Hero Deficit: Comic Books in Decline. Toronto Star, March 18, 2007

[Bronty]

i'm not trying to back-track on my posts earlier, but i definitely agree comics have lagged behind general media in terms of getting up to speed, ethnically.

 

that said, i don't agree with this issue being the primary reason why comics have lost readership over the last 30 years.

 

totally agree.

[Aces]

What a bunch of hogwash. It just reads like Axel Alonso is po'd because hip-hop influences haven't overtaken superhero comics like it has other youth culture media.

 

If I had to guess at the decline factors for superhero comics I'd go with price, poor craftsmanship, and the distribution monopoly. If kids can't afford the price they're not going to buy. And even if comics were priced right and well written, kids won't buy if they're not readily available where they usually shop for other things.

 

Whats better for $9?

3 comics that you can read in 5 mins (10 if you go real slow) or a DVD with tons of your favorite songs?

 

Back in the day you could buy a big stack of 20/25 centers for the price of a LP vinyl record.

[lighthouse]

"In every other medium, the most successful concept or product is black. Whether it's music, movies, TV shows: out of the top 10, four of them are black," he says from his office at Black Entertainment Television, where he is an executive. "Who are the biggest movie stars? Jamie Foxx, Will Smith, Denzel Washington, Eddie Murphy. Only in comics are blacks so under represented. Somehow, in this medium people are so out of touch with popular culture that they don't understand that black culture is popular culture."

 

He didn't really just try to assert that those four are the four biggest movie stars, did he?

 

Eddie Murphy is the only one of those who is in the top 10 in lifetime box office (at #2 overall). Will Smith is at #13, Denzel is at #38, and Jamie Foxx, while certainly the best actor of the four, hasn't even passed Ice Cube and Chris O'Donnell (and sits at #160)...

 

You could make a case for Murphy and Smith to be in the top 10 biggest movie stars, but trying to suggest that those four names are all there is silly.

 

Comparing lifetime box office alone is certainly not the absolute standard. It doesn't adjust for inflation and over-rewards actors who are rarely the lead (like Samuel L Jackson at #9). But here is Box Office Mojo's top 20:

 

1 Tom Hanks $3,325.4 32 $103.9 Forrest Gump $329.7

2 Eddie Murphy $3,120.6 32 $97.5 Shrek 2 $441.2

3 Harrison Ford $3,093.4 29 $106.7 Star Wars $461.0

4 Tom Cruise $2,697.3 27 $99.9 War of the Worlds $234.3

5 Robin Williams $2,653.2 38 $69.8 Night at the Museum $245.3

6 Bruce Willis $2,395.1 43 $55.7 Sixth Sense $293.5

7 Julia Roberts $2,204.3 31 $71.1 Ocean's Eleven $183.4

8 Robert DeNiro $2,199.3 55 $40.0 Meet the Fockers $279.3

9 Samuel L. Jackson $2,153.7 46 $46.8 Revenge of the Sith $380.3

10 Mel Gibson $2,022.2 30 $67.4 Signs $228.0

11 Ian McKellen $2,009.6 25 $80.4 Return of the King $377.0

12 Orlando Bloom $1,970.2 10 $197.0 Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Man's Chest $423.3

13 Will Smith $1,965.9 16 $122.9 Independence Day $306.2

14 Jim Carrey $1,945.7 19 $102.4 The Grinch $260.0

15 John Travolta $1,914.6 36 $53.2 Grease $188.4

16 Morgan Freeman $1,867.1 36 $51.9 Bruce Almighty $242.8

17 Cameron Diaz $1,783.7 21 $84.9 Shrek 2 $441.2

18 Tommy Lee Jones $1,765.1 33 $53.5 Men in Black $250.7

19 Elijah Wood $1,754.1 23 $76.3 Return of the King $377.0

20 Dustin Hoffman $1,715.3 33 $52.0 Meet the Fockers $279.3

 

And that doesn't even get you down to some big "movie star" names, like Jack Nicholson, Nicolas Cage, Johnny Depp, Brad Pitt, and so on...

 

While I agree that blacks are under-represented in comic books, you could just as easily make the assertion that whites are under-represented in hip-hop videos.

 

In both cases, the producers are after the almighty dollar. And if the dollars lead them to include characters who are green with orange stripes, you better believe that there will be characters who are green with orange stripes. Music producers in the 50s and 60s sold "black" music to "white" America because the money was there. And any success along those lines just led to more records being produced. Comic companies have made numerous attempts to sell black characters to their customers, using some damn fine writers and artists, and the books don't sell. If the money is not there, you won't see the representation.

[14 of spades]

(this is just an aside to ur point...

