to a 9.8 on CGC's scale, but it could also exclude CGC books up to a 9.0.

[kc120us]

my 2 reasons for collecting higher grade (or i should say the highest grade i can afford at the particular time of the purchase) are.

first i like owning a real nice example of what the book looked like when it was printed.

second even though i have no intention of selling my books. it just makes it easier for me to spend the money when i know i could

probably get it back. (if for some reason i had to....god forbid

).

 

this is the range i currently collect.

 

golden age 4.5 or better

early silver age 6.5 or better

silver age 8.0 or better

bronze 9.0 or better

 

what do you consider early silver age? Pre-marvel superhero?

[batman_fan]

A good example of a GA book that I think is absolutely terrible for CGC grading is the Larson Marvel Comics 1. That book is so faded it looks terrible. How CGC graded it so high is beyond me, but I am sure some label chaser will shell out some big bucks!

[Monstro]

my 2 reasons for collecting higher grade (or i should say the highest grade i can afford at the particular time of the purchase) are.

first i like owning a real nice example of what the book looked like when it was printed.

second even though i have no intention of selling my books. it just makes it easier for me to spend the money when i know i could

probably get it back. (if for some reason i had to....god forbid

).

 

this is the range i currently collect.

 

golden age 4.5 or better

early silver age 6.5 or better

silver age 8.0 or better

bronze 9.0 or better

 

what do you consider early silver age? Pre-marvel superhero?

 

yea, and really any of the main titles (asm, ff4)up to the 20's. just can't afford higher grade right now. unless i wanted to really slim down my collection. witch i don't want to do.

[FFB]

Ok. So whats your opinion for high grade?

To me, structural perfection is structural perfection, regardless of age. I consider NM/9.4 to be structural perfection. There shouldn't be a curve, in my opinion.

 

If you choose to collect Fine books from the GA, because it's too hard or too expensive to find NM books from that period, that's fine. But it doesn't make you a HG collector. Which is not to say that being a mid-grade collector of GA books isn't a lot more challenging than being a mid-grade collector of SA or BA books, but it doesn't make you a HG collector.

 

I generally agree that FN is mid-grade regardless of age. But the fact that someone owns a 6.0 copy of Action Comics #1 doesn't mean he's not a high grade collector. That one book is worth more than the entire collections of 99% of the people who claim to be HG collectors. For Action #1, unrestored FN 6.0 is a "relatively" high grade copy of that particular book, even though FN 6.0 is, strictly speaking, dead center in the mid-grade realm. So what I am saying is, I agree that FN 6.0 is not, technically speaking, "high grade," but just because someone owns a FN 6.0 copy of Action #1 doesn't mean that person isn't a "high grade collector."

[FFB]

I think historically HG has been considered to start at 8.5, so that's what I would say.

 

I'd say 8.0 as the HG threshold, but that's just my opinion. The breakdown in my mind is this:

 

0.5 to 3.5 - low grade

4.0-7.5 - mid grade

8.0+ - high grade

[tth2]

So what I am saying is, I agree that FN 6.0 is not, technically speaking, "high grade," but just because someone owns a FN 6.0 copy of Action #1 doesn't mean that person isn't a "high grade collector."

It's just semantics. Some people seem to equate "not high grade" with "not valuable" or "not desirable", but I'm saying they are not synonymous, nor should they be. I think someone who owns a 6.0 Action #1 (or an even more extreme example, an unrestored 4.0 All-American #16) does not have a high grade copy. It simply isn't.

 

I do, however, believe they have a very valuable and extremely desirable book, and for them to feel slighted or inferior somehow because their copy isn't considered to be "high grade", or now they won't be viewed as a "high grade collector", is silly.

[divad]

So what I am saying is, I agree that FN 6.0 is not, technically speaking, "high grade," but just because someone owns a FN 6.0 copy of Action #1 doesn't mean that person isn't a "high grade collector."

It's just semantics. Some people seem to equate "not high grade" with "not valuable" or "not desirable", but I'm saying they are not synonymous, nor should they be. I think someone who owns a 6.0 Action #1 (or an even more extreme example, an unrestored 4.0 All-American #16) does not have a high grade copy. It simply isn't.

 

I do, however, believe they have a very valuable and extremely desirable book, and for them to feel slighted or inferior somehow because their copy isn't considered to be "high grade", or now they won't be viewed as a "high grade collector", is silly.

