RockMyAmadeus

I still haven't seen it. Anyone got a link?

What is that? (Not pinball, I know what that is. )

Apparently it has to be an in story appearance to count as a true first appearance. Pin ups and ads don't count. Previews don't count. That being said, it probably still has value, if the right collectors are aware of it. So what if the preview itself is a story? I'm talking DCP #26 and New Teen Titans #16. And if so, would Walking Dead 127 Image Expo jan 2014 fall into the same category? Are these the 1st apps of the New Teen Titans, Captain Carrot and Outcast? I apologize for bringing a modern into the discussion but it's a pretty good example. FTFY Agents 6? Here's where it gets murky, but it needn't be. If it's original material, a la DCP #26, (among many, many others that DC did throughout the 80's), that isn't then printed elsewhere, it's the first appearance. It is, after all, in the context of a story. Even though DC calls it a "preview", it's not actually a preview...it's really "New Teen Titans #0." If it's just a few pages from a book that is officially intended to be printed in another book...a la Absolute Vertigo #1 and, I believe, the WD previews of Agents #6 and Capes #1, then it's not the first appearance...it's just a preview of the actual first appearance. It's not original material, it's just the few pages from the "real issue" printed for advertising purposes.

For some real world consideration: Take a pretty girl, and post a picture of her on the internet. Ok, yay, she's pretty. There are literally millions more just like her. But take a pretty girl and give her a story that people connect with, relate to....and now you have a superstar, a Britney Spears, a Miley Cyrus, a Kim Kardashian, a Beyoncé, a Rihanna...even if it's someone you love to hate...they still have a story, and that is why they connect with people, far, far beyond their looks, or even their talent and abilities (unless those talents and abilities are used to craft the story.) Same way with Cable, Black Cat, Crow, et al. Same thing. It's all about the story.

Apparently it has to be an in story appearance to count as a true first appearance. Pin ups and ads don't count. Previews don't count. That is correct. One need only consider the twin principles of tradition and publisher/creator intent to confirm that. Think of what "first appearance" means in the context of sequential art. Comic books are a storytelling artform. They are not static, they are dynamic. They do something. They tell a story. Would anyone cite the first appearance of Luke Skywalker as a trailer? Or publicity stills? Or storyboards? These are all "first appearances" of a sort, and they certainly have a historical appeal to devoted collectors...but they are not THE first appearance, as defined by tradition and creator intent. The average person would not say "the first appearance of Luke Skywalker is in storyboard F-18." They would say "Star Wars (and some would say "A New Hope.) And that is the right answer. How about the first appearance of Frodo Baggins? Would it be in the manuscript that Tolkien typed? Or sketches he drew? No, the first appearance of Frodo Baggins is Chapter 1 of the Fellowship of the Ring. And this is why so many people have such a problem with Gobbledygook #1 and #2 being called "the first appearances" of the Turtles. They're not, and never have been, but some people, wanting to cash in, tried to make that claim, which is rejected by many, if not most, Turtles fans. That is correct. Deadworld #10 is still quite nifty...it is a complete (back) cover, and it's really cool...but "everyone knows" that Caliber Presents is the actual first appearance of the Crow, because that is when he appears in the context of a story...which is what the entire artform is about, and the very reason why "first appearances" mean so much in the first place...because people relate to these drawings because of their stories.

I want to personally thank the person who bought the My Greatest Adventure 80 7.5w slab in the last comiclink auction. Twin Cities ped, sure, but holy mackerel at the hammer price. That's a nice ROI for the person who bought it in the original HA auction back in '11 You're welcome! I've had trouble finding the book (its been in my WTB thread for months). Its a tough key to find in HG, especially right now, and White pages to boot. On top of that, I had a few little books that sold in the auction that I didn't have much into so even at the price I paid, I was still happy to have it. And there was another person that bid it up to the same amount. But since that was my high bid first, mine stuck. I also picked up a lower graded copy a few months ago that's at CGC that I may use to offset the cost even more. If anyone has any other copies in higher grade, please PM me (or any other books in my WTB thread)! As a person with more than a vested interest in the title, I've noticed MGA 80 prices have been on the rise as of late so it's not as though you are an extreme outlier here (thumbs u I bought two mid-gradeish MGA #80s recently. Vastly underrated.

Nerfherder...that used to be Wally's name...

Yo mama. Answer your phone, dazingus!

I had someone offer me a 9.6 (9.8?) SS signed by the major cast members, Ford, Hamill, Fisher, maybe Prowse...in exchange for my SIP #1 9.8. I turned them down. I'm still good with that decision.