 

>Comparing lifetime box office alone is certainly not the absolute standard. It doesn't adjust for inflation and over-rewards actors who are rarely the lead (like Samuel L Jackson at #9).

 

9 Samuel L. Jackson $2,153.7 46 $46.8 Revenge of the Sith $380.3

 

it seems the "lifetime" box-office tally is the total gross of all the movies that particular actor was a part of. though SLJ was never a lead, the fact that he appeared in that many high-grossing films is a credit to him, and he belongs where he does on the list.)

[delekkerste]

color does factor in somewhat, because many of the friends i grew up with would complain that none of the comic book characters looked liked them, i.e. there as no one to relate to (and for reference sake, i grew up in the hood). my grandfather would take me to the reservation (he was half white, half blackfoot) and i'd get the same thing "are there any native american heroes?"

 

Comics could be far better written and have a much more ethnically diverse cast of characters and it wouldn't translate into a renaissance for comic book sales. Sales would probably go up, because existing readers would likely buy more titles, but how would any non-collectors hear about it? Lack of marketing, limited distribution through specialty shops, better value for one's entertainment dollar elsewhere, etc. are still going to outweigh the effect of any improvement in the underlying content.

[gpanalysis]

Excuse this as it’s late here…

 

I don't know if there is any evidence that the lack of black super-heroes has caused a decline in readership (after all, when readership was high it wasn't due to the plethora of black super-heroes), but I think readership has a lot to do with relevance to the world around us (and this goes for movies, books, etc).

 

During the Golden Age of comics, it was about the emergence of a super-power - about going to war, about coming back home from war, about building a country and a world where ideals were still being thought through and applied to a changing landscape. Comic book stories, and super-heroes, reflected these changes. A little later, they expanded to include the fears and paranoia of a nation that once again began to look beyond its borders - there was the threat of communism and its impact on a life (and a set of values) that had been constructed over decades.

 

In the 60's and 70's there was a sense of awakening, of a sexual and political change of pace that exploded from within the boundaries of what was a new order after decades of war. Look back to the super-heroes of this time - sometimes awkward, fragile, challenging the world around them and ultimately themselves - questioning the motives of those close to them, grappling with issues of race, tolerance, drugs, emotions. Their anxieties were our anxieties. They may have had the ability to climb up walls, or smash through buildings, but their human side was just that, and they were real.

 

In the early 80’s, when Moore unleashed upon us a transsexual terrorist, and in the mid 80’s, when Frank Miller produced Batman: The Dark Knight Returns, there was that same feeling of another wave, at once engaging with a new set of readers, and a rejuvenation of interest by existing fans. Batman TDNR, and comics of its type, took those familiar characters (hero, super-hero and anti-hero), transplanted them from landscapes that were now secured in the past, and made them look into an abyss of shocking truths – that abyss was a mirror, and it reflected their own reality with that of a new transfigured environment, an environment void of the clichés of the past. The super-heroes were challenged like never before – these super humans were confronted with very human truths, awful truths, and they couldn’t be “fixed” by super strength or powers.

 

I still visit my local comic book shop and I still buy (and read) comics. Recently my five year old son has started to devour anything super-hero. And although he finds Spider-Man, and Batman, and Superman and all the other superheroes that sprung from the first part of the 20th century exciting, I question whether the current stories will keep him coming back as he grows up. As exciting as Batman TDNR was in the 80’s, that same gritty reality just doesn’t seem to cut it today. We’ve moved on, and I don’t mean “we” as in comic book readers, I mean all of society. The “connect” is there; after all, creators, writers, artists, they all live and eat and sleep in the same world we do. But the super-heroes they portray may not have caught up.

[Forbush-Man]

What about distribution? Used to be you could buy comics at most convience stores and drug stores. Many smaller towns don't have comic shops. Seems to me this would have more to do with the lower readership....

[Rodey]

From what I gather, what we need are "Heroes" (any race or creed) that represent the current pulse of our time. But what is that pulse? 9/11? the environment? Iraq War?

 

How do you create a new hero that can be equated with Superman, Batman, or Spiderman? These characters are so ingrained into our culture already and psyche already. We need another John Stewart Green Lantern. Hmm....

[delekkerste]

I still visit my local comic book shop and I still buy (and read) comics. Recently my five year old son has started to devour anything super-hero. And although he finds Spider-Man, and Batman, and Superman and all the other superheroes that sprung from the first part of the 20th century exciting, I question whether the current stories will keep him coming back as he grows up. As exciting as Batman TDNR was in the 80’s, that same gritty reality just doesn’t seem to cut it today. We’ve moved on, and I don’t mean “we” as in comic book readers, I mean all of society. The “connect” is there; after all, creators, writers, artists, they all live and eat and sleep in the same world we do. But the super-heroes they portray may not have caught up.

