justafan

Thats why i had mine signed and witnessed by Matt. So when CGC supprts catalog sized holders ill submit it.

I was reading a bit through the book's grading scale of assigned defects and while its not going to spell out what specific defects on your books will get what grades it does give you some insight on their quantification and qualification of some defects. Also, it is written more than once in the book as a disclaimer that grading standards has changed many times at cgc since its inception in 2000 and that this book is only a point in time guide to the current grading standards which can and will be different in the future such that those standards and guidance in the book may no longer apply in a year, 2 or 3+ years down the road depending on what new advances in grading occurs.

There were definitly fewer dealers and not as many large long box dealers as in the past. I was able to knock out all my comic shopping by 6pm friday after being there all day thirsday as well. In years past i wouldnt be done hitting all dealers until midday saturday. I spent more on exclusives than i did in years past which shows where that trend is going. I only have 4 more years of buying exclusives and variants before im out of that game altogether. Thanks for the sunday report @MisterX I wanted to stay for deals but i was tired and had no more room left for my purchases in my bags by friday. This show is evolving and may be due to the high booth prices. A mid aisle booth was going for around $4k. A large corner booth cost around $7k. Flights and hotels for the weekend add another $3-4k. Dealers have to be bringing in $7-$11k in profit just to break even. I can see where lots of dealers snag exclusives and signings for resale to help offset the cost. And why exclusives with high profit margins are more prevalent to help defray costs. I only heard of a few large purchases. $30k SA book, a few large deals, but wonder if the margin was enough to make the show profitable. How many dealers just eat it and consider it advertising for collectors. I only spent around around $2000 (vs way more in prior years) at this show mainly due to high prices and limited space in my bags. About $450 on graded books and the rest on raws at a combined 9 dealers.

Heres my quick report: Trained in wed night, from DC. hung out and crashed with friends in Jersey City so i would get to the con on time. Thursday morning. Grabbed gourmet latte and cresant. Promptly missed 3 busses and ended up getting to the con an hour late. Transportation and goal fail. Found the Comic Mint exclusives line and got in line about 200 people deep at that point. Goal unlocked. 3 hours later I dropped $500 on a bunch of exclusives including the ASM NYCC exclusive. Goal achieved. Hit the CGC booth at 1pm to drop off my submissions i had already prepped through the online form. Inquirrd about pay for grades secret menu option but either she wasnt aware, played dumb, or i didnt use the right password to unlock that access. Took me only 5 min, no line. Primary Goal acheived. Inquired about talking to grades and told to come back at 1pm tomorrow to see Matt. Hit all the other con exclusive booths that dodnt have lines and blew another $1000. Budget goal fail. Sat down and had a banana and water for lunch. Psuedo lunch goal acheived. Began my regular marathon of run-filling hunt going from dealer to dealer diving through long boxes and squinting at the wall books. Very few dealers willing to budge even on bulk purchases or paying cash. Im not staying til sunday so it was deal or no deal. Huge markups, lots of passing on books but still managed to fill 50% of the luggage space i have. Finished Thursday making it through the first 2 rows of dealers. Overall thursday was a success. Found out one of my friends is now very rich after selling his company. Side quest unlocked. Had greek food and an older fashioned hanging out on my friends boat. Friday morning packed up and said goodbye to my friends. Hate goodbyes. Caught the first bus and got to the con on time., goal acheived. Continued marathon of run-filling, comic diving, negotiating, and chatting with dealers and collectors. No internet access, lots of bandwidth issues preventing cc sales. Found some good deals, needed cash, went on side quest for the atm. Returned with cash, bought more books. Budget goal continues to be failed. Hit the CGC booth at 1pm, No Matt but did see a Tod McFarlane showing off a piece of OA and doing signings. Took some video and pics. Asked about seeing Matt and was told to come back at 3. Continued comic book hunting making my way through another 2 rows of dealers. Returned to the CGC booth at 3 and got in line. Checked out the new CGC guide to grading. Saw Matt, had him review my 1 book and received his opinion and advice. Asked him about his new guide to grading and whether it was a replacement or supplement to the overstrreet grading guide. He explained: For experienced graders, it is meant more as a reference to be used as a tool in conjunction with other grading guides. For novices it helps quickly close the knowledge gap on all aspects of determining comic book condition and value. Only agreed to buy a copy if Matt signed it for free. He wasnt charging for autographs anyways. Bought a copy of the CGC grading guide at $29.99 and got Matt to sign the inside 1st page. Had the signing documented by the cgc photographer as content for the 2nd edition. Asked if he counts as his own signature series whitness and would slab it. Was told CGC doesnt make holders big enough. Secondary goal achieved with 2 bonuses. Stayed and watched him review about 20 golden age beauties. Listened and watched how he handled and examined the books for defects, restoration, and pressing candidacy aided by a square retractable loup that is no longer made. Satisfying to see that my own grading practices and grade estimation for the books are very similar to his. Continued marathon comic hunt. Filled up all my luggage space with books. With no more space and feeling I should leave. Found myself by the whatnot and Marvel booths. Took lots of videos. Made a few take it or leave it offers to dealers just to try and justify any more buying. None bit so I walked away. Feels good to walk away sometimes. Took picture with Demigorgon. Finished hitting every comic dealer at NYCC and made some final purchases despite have absolutely no more room in my luggage. Found a whatnot bag on the floor and used that to carry my excess. Avoided and resisted buying overpriced t-shirts and nycc souvenirs for my family. Exited the con and hoofed it to NYC Penn station to catch my train. Got another contact high. My 13 y/o swiss army roller case lost most of both wheels but made it. Grabbed a burger and soda and boarded the accela back to DC. Friday goals mostly successful.

