1classics

Yeah agreed Francesco's newsletter is very insightful.

Considering this was over $10k+ with hours to go and 160+ watchers, I’m sort of surprised it didn’t go higher. I know Heritage has only sold one page from this arc and went for $8.8k last year, probably a good deal with Death on it, but not as good of a page. These pages trade privately for much more, I heard estimates this would hit 20k+, maybe more to the right 2 people… More importantly this is a very significant page to the story, a turning point of sorts where Death realizes she’s reached Sexton and is heading to Central Park for her own Death. The content with Sexton asking Didi about Death and where you go is also great, as well as the Death images throughout the page. The way things are going with Sandman related pages, this is what I consider a one and done page by the definitive Death artist and story arc. Congrats to the seller and the buyer.

It certainly will be an interesting one... The only way I see stuff "slipping" or "forgotten" in this one is if people who normally buy larger lots in Thursday's platinum session don't have the patience to watch all Friday to have those lots mixed in. I see this actually working to Heritage's advantage, to separate the comic auction days to art auction days. But something tells me the high end OA market is all about patience and if you're going after the top tier, you'll either use Heritage phone notifications or even be a phone bidder for that right piece. After all if you're buying 6 figure OA, you probably can afford to take the day off LOL. But we shall see, let's circle back on Monday.

Vartanoff's catalog is always good for reference, but still doesn't explain the last 45-50 years if it walked off post cataloguing. But then again the question really is what is "earliest known" to surface, so FF 55 may be it for now, or at least earliest we'll see in our lifetime.

I always like to first check the TCJ article from '85, which we all know was Vartanoff's catalog from 1975-1980, some of which disappeared thereafter of course, but just to know what was around anyway at that time. Still doesn't necessarily mean it exists today, but there's a chance anyway if it was catalogued in the last 50 years or so. Sure enough, FF49, 50 and 51 were present at that time. 48 was missing long before '75, which means it probably walked off shortly after publication. I just wonder if it's in someone's attic or was somehow lost over time and discarded.

That logic only works if they were adding a different day in "forgetting" a day. In this case it still is Friday and Sunday, which is the norm, they are simply eliminating Thursday Platinum OA. So if someone thinks they're missing it would only be finding out on Thursday there is no OA. Essentially those handful of lots of OA on a Thursday are all now looped into Friday. The only way something "slips" is people aren't glued to those larger lots mixed in primarily on Friday, which I personally don't see happening. PS- Never look at Monday the week of a signature and draw conclusions. Even the night before or morning of are not indicators either, times are changing. The old guard may be protecting the market with pre-bids, but the newer gen time and time again waits to strike once the lot crosses the floor.

That would be cool... and who knows if they continue the movie franchise, it's certainly not out of the question.

To be fair, Heritage has only had 1 page from 375 in the 20+ years, but on that day there were 2 people that really wanted a great page, arguably better than this one, though it didn't have Ann in it. Also just shows these pages from this issue rarely change hands. Yeah the Weying 1st appearance factor to some may actually be a big deal seeing she was She Venom not only in the books but had a role in the movie.

Yeah as Indiana would say "It belongs in a museum!" Congrats to whoever won it, just hope it wasn't a dealer and we see it on a site or a con for a crazy number!

I was also the underbidder for the Sandman 1 page. Despite not having Morpheus, I thought it was still a "good example" with the death of the capture and the POV at the bottom from Dream, but I couldn't get over the hump and push it into the $20's with the BP. This along with the Torch was another one won with their proxy as every time I bid I was immediately outbid, so again, hard to say what their max was??? Speaking of which, there's some talk here of this auction being soft above, but I didn't see that at all. I thought a few may have slipped, most notably for me was the ASM 375 venom vs spidey page, but everything else I went for went for what I thought was either about right, or way over and I had my handed to me for most of that day, but I went for some of what we'd call higher profile items. I could be wrong, but few mentions above I think are more on the lower to mid tier examples by artists that aren't fairing as well. Overall congrats to Vince & Micah, I thought they had a strong art auction this time around!

All I'll say is I did my best and really thought I was going to win it. Someone set up a very high proxy bid heading into the final 3 minute clock, which began around 18k if I remember correctly? Every time I bid I was immediately outbid until this amount with the bp, the next bid wou;d've put me over $40k, which in retrospect in my eyes was probably worth it being so historic and Torch's earliest known illustration, but I figured to hold more dry powder for other lots. Still pisses me off but congrats to whoever put in their high bid and won it. Just makes you think how high that max bid was haha.

