The Way Wizard saw it in 1992 ?

[Bronty]

I agree with your logic with respect to the fact that SOME early 90's collectors will turn to Valiants... I just have my doubts as to whether or not the number of such Valiant collectors will ever be sufficient to sustain any kind of significant increase in price. For my age, I was probably the most avid collector I knew in the early 90s and even owned a few Valiants and outside of keys like Magnus 12 or Rai 4 (which I wouldn't pay more than $5 for) and/or Barry Smith issues, I really have no interest in owning ANY valiants today. Even during the valiant boom, valiant back issues were a niche market. It only makes sense to me that in the "echo" population, 15-20 years later, that valiants will remain a niche market.

 

I hope, for you, if for nothing else, that valiants begin to do well, but outside of a few issues, I just can't see it. Even the keys are a bit of a dubious proposition, I would think.

 

If you're looking for a book that our generation will get truly excited about, look to TMNT 1. Still popular, more saturday a.m. cartoons and movies coming out, a new Dreamwave series out right now... this book will have legs for many years. Most importantly, back in its heyday it was one of the few independents that wasn't really a niche book. EVERYBODY wanted one.

 

Dan

[dam60]

For me, the most important aspect of collecting comic books is the "completion factor".

I want to be able to obtain my goals as a collector, therefore, I have to set those

goals according to the realistic possibilities given my financial means.

 

If Wizard 1992 had impacted me to seek Uncanny X-Men #266 (one of the Top 10),

the "completionist" in me would say... "Ok, but what about #1 to #265?"

And, realistically, I will never own #1 in high grade... so #2 to #265 is a "bad goal"

because it doesn't "feel right". (And #1 in low-grade isn't a great feeling either.)

 

Spider-man? Even worse than X-Men... no way I'm able to go after "complete" Spider-man.

 

I am 100% with you on the completionist side but I was surprised to hear the "perfectionist" side come out as well - owning a 9.4 X-Men #1 might set you back a cool $45K, but owning a G/VG 3.0 will set you back about $1.5K (maybe even less, I just pulled that number out of my arse!)

 

I'm definitely a completionist but for me outside of keys as long as it has good cover appeal and is not falling apart (so by my standards strict VG) I'm a happy camper.

 

I also wanted to address the nostalgia factor. I am in my mid 20s and when I was collecting (and yes reading Wizard religiously) I remember fondly the whole Spirits of Vengeance storyline, and X-Men 1-3, etc. I always like X-O, but now I've done that and moved on. I have pretty much every Marvel comic I ever wanted. It wasn't hard to do and it wasn't all that expensive (since my earlier books I don't need a pristine copy and for these moderns even NM+ books are still 50 cent bin fodder). The only thing I can think of really going up in price in the next couple of years would be the pre-unity valiants as they have a relatively low print run. I can never see demand get too crazy for an X-O 14 and 15 (although that would be pretty neat as I am in over 100 copies of each of them) but even an X-O 14 stands a better chance than an X-Men #1 which in turn stands a better chance than an X-Force #1 which still in turn stands a better chance than an Adventures of Superman #500.

 

DAM

[Lantern]

If you're looking for a book that our generation will get truly excited about, look to TMNT 1

 

Are you the one currently selling a TMNT 1 first print on eBay...

 

[Bronty]

You betcha!!!

 

As soon as I typed that, I knew somebody would call me out on that conflict of interest! However, it should be noted that I am only selling it because I'm upgrading. Otherwise, #1 would be staying at home with its friends (#2-62).

 

Dan

[Lantern]

I brought it up to be funny. As a side note, I agree that the TMNT 1 is a very important book from that era, if not the most important one.

 

I can tell you, if I had around $1000 to blow on comics right now I would be bidding on your Cerebus 1 and your TMNT 1 with the fullest intentions of putting up a fight for both of them. Both are books that I would love to own one day, unfortunately the timing was bad for me.