 

I think the whole thing is rather silly . . .

[tth2]

I think the whole thing is rather silly . . .

You mean as opposed to the other things discussed on these boards?

[FFB]

So what I am saying is, I agree that FN 6.0 is not, technically speaking, "high grade," but just because someone owns a FN 6.0 copy of Action #1 doesn't mean that person isn't a "high grade collector."

It's just semantics. Some people seem to equate "not high grade" with "not valuable" or "not desirable", but I'm saying they are not synonymous, nor should they be. I think someone who owns a 6.0 Action #1 (or an even more extreme example, an unrestored 4.0 All-American #16) does not have a high grade copy. It simply isn't.

 

I do, however, believe they have a very valuable and extremely desirable book, and for them to feel slighted or inferior somehow because their copy isn't considered to be "high grade", or now they won't be viewed as a "high grade collector", is silly.

 

I agree with this post. I just thought you were originally saying that someone who has a HG collection except for a 6.0 Action #1 was not truly a HG collector. 6.0 is, by definition, "mid-grade" regardless of what book it is, in my condition.

[tth2]

I just thought you were originally saying that someone who has a HG collection except for a 6.0 Action #1 was not truly a HG collector.

If the only non-9.4 book that a collector has in his collection happens to be a 6.0 Action #1, I guess I'll go easy on him and still consider him to be a HG collector.

[awe4one]

I just thought you were originally saying that someone who has a HG collection except for a 6.0 Action #1 was not truly a HG collector.

If the only non-9.4 book that a collector has in his collection happens to be a 6.0 Action #1, I guess I'll go easy on him and still consider him to be a HG collector.

 

Even if it wasn't an Action #1, I would think it's the amount of HG/non-HG in the collection that would signify what kind of collector they are. If 80% of the collection is HG and the other 20% were GD then the collector would still be a HG guy in my opinion...

 

Jim

[tth2]

I just thought you were originally saying that someone who has a HG collection except for a 6.0 Action #1 was not truly a HG collector.

If the only non-9.4 book that a collector has in his collection happens to be a 6.0 Action #1, I guess I'll go easy on him and still consider him to be a HG collector.

 

Even if it wasn't an Action #1, I would think it's the amount of HG/non-HG in the collection that would signify what kind of collector they are. If 80% of the collection is HG and the other 20% were GD then the collector would still be a HG guy in my opinion...

 

Jim

I know. I was joking.

[awe4one]

I just thought you were originally saying that someone who has a HG collection except for a 6.0 Action #1 was not truly a HG collector.

If the only non-9.4 book that a collector has in his collection happens to be a 6.0 Action #1, I guess I'll go easy on him and still consider him to be a HG collector.

 

Even if it wasn't an Action #1, I would think it's the amount of HG/non-HG in the collection that would signify what kind of collector they are. If 80% of the collection is HG and the other 20% were GD then the collector would still be a HG guy in my opinion...

 

Jim

I know. I was joking.

 

Oh...that's what I get for missing most of a day on the Forum. Never mind...

 

Jim

[esquirecomics]

Just read a large chunk of the "Manufactured Gold" thread. Throughout the thread,

many posters suggest that a majority of collectors don't care about pressing

or other "undetectable" forms of manipulation.

 

In considering this claim, I thought about what it is that motivates collectors of high

grade books that do not intend to resell them:

 

1. A love for the aesthetic beauty of a really high grade book

2. An attraction toward the rarity of an older book that has survived in really high grade

3. The appeal of a book that, against all odds, has remained in its original condition

4. The sense of being transported back in time that a book in its original condition provides

5. The "pride of ownership" that one feels in owning one of the best examples of a given book

 

There may be other reasons I'm missing. However, in my opinion, books manipulated

into high grade offer almost none of the satisfaction (in terms of the above factors) that

books in their original, unaltered condition do.

 

In fact, to me, the greatest appeal of high grade books is being transported back to

the time of innocence in my life when they were new. Nothing ruins that feeling more

than finding out the book was manipulated into this state.

 

In short, I have a hard time understanding what the appeal of a manipulated

high grade book would be to a high grade collector with no intent to flip the book.

Can anyone offer insight?

 

Excellent post Paul. You summed it up perfectly.