IMO the 375 was the one to go for. If you collected comics in that era you probably had or still have this book in a long box being the 30th Anniversary gold foil cover, not to mention it's regarded as one of if not thee best spidey vs venom battle issue of that era and has a direct tie into, or I should say leads into Venom Lethal Protector #1. The 375 pages as mentioned in the description for the auction just never come up and are held close to the chest, only 1 has been offered ever on Heritage, which was another panel page, not a splash, sold last year for $36k. This splash you're talking about was from 374, also coveted and part of the same battle, Heritage has only had 2 pages which both sold between $38-40k, one was returned and resold for $32k after frame was removed and found the page was adhered to a foamcore, which caused the page to ripple throughout. On a side note, those bottom panels feature Anne Weying's first appearance freeing Peter's parents from Venom, she later becomes She-Venom in the comics and the Venom movies, played by Michelle Williams, not sure it adds value but still pretty cool. The 379 I think was still a good deal and part of Maximum Carnage arc, great images, but more of a dialogue type of page and no battle, which is what collectors seem to gravitate to. Overall, great deals for both IMO, especially the 375.

Good point, though I thought it was still a fairly good result for this page, not being a standout page from this issue. A slightly better page from this issue would easily get you into the $40-50k+ range I would imagine, especially seeing how rarely they come to market…

As mentioned before, not the best of Spidey examples from this issue, more of a torch page, but still surprisingly low imho. I would've thought this still would've got closer to the 100k mark, at least 80-90k range. I wonder if the Sunday auction for this hurt it, as I know spoke to a couple collectors that completely forgot this lot and others were on a Sunday and not a Monday as usual. Again tough to say, but at this level, I'm pretty sure we'll see this up for resale at a con or dealer site with a fairly sizable markup to the six figure range.

Plus you’re once again removing the “fresh” factor if it was sold in the last year and a half. 🤣

Think these numbers above are all before the juice, which makes a lot of these early bids very strong! 😳

In most collectors thoughts I spoke to leading up to the auction's estimate was $100k give or take so landed just about right. If it went far below $100k that would be somewhat surprising. I could see if 2 collectors really valued Iron Man and the FF on it to take it a few more bids to $125k, but I personally never saw this as a $150k range page. Now if this had Thor and the team battling Loki then you're talking about floor $150k-200k, perhaps more. FYI- Some of us don't value this issue as many might think. i.e. Though a key issue and first Avengers, I'd rather have earlier individual character example pages vs 1st team example, which came later down the line. But again, I think this number was right.

Well it's not there LOL, I replied to your message above. Too bad, guess we'll never know what this was intended for or the year done if there's no "X" designation on the board

I requested it and it’s up, just no stamp or any notes or anything on the back of the board as originally thought. Just not much to go on…

I was told back scan is up now on clink, but unfortunately nothing on there.

Just a heads up I just confirmed with clink there’s no cca stamp or anything on the back. They will be adding a scan of the back to the listing…

I’ll ask Ross or Josh on Monday or if they’re following this thread perhaps they’ll respond and add a scan of the back to the lot… I suppose this would “add value” in a way to show this was intended to be published in the era. Thoughts? 🤔

I would think they would’ve highlighted and shown if it was stamped and cca approved on the back, that would be an interesting piece to the puzzle. But again, doubtful as I think Ditko was paid for it and it was then inventoried and eventually given away. 🤷‍♂️

yeah but not of the "era", which unfortunately from a collector / investment standpoint could make a massive difference...

Yeah sounds about right. If it were a stronger page I could see it possibly over 125. I was going over the 3 Kirby/Ditko Spidey/Torch related issues, this being the larger of the 3 issues (18 pages) vs FF Annual 1 (6) & ASM 8 backup (6), so only 30 pages to work with in total. Furthermore a handful of the pages actually don't have spidey to keep in mind. Also, without question the premium pages go for the 1st meeting from FF Annual 1... BTW- The title page to FF Annual 1 sold on Clink in '22, for right under $300k (still a deal in my eyes, I bid, but should've gone stronger a little stronger)... though still the title page, but the large title stat took away a lot of art, 2 smaller spidey images (1 back turned), nice FF group shot, but arguably one of the weaker of the 6 pages as far as content and art was concerned. With that said, I still think this page should go in or around the $100k range, more if 2 people really want a Kirby / Ditko example, IMO is the best combination! Speaking of which if anyone has any of the FF Annual 1 pages and are willing to sell, please let me know.