I made it to my friends house in Jersey city and navigated the Path from Newark penn station with the help of a friendly neighborhood homeless person who helped me getting my luggage over the turnstyle. I tipped him for his help. On the crowded Path 119 bus today 10 min from the con after missing several 123 and 87 busses due to unfamiliarity with being ready at the stop. Lol. See you all there, maybe.

Oh nice! Ive got to look into that. What ferry and departure location?

Well looks like my trip to NYCC is back on. A dear old college friend agreed to host me in Jersey City so I'll be commuting in from there daily via bus and train. I'm looking forward to checking out all the cool comics, making some good buys, and geeking out over cool comics again. It's been too long since my last convention.

The range I've seen is 8.0 to 9.6. 8.0 if the color rub is in lengthy streaks and noticeably more than a few spots along spine on the front and back cover. 9.6 if it's only 1-2 small spots near the back cover staples. That book, if the grader takes notice of it, would probably fall in the 9.2/9.4 range if it is otherwise perfect. That color rub flaw is prevalent on books from that era and I've seen CGC give a pass to some with similar scuffing but to a lesser noticeable degree considering it as a production defect similar to the bindery tears on the oversized issues. Still, for any raw moderns I'm looking to get graded I always check for ink/color rub/scuffing on back covers before buying. When buying these books already graded in 9.8, you should also check the back cover as some did slip through in 9.8.

I would actually split them like this: 1. GA/SA - I feel the shaded part of the Venn diagram circles of collectors that can both afford and are interested in these ages have more in common than the other ages. (GA ~18 year range) (SA ~ 13/14 year range) (32 year total) 2. BA/CA - the collectors that grew up with these eras as well as the collectors priced out of the GA/SA market likely have more in common and interest for these books that are starting to pop due to recognition of the great art, character first appearances, and storylines, movie-hype and speculation than the other ages. (BA ~ 15 year range) (CA ~ 6/7 year range) (22 years total). This also narrows the field of searches for the GA and SA collectors that don't care for anything higher than the early 60's. 3. Modern - Modern age now encompasses 3 decades which is greater than the previous 2 ages combined and will equal all 4 prior ages in 24 years. There are people now in their 30's that grew up reading only moderns. This isolates moderns from any of the other prior age collectors that don't care to see these books in their searches and vice versa. Modern could be the new MISC as well but that might turn it into the forum where all the attention ends up and defeats the purpose of the other 2 sub-forums. Unless we split all 5 eras up, these are the 3 that I feel will have the most crossover taste with the fewest number of sub-forums.

The catch is that pages won't ever stop aging. One day, all GA/SA/BA/CA comic pages will no longer be white despite what the CGC case says. Some will get there faster but eventually, even books stored in perfectly climate and humidity controlled rooms will begin to succumb to the decomposition of the paper. Possibly only books stored in air-tight rooms in a vacuum may persist but those may have already succumbed to enough degradation to be irreversible.

