Damaged during shipping?

[DiceX]

Here's a situation I am sitting with...

I buy a comic on eBay and pay for it quickly with Paypal.

The buy price is $20 and I pay $5 shipping and $1 insurance.

The package arrives very quickly. But it is in a bubble envelope almost twice as large as the book and has "Do Not Bend" written on it.

I notice the envelope does not appear to be in the best of shape and open up the package.

The comic was taped onto a very soft piece of cardboard with a couple of pieces of scotch tape. The tape has broken loose and the comic and board were bent over with a hard crease through the middle of my VF comic.

The spine of the book is bent and the comic is virtually worthless to me.

 

I email the seller and tell him what happened.

I also told him very nicely that I was not impressed with his packaging.

He has around 500 positves with no negs or neutrals and comments on how well he packs his comics.

He says he is mailing me the insurance receipt, and that he had it insured for $20.

 

This is where I am today.

My questions...

1) Will the postal insurance pay off? Even though is was obviously not packaged very well?

2) Do I deserve to get my full $26 refunded? Even though he only insured it for $20?

 

I come here seeking advice because right now it looks as though this could possibly turn ugly. Not to mention ending up in his (and my) first neutral or negative feedback.

 

I want this to end positive for both of us, but I don't know how to make it happen.

 

Anyway...What should I do next?

[ArAich]

Tell the seller that you are returning the book for a refund and let him handle the insurance claim...

[Warlord]

 

The max you can collect from the USPS is what the item was insured for -- you said $20, so that's it. They will not include S&I costs in the amount you could collect.

 

Just be glad you opted for insurance for your purchase from this joker, so you're not out the value of the comic too.

 

And yes, the USPS should pay off for the damage despite the flimsy packaging. The time for the USPS to object to having the package insured was when the insurance was purchased. Once they accepted payment for the insurance, I don't believe they'll try to back out using flimsy packaging as an excuse.

 

You will need to substantiate the value of the item. You'll want to start with a printout of the eBay auction listing.

 

And lastly, the seller should have been the one to deal with the hassle of the claim and the paperwork IMHO, but at least this way you won't have to wait and wonder when the guy is going to get reimbursed for the claim and send you the money I suppose.

[Bugaboo-migration]

Actually, I believe the proper procedure is for the person who received the package to fill out the insurance forms and submit them to the post office with the damaged item and all of the packaging material. That's what I had to do when I recieved a damaged item.

[fazman]

The odds are that this situation WILL turn ugly !!

You can try a few things:

- Ask for a full refund of $26 & offer to ship back the book at your expence.You'll be out the shipping back fee.( resonable). He may tell you to keep the book !!

- Ask for a full refund of $26 plus X$ extra to ship back his book. (bad)

- Ask for 1/2 you money back,tell him that you will look after the claim and once you have your claim $$, you will paypal him the other half you owe him.( resonable)

It's hard to believe that anyone with that many positives would package a book in such a way!!

Anyway,just a few ideas. I'm sure that others on this forum will have exprienced situations like this and will offer some good advice.

I turn the floor over to.......

 

 

[Warlord]

Actually, I believe the proper procedure is for the person who received the package to fill out the insurance forms and submit them to the post office with the damaged item and all of the packaging material. That's what I had to do when I recieved a damaged item.

 

Nope, the USPS allows either sender or recipient to file the claim for damaged items. Since the bozo packed the stuff so lamely, it would have been nice of him to take on responsibility for filing the claim. You'd still have to present the damaged items to the USPS and associate it with the insurance claim for the damage.

 

 

USPS Insurance Claim

 

More Instrux

 

2.1Who May File

 

A claim may be filed by:

 

a. Only the sender, for the complete loss of a registered, insured, COD, or Express Mail item (including merchandise return service parcels to which special services were added and paid for by the sender).

 

b. Either the sender or addressee, for damage or if some or all of the contents of an article are missing.