Please. He trashed a birthday thread and got nothing. His attempt at ruling the movie subforum with an iron fist, when he was adamantly opposed to it in the first place and then trying to take credit for making it happen, is so delicious that it shall sustain me through these trying times. But the hypocrisy of starting threads to take a shot at Kav was great entertainment. Plus, the whole "I don't like the fact that the Copper section has a "favorite book" thread by someone I don't like, so I'll just go ahead and make my own thread that does the same thing"...

+1 (thumbs u Correction. Captain America Reborn #2 VARIANT. (And I looked at all the CARs, too! I KNEW I knew this one! I have it!) (Nevermind, already addressed. )

1) Scott Snyder, Wytches #1 Wytches #1 +4 Nice! DAMN IT, I JUST saw Snyder at Image Expo! I saw his sig, too! Like a billion times! BLEARGH!

You got it! +1 Damn it. I knew that. Bleargh!

It also doesn't make it a first appearence as most collectors understand it. I don't think people mind a premium for these things, the problem is when people present them as first appearences. It's the deceptive huckster wildly_fanciful_statement that I detest. Yes. So we're clear (because, around here, everything needs to be clarified to death), there's nothing wrong with having Marvel Age #97 be worth more than #96, because #97 has a preview of (Insert Hot Flavor Of The Month Character Here.) It's nifty, it's neat, and often features cover art and other goodies that aren't found in the "official" book. There IS something wrong, however, with people walking around saying "OMG, Marvel Age #97 has the REAL first appearance of (Insert Hot Flavor Of The Month Character Here), and is WAYYY more important than (insert actual, contextual first appearance issue here)!!!" Not only is it immensely dishonest, and not at all in keeping with the spirit of both tradition AND publisher intent, it will eventually bite you in the arse when people realize that you were being deceptive. This madness started with Absolute Vertigo #1. Damn you, Vertigo!

I agree, which makes it good that no one has done that.

Well, that book does have a premium because of that. Same with More Fun 13. Premium, yes. More valuable than Tec #27? No. First "real" appearance? No.

I love the new stuff...but we need some more classic JSC in here...

I think that's a pretty safe bet. Some of the most dedicated SS guys have already looked at them. #8 I know, but can't place. Waiting for the next round.

Keep in mind anyone can change those pages. They are an authority on nothing. Check out what it says now... I was figuring someone here was responsible for the change. Actually this guy did it: That is one hefty piece of Korean beef right there. If we ever nuked Pyongyang, it would be Korean BBQ.

It's silly to me as well, but paying a premium for a newsstand copy of a comic or a Whitman logo DC is also equally silly. However, collector preferences do and will change from time to time. Yeah, I agree. Those are niche markets variants of a sort. Great fun to collect as a set or necessary buys for hardcore completionists. However, what we're seeing with the influx of attention towards the Marvel Age/Previews appearances is on another wavelength. We're talking about completely redefining the 1st appearance "guidelines" to include early solicitations as a genuine 1st appearance. That is insane. Precisely.

It's silly to me as well, but paying a premium for a newsstand copy of a comic or a Whitman logo DC is also equally silly. However, collector preferences do and will change from time to time. Nothing wrong with paying a premium for it...just the marketing of it as "first appearance!" with the intent to deceive, or at least confuse, prospective buyers, and ignoring historical context for money.

First printed appearance of Batman: This is from Action #12.

TLDR (I'm loving this, thanks to the Hawaiian former lawyer who posted it): Calling previews "first appearances" takes away from the intention of the publisher and creators and bastardizes the importance to the hobby of the meaning of the words "first appearance" by stripping it of its historic and traditional context, creating unnecessary confusion (and usually only for money.)

I added the last two sentences, to clarify my position, and it had nothing to do with your reply (which I hadn't yet seen.) I didn't substantively change the post. Not something worth making an issue about, nor presenting as if I "keep on" doing it to thwart you in some way. If it bothers you enough to make an issue of it, just quote the post, and the other person can't then edit it. "Problem" solved. And using that terminology confuses (quite obviously) people who don't understand what you're really referencing. The "first printed appearance" of Batman isn't Detective Comics #27. But why muddy the waters by trying to claim that preview ads are "first printed appearances"? Technically true? Yes. Traditionally true, accepted by the hobby, and perceived as historically significant? Obviously not, and THAT is the context to which I refer (and which you wish to argue.) Your toy analogy isn't comparable. These aren't "prototype comics" we're talking about. They are promotional previews, intended only to let prospective buyers know what is coming out. They aren't, and were never intended to be, "unreleased." And, after all...if they're "unreleased", they aren't really "first" in anywhere near the same sense, are they? If they aren't available for mass consumption...how do they possibly count? That's like saying Jack Kirby's concept sketches for Spiderman are the "first appearance of Spiderman." And, hopefully, you see how far down the rabbit hole THAT goes.