While holding the physical original comic, on a tufted genuine leather high wingback chair in a wood paneled library, sitting room, or home theater setting with with my feet up on a comfortable ottoman by a low standing but bright warm yellow incandescent light next to an end table with frequent sips from a glass of Gran Marnier (no ice), Four Roses bourbon or a low ball glass of 18+ y/o scotch on the rocks and music from the year of the book I'm reading playing in stereo surround sound. In the winter, a warm fire on the fire place is a must.

$300 for tickets! Oh you were probably talking about going all 4 days. Yeah, no, I don't go on Saturdays or Sundays unless some really amazing guest or artist is appearing. Thursday and Friday are my favorite days to go and I can usually hit every comic dealer by Friday evening so I'm only $140 into the show. Even Sunday was an absolute S-show with the crowds blocking all the alleys between dealers last time I went before the pandemic. That time I did go on Sunday I was hoping to negotiate some last day deals with dealers but couldn't ever make it to the specific dealers booths to negotiate due to having to fight the crowds of POPs toy shoppers, cosplayers, gawkers, photographers, and vloggers clogging the aisles. @Jaybuck43 as a relatively local attendee with no hotel expense, if you're passing on going for even a day it really makes me doubt spending an additional $600 to attend for 2 days.

I was beginning to question my motivation (or lack thereof) about going to this show until I read your comment and some other's comments on here. I know of a couple of dealers that have already backed out of the show and know the big studios and toy companies aren't attending. Plus the guest list is so weak it doesn't offer any alternative fringe benefits of attending if the comic dealer presence is weak. On the other hand that might make it less crowded and less competitive for shopping. At least the hallways will be less congested. However, if Baltimore is going to have 95% of the same dealers and there's not going to be any real difference in comic stock from NYCC to Baltimore I might as well just sell my NYCC tickets and save my money for Baltimore. That'll leave me with at least an extra $600 to spend in Baltimore which is the 2 night hotel and food + amtrak budget I'm shooting for NYCC. Honestly, now I'm even questioning why I'm spending $600 to attend a con where I might not net a deal or a rare-in-the-wild find that would make up for the expense. In year's past I would take my family and make a vacation out of it to justify the expense but this year it's just me so it really doesn't justify the cost. I'm curious to hear what other attendees on here who live far enough away that a hotel stay is a requirement to attend are feeling about this show. Is it going to be worth it for you to attend? Am I nuts for considering spending $600 just to be able to attending this show or is that a normal outlay for most folks who regularly attend?

Good suggestions. I'll look into the LIRR. It'll depend on the hotel cost savings and how much the LIRR round trip and last return times are. I usually max out my time at the con getting in when the doors open at 10am to the public and leave after 7pm dodging the ushers while I'm making my rounds completing some final purchases from dealers. I was going to look at staying in Queens or Brooklyn and taking the subway as I've been to NYC enough to be familiar with how to navigate the lines. Even the hotels in Queens and the other boroughs are pretty pricey for a 2 night stay. Manhattan is ridiculous. Not looking to pay $400-700 just to guarantee a private bathroom but I also don't want to risk bedbugs and rough neighborhoods either.

After years of chasing and examining 9.9s and 10.0s of all ages (except GA) and often being disappointed in not seeing any difference from really good looking 9.8's I've found they don't deserve the grade condition notation (and definitely not 1000%+ price difference) especially when there are 9.9s and 10's with miswraps, spine ticks, cover overhangs, and off-white/white pages. It makes absolutely no sense putting any higher of a value or price that there's anything exceptional or more valuable about a 9.9 or 10. The only stock I put into those grades is that they might might have been the result of an immature grading period or a reward for a dedicated submitter/partner especially after this most recent acetate fiasco. No my friends, that 9.9 or 10 only looks impressive because of the gold coloring on the grade and maybe if you place a copy of its CGC census page next to it. Maybe later on CGC will add a new color to the 9.8 grade to make it pop and stand out from the other lesser grades.

Exactly, it was done with the Limited print run ASM Mayhew 238 homage (800?) variant for CBCS Signature Series. He advertised it as a CBCS SS exclusive and refused to sell raw to anyone. He supposedly had the remainder copies destroyed but never showed proof of them actually being destroyed. Not sure if CBCS ever showed proof of them being destroyed either. But some enterprising individuals have cracked them out of the CBCS slab, had Mayhew draw/remark over his own signature with a CGC witness and resubmitted to CGC to receive a CGC signature series for those OCD enough to only want their comics in a CGC slab. The risk is getting Mayhew to agree to do it and having the book come back the same grade if it's a 9.8.