 

c. Only the merchandise return permit holder, for merchandise return service parcels that are registered or insured as indicated by the permit holder on the MRS label.

 

d. Only the sender, for bulk insured service mail.

[Darthdiesel]

Was the seller a Forum member? - there are still folks that insis on using bubble wrap envelopes and claiming that that is proper and sufficient packing - most folks that do this are shipping profiteeers, not willing to put the extra weight of heavy carton boards to make a safe comic sandwich witing the flimsy bubble wrap. I hate when this happens. Make the seller take care of the insurance on his end and have him send you an immediate refund out of his pocket. a good righteous seller would stand behind his service and see where the blame lies.

[DiceX]

Thanks for the response so far, everyone.

 

I honestly think he should take care of this, by me sending the package back to him.

But I don't think I should have to pay for the return shipping.

I did nothing wrong.

All I did was bid on his item and pay for it quickly.

 

He's the one that doomed this for failure.

 

I hate that this looks so grim over $26.

 

Anyone else have an idea?

[DiceX]

And no, I don't think it was a forum member.

But I could be wrong.

 

I never send comics in a bubble envelope.

I don't care if the book is $1, you can bet that it's packed in a stomp proof box.

I've received a few books in the bubble envelopes with no problem, but it's too much of a risk.

 

Heck I've even received a CGC book in a bubble envelope that made it with no problem. I was almost afraid to even open that package.

[Bugaboo-migration]

Nope, the USPS allows either sender or recipient to file the claim for damaged items. Since the bozo packed the stuff so lamely, it would have been nice of him to take on responsibility for filing the claim. You'd still have to present the damaged items to the USPS and associate it with the insurance claim for the damage.

Ok....but what's the point? You still have to present the damaged item and the packaging material to the post office so it doesn't save you a trip........and it's not like the claim form is hard to fill out and will punish him if he has to do it. I guess it might be a "courtesy" if he offered.......but all that it will really do is delay the process which would mean a delay in getting your refund.

[jonnydouble]

Actually, I believe the proper procedure is for the person who received the package to fill out the insurance forms and submit them to the post office with the damaged item and all of the packaging material. That's what I had to do when I recieved a damaged item.

 

Thanks you Bug...I remember when I brought up a thread like this a couple of months ago everyone...and I mean everyone said the insurance claim was my reponsiblity, not the shippers...

 

Plus you have to turn in the damaged item to the Post Office and it takes like 3 months to settle.

 

J.D.

 

In thread below I was told by several Forum members that the sellers obligations are null after he ships the package........I guess that depends on if you are a dealer or collector ,huh?

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=comicgen&Number=186991&Forum=All_Forums&Words=1971&Match=Username&Searchpage=13&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=186982&Search=true#Post186991

 

[Warlord]

Actually, I believe the proper procedure is for the person who received the package to fill out the insurance forms and submit them to the post office with the damaged item and all of the packaging material. That's what I had to do when I recieved a damaged item.

 

Thanks you Bug...I remember when I brought up a thread like this a couple of months ago everyone...and I mean everyone said the insurance claim was my reponsiblity, not the shippers...

 

Plus you have to turn in the damaged item to the Post Office and it takes like 3 months to settle.

 

J.D.

 

Didn't you see the USPS quotes above under the "Who may file" heading?

 

 

b. Either the sender or addressee, for damage or if some or all of the contents of an article are missing.

[jonnydouble]

Ok...now read this thread, where I was bashed by almost everyone who responded.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=comicgen&Number=186991&Forum=All_Forums&Words=1971&Match=Username&Searchpage=13&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=186982&Search=true#Post186991

[jonnydouble]

fantastic_four

I was posting here when you were in diapers.

 

 

 

Reged: 03/29/02

Posts: 3475

Loc: the Baxter Building, Virginia

Re: Doesn't insurance cover damage in transit?? [Re: jonnydouble]

#187011 - 06/07/03 01:34 PM Edit Reply Quote

 

 

 

If you paid for insurance through the USPS, then he IS doing you a favor. Damage in transit is between you and the USPS; the seller's responsibility ends once he mails it intact and pays the USPS the insurance cost.