 

Hi George,

 

You definitely bring up some thoughtful and interesting points. However, I'm not sure if I agree with your assessment of currently produced super-hero comics - I think creators today have gone to paintstaking lengths to try and make their characters and stories more "relevant" than ever and reflective of present social and political trends. Pop culture references and current slang are employed more than ever in comics. Stories have addressed current themes of the day, such as terrorism (witness the Captain America stories from the past 5 years) and civil liberties ("Civil War"). Other stories have harshly exposed human frailties to bring superheroes into the "real world" (witness the horrible "Sins Past" storyline in ASM and DC's brutal "Identity Crisis"). Even the concept of the super-hero secret identity has been turned upside down in a world where technology and tabloid journalism are pervasive (witness Spidey and Daredevil in the past few years).

 

That's not to say that the stories produced today are better than in the past. Personally, I would prefer them to be a little more detached from the brutal realities of daily life and more fun. The bottom line, though, is that I think that the portrayal of super-heroes in comics is more "relevant" than ever, but that comics themselves are not. Clearly, the public has shown that it wants its super-hero fix in multiplexes and through videogame consoles, while comics are viewed as a very niche hobby at best and outdated and antiquated at worst. Any change in the content, whether to reflect more diversity or more cultural relevance, is, unfortunately, unlikely to change that.

 

Gene

[Davenport]

 

Hi George,

 

You definitely bring up some thoughtful and interesting points. However, I'm not sure if I agree with your assessment of currently produced super-hero comics - I think creators today have gone to paintstaking lengths to try and make their characters and stories more "relevant" than ever and reflective of present social and political trends. Pop culture references and current slang are employed more than ever in comics. Stories have addressed current themes of the day, such as terrorism (witness the Captain America stories from the past 5 years) and civil liberties ("Civil War"). Other stories have harshly exposed human frailties to bring superheroes into the "real world" (witness the horrible "Sins Past" storyline in ASM and DC's brutal "Identity Crisis"). Even the concept of the super-hero secret identity has been turned upside down in a world where technology and tabloid journalism are pervasive (witness Spidey and Daredevil in the past few years).

 

That's not to say that the stories produced today are better than in the past. Personally, I would prefer them to be a little more detached from the brutal realities of daily life and more fun. The bottom line, though, is that I think that the portrayal of super-heroes in comics is more "relevant" than ever, but that comics themselves are not. Clearly, the public has shown that it wants its super-hero fix in multiplexes and through videogame consoles, while comics are viewed as a very niche hobby at best and outdated and antiquated at worst. Any change in the content, whether to reflect more diversity or more cultural relevance, is, unfortunately, unlikely to change that.

 

Gene

Great points.

So maybe the decline isn't the content, but how the format is marketed? The article hints at that:

"Others point to the increased popularity of bookstore-friendly graphic novels, sales of which have recently surpassed traditional comics."

 

Well, graphic novels are the exact same content repackaged for general public consumption, and apparently sales are rising. Comic books, on the other hand, are direct (niche) marketed in specialty stores. So whatever growth they expect has to include developing new fans willing to over pay for content, and go out of their way to purchase it.

[ignimbrite]

To add a bit about the source of this information (the Toronto Star), the newspaper has a bit of a history bringing up a racial angle to many of it's stories if they are founded or not. Personally I have not read a Toronto Star for years as I stopped the day the front page read 'The White Jays' with them implying the Toronto Blue Jays had a bias against African-American and Latino players.

[dekeuk]

The reasons for the decline of comics circulation:

 

1. Prices way too high for kids (the #1 reason)

 

2. Not that readily available to many kids (i.e. the corner store)

 

3. Many kids don't like to read anymore, its easier just to play a video game

 

4. Massive choice of entertainment for kids these days compared to pre-1980 (internet, video games, gameboys, DVD, 24 hour cartoon channels, 500 channel universe, music CDs, MP3, ipod, arcades, etc.)

 

5. Comic stories are not written for kids anymore, they are written for adults who want to keep reading (or at least buying) comics

 

6. Kids are too "sophisticated and savvy" these days to buy into the concept of comics, I mean really, can you see the average 9 year old being entertained by the ridiculous plotlines in the comic stories that were published in the 1955 to 1965 era? Comics of today have better art and high paper quality than ever before, compare the visual experience of a modern comic to a 1950's comic, but this does not seem to matter. The problem with comic sales is NOT a lack of quality in either story or art.

 

The lack of black characters is a ridiculous argument, there were no black characters at all in the 1940's and the comics sold 1 million per issue when the population of the USA was 1/3 what it is today. There are more white kids in the USA now than at any point in history, so comics should be at least selling to these kids in record numbers, but they are not for the previously listed reasons.