FTFY

Good to know and also surprised this is the only thread for NYCC. Is there just not much excitement for this con or is everyone just too wiped out from the summer to bother going?

This is kind of my fear on how they (CGC/Black Flag/Crain) will skirt by this whole thing in a matter of months and come out looking like innovators. The pros for an acetate cover is that it is made from natural resources such as wood pulp, is biodegradable, and can be composted/incinerated with no harm to the environment. Other pros may be that they are reactive to heat and high temperatures meaning they may behave like regular comic covers and can be humidified and pressed with a heat press. The cons with an acetate cover is that the fibers wrinkle easily and may leave permanent creases/wrinkles that can't be pressed out (like color break creases on regular covers). The fibers are also easily susceptible to abrasion due to surface wear, rubbing, and friction. This could result in a dulling, scratched, or loss of art from the cover. Hence, not necessarily a more protective cover for the underlying paper cover art but a fancier way to display that underlying paper cover art. My original thought was that the acetate covers may become a more protective cover for the underlying comic or variant that could be exploited for removing the acetate cover and grading the underlying variant cover especially if the publishers decide to only use the original 2 staples when constructing it. The standard going forward for publishers could be to use it as an add-on variant like the blank sketch cover or in addition to it as a bit of creativity for sketch covers. Imagine an acetate cover with some generic or suggetive art that can become something more interesting when the blank cover under it is used by an artist to sketch on it creating a unique and interesting scene when overlaying the acetate cover over the sketch. Too many opportunities may exist for this to remain a controversy for long. Of course, the market will ultimately decide.

Well, with respect to gifted or preferential grades I can think of one they compare perfectly with (PGX, and possibly others). As for grading bootlegged comics as Universal I'm not sure if such a precedent has been set with any of the other existing grading companies. Perhaps a boardie with more experience or better memory can chime in on which other grading company (past or present) has ever graded a bootlegged comic as Universal and not notated it on the label as Counterfeit or Bootleg. If none exist then, yes, I suppose CGC is correct in that way alone, that "No other third-party grading service compares to CGC..." Though, that's not something I would advertise or consider a good quality of an "accurate and impartial grading" service.

I'm really sorry about that because for many years until now CGC restored confidence in back issue sales, restoration verification, strict grading standards, and preservation of comic books but on the bright side you've spared yourself a huge waste of an investment in time, money, and effort unlike many of us with books that have basically been devalued back to their raw unofficial Overstreet graded status with a CGC blue labeled numerical opinion that's worth less than the toilet paper remaining on the roll in your bathroom. The one silver lining to all of this is that many perfect 9.8's in a collection can now be considered 9.9 or above and many perfect looking 9.6's are likely to be fairly considered as 9.8's. Really the CGC 9.6 to 9.8 lines have been so blurred as to render the grade differentiation useless with the only value differentiator being the blue label. Now that the legitimacy behind that is gone it won't matter any more.

They don't even have to bother with a response. Their lack of response on that IS the answer. It's pretty obvious and evident to anyone with a brain that they are standing by the grades that they were paid to give. However, if they wanted to, for the sake of humoring us, they could just clarify and state that in this specific case, they only assigned the grade of the acetate cover. Which, if that were the case, should also be noted on the label going forward. But then again, that's still like closing the barn door after the horse has already ran off. Barring a suit from Marvel to recall the bootlegged books, I don't see this changing or improving their reputation on it. And that's probably not even worth Marvel's time. We just have to decide for ourselves if we want continue supporting this grading company's standard and brand.

yeah, for their FMV. There and maybe GPA on any graded issues that sell if they don't do any follow up other than scrape or subscribe to the ebay sales. a few months down the road you'll still have folks shelling out 3-5k for a 9.8 based on fake ebay sales.

this is a perfect and colorful analogy of what CGC did and how bad it stinks.

I know but I'm grasping at whatever excuse I can think of to believe CGC does NOT have a systemic fraud problem here that goes to the top. I think I'm in the denial phase of this whole mess.