 

--------------------

I'm primed and ready for the high-grade Silver Age market crash! WHERE IS IT!?!?? I REALLY WANT SOME DEALS!!!

 

 

 

[Warlord]

Ok...now read this thread, where I was bashed by almost everyone who responded.

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=comicgen&Number=186991&Forum=All_Forums&Words=1971&Match=Username&Searchpage=13&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=186982&Search=true#Post186991

 

Nah, not interested. Who "everyone" THINKS has the RESPONSIBILITY of filing? Not important to me.

 

Just IMHO as a courtesy the seller could have filed the paperwork is one point, and was making it clear that as far as the USPS is concerned, either shipper or recipient MAY file as my second point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[jbud73]

I buy more that I sell and usually take the buyers side cause I've seen some pretty heinous from sellers. However, lets look at this realistically for a second. The seller has 500 feedback with no negs, but I think we can all agree should have taken greater care in packing (I always ship singles in a bubble wrap envelope, however my comics are always bagged and boarded between two pieces of sturdy cardboard, you should see me take apart a cardboard box with a utility knife I'm pretty fast ) your item. I think its realistic to think that the seller should take care of this situation, HOWEVER, here is where the mailorder quirks kick in. If is was a store delevery you could return it and they could take care of it. But in order for the seller to rectify the situation the item has to be shipped back. I don't think that its realistic for the seller to pay to have the item shipped back, because the damage is still inflicted by the post office, who are really the guilty party.

 

Even though you didn't do anything I think its unrealistic to expect to recoup your shipping, every time I've returned something (twice), or had it returned to me (once) the shipping is moot, its the cost of doing business through the mail. Its like you drive to a comic shop, by a NM book, get to page 4 and theres a tear, or piece missing. You drive back the store refunds you money, I sincerely doubt they refund your gas, or bus, cab fare?

 

Advice - file the claim yourself, its not that difficult and really at this point is probably just easier than argueing over shipping, shipping back, waiting for the seller to fill it out and then waiting for your refund. Common sense needs to filter in here and hopefully both parties, who are good Ebayers by the sounds of it will continue with unblemished feedback. Fill out the forms, get your $20 back and maybe mutually agree to not leave feedback, with hopefully a lesson learned by the seller to pack a little more carefully.

 

Too bad we can't leave negatives for the Post Office

[Warlord]

But in order for the seller to rectify the situation the item has to be shipped back. I don't think that its realistic for the seller to pay to have the item shipped back, because the damage is still inflicted by the post office, who are really the guilty party.

 

Advice - file the claim yourself, its not that difficult and really at this point is probably just easier than argueing over shipping, shipping back, waiting for the seller to fill it out and then waiting for your refund.

 

 

You do NOT have to ship the item back to the seller when the seller submits the claim paperwork. From the USPS "More Instrux" link in one of my earlier posts:

 

2.8 Damage

 

If the addressee files the claim, the addressee must present the article with the packaging and mailing container to the USPS for inspection. If the sender files the claim and the addressee has the damaged article, the sender’s post office sends the claim to the addressee. The addressee then must present the article, packaging, and container to the USPS for inspection.

 

 

'Nuff said

 

[jbud73]

I stand corrected however, I still think this matter can be resolved rather easily by the buyer filling out some paper work and getting a refund.

[Bugaboo-migration]

You are correct. As I mentioned earlier, it would probably just be easier for you to do it and the paperwork is simple. Waiting on him to fill it out and mail it to you is only going to delay your refund and it won't save you a trip. You'll still have to go to the post office to file the paperwork along with the item and the packaging material.

[Warlord]

I still think this matter can be resolved rather easily by the buyer filling out some paper work and getting a refund.

 

 

"easily"? Are we both talking about the same USPS?