 

Eventually comics will probably evolve (or de-volve) from a printed medium to an interactive medium, where you will pay to download new issues of Spiderman to your computer with some kind of digital rights management system so you can't let your friends read them. This will hopefulyl keep the characters alive so they can make movies about them and sell toys (where the eral money in comics is made these days). The comics themselves serve as loss leaders.

[comicwiz]

I still visit my local comic book shop and I still buy (and read) comics. Recently my five year old son has started to devour anything super-hero. And although he finds Spider-Man, and Batman, and Superman and all the other superheroes that sprung from the first part of the 20th century exciting, I question whether the current stories will keep him coming back as he grows up. As exciting as Batman TDNR was in the 80’s, that same gritty reality just doesn’t seem to cut it today. We’ve moved on, and I don’t mean “we” as in comic book readers, I mean all of society. The “connect” is there; after all, creators, writers, artists, they all live and eat and sleep in the same world we do. But the super-heroes they portray may not have caught up.

 

Hi George,

 

You definitely bring up some thoughtful and interesting points. However, I'm not sure if I agree with your assessment of currently produced super-hero comics - I think creators today have gone to paintstaking lengths to try and make their characters and stories more "relevant" than ever and reflective of present social and political trends. Pop culture references and current slang are employed more than ever in comics. Stories have addressed current themes of the day, such as terrorism (witness the Captain America stories from the past 5 years) and civil liberties ("Civil War"). Other stories have harshly exposed human frailties to bring superheroes into the "real world" (witness the horrible "Sins Past" storyline in ASM and DC's brutal "Identity Crisis"). Even the concept of the super-hero secret identity has been turned upside down in a world where technology and tabloid journalism are pervasive (witness Spidey and Daredevil in the past few years).

 

That's not to say that the stories produced today are better than in the past. Personally, I would prefer them to be a little more detached from the brutal realities of daily life and more fun. The bottom line, though, is that I think that the portrayal of super-heroes in comics is more "relevant" than ever, but that comics themselves are not. Clearly, the public has shown that it wants its super-hero fix in multiplexes and through videogame consoles, while comics are viewed as a very niche hobby at best and outdated and antiquated at worst. Any change in the content, whether to reflect more diversity or more cultural relevance, is, unfortunately, unlikely to change that.

 

Gene

 

George/Gene, you both raise some interesting points. There will be those that think that comics should not dwell on the brutal realities so much - they're the readers that would look to comics as a form of escape. Same criticism musicians get when they start covering political themes in their music.

 

Understanding what interests todays readers partly rests on having stories and characters that are representative of different ethnic groups.

 

At its most basic level of understanding, if comics are looked at as just another form of entertainment, then the other part is the brutal reality - there are far too many entertainment choices competing with comics.

 

In no way am I suggesting that it would not help, but I think that the difficulty in appealing to readers with divided interests could just as easily account for the drop in readership as well as any issue over a need for great ethnic diversity and representation in comics.

 

As far as the article is concerned, this is the second article I've read now from the Star in less than a 6 month period that really makes me question the research methods used by their journalists, and their motivations.

 

The first demonstrated an equally unusual leap in logic, leaving me with some of my own questions over the quality of journalism over at the Star.

[Rodey]

Oh, and didn't some rapper create his own comic last year? I thought I saw something in an issue of Wizard.

[Hawkman]

a lack of black or multi cultural characters is in no way a "ridiculous argument." as the main reason for a decline in sales, yes, but it does factor in somewhat. as i've said, it's not the reason comics sell less than they did in the past, but within urban communities, it is one reason that many kids don't follow comic book characters. white kids don't have a problem finding someone to identify with, thus it's hard to understand from a white point of view. as you grow up, from history books to magazines, to tv shows, movies, and political figures, you see and hear and are taught about plenty of white men and women, but within other races and cultures, this is sometimes non existent (esp for native americans) or at the best, under represented, which is why it's important to have good strong characters you can identify with.

 

now obviously, comics sold more in the 40's etc because kids didn't have 2-3 tv's in their home, or any at all. there were no computers, cell phones, video games, skateboards, dvds, cds, etc. plus, as i've said, i'd be willing to bet there weren't as many comics published, and of course comic book prices were much more affordable. also, personally, i think comic art was much better, but that's just me.

[sterlingcomics]

The article starts well but fails to deliver on its premise with needless politically correct banter that fails to support the article. Perhaps we are such a sensitive nation that comics can't survive because of all of the potential groups we can infuriate.

 

I do agree with the basis that comics aren't as fun and affordable as other forms of entertainment currently available.

[Hawkman]

not some rapper. it was public enemy, one of the greatest groups of all time (all music, not just hip hop)