 

 

[valiantman]

I hope, for you, if for nothing else, that valiants begin to do well, but outside of a few issues, I just can't see it.

I actually agree with you there... except for a few issues, the majority of Valiant

is just like "everything else" from the mid-1990s.

 

I guess my point, related to Wizard 1992, is that I really WANTED to own the books,

and I couldn't.

I had a copy of X-Men #266, everybody had the hologram Marvels, and Cable,

and Deathlok or whoever... and all the death and funeral of Superman issues...

but not everybody had Harbinger #1 then... or now.

After 5 to 10 years of being unable to obtain what I wanted... I just wanted it more.

The fact that it is now cheaper than then... bonus! Double-win.

 

Is Valiant a niche market? Absolutely! But it's going to be a stronger one

than Image... definitely... and it's much stronger today (for early Valiant issues)

than even the best Marvel and DC had to offer in the early-to-mid-1990s.

And it's "ok" if few people collect it, because there aren't a million copies of

the earliest books... there aren't even 100,000. There are still plenty of bargain bins

waiting to be scoured... though the "finds" are getting fewer.

 

The neatest thing about Valiant, in my opinion, is that it's "possible".

It's "possible" to get them all for little cost.

It's "possible" to find the best ones in bargain bins.

It's "possible" to pay less today than you would have paid 10 years ago.

It's "possible" to collect Valiant in addition to anything else your heart desires.

It's "possible" that someone may wind up with the rights to those characters.

It's "possible" that one day they'll be back on the shelves with new issues.

They'll never be as "big" as Batman or Spidey... but those books stare back at

you from the shelf, and you just know you've missed 40+ years of the collection.

Valiant, on the other hand, is "possible".

[Bronty]

Hey don't worry about it - both the books I'm selling are doubles. Next time I have doubles, I'll let you know

 

By the way, I know you brought it up to be funny - and it was!!

[Bronty]

Yeah, I know what you mean. For guys like us that were born in the 1970s, that mint run of Amazing Spiderman or Fantastic Four is just not going to happen. In fact, that line of reasoning, i.e. that it's "possible" is a big part of why I collect sealed NES titles more so than comic books (for the past 6 months, anyway). It's still "possible" for me to own pristine copies of the best games. It's already stretching my budget on the the really top-notch titles, but I can still own the equivalent of a NM FF1 in that hobby. (In fact FF1 in that hobby means something different altogether - Final Fantasy #1 ).

 

Dan

[dam60]

Yeah, I know what you mean. For guys like us that were born in the 1970s, that mint run of Amazing Spiderman or Fantastic Four is just not going to happen. In fact, that line of reasoning, i.e. that it's "possible" is a big part of why I collect sealed NES titles more so than comic books (for the past 6 months, anyway). It's still "possible" for me to own pristine copies of the best games. It's already stretching my budget on the the really top-notch titles, but I can still own the equivalent of a NM FF1 in that hobby. (In fact FF1 in that hobby means something different altogether - Final Fantasy #1 ).

 

Dan

 

Oh man, how much do I love Final Fantasy #1

 

Hey, can anyone recommend a good NES emulator for the computer that's preferrably free (although don't mind paying for quality) with a good source of games (although I am really only interested in Leged of Zelda, Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy) - the other games I like would probably be better suited with a joystick type of gizmo which I don't have. Laptop baby, I don't even use a real mouse!

 

Actually, wait, I will start a new thread on the subject so as not to hijack this one. . .

 

DAM

[Proverbs22_2]

Is Valiant a niche market? Absolutely! But it's going to be a stronger one

than Image... definitely... and it's much stronger today (for early Valiant issues)

than even the best Marvel and DC had to offer in the early-to-mid-1990s.

And it's "ok" if few people collect it, because there aren't a million copies of

the earliest books... there aren't even 100,000. There are still plenty of bargain bins

waiting to be scoured... though the "finds" are getting fewer.

 

The neatest thing about Valiant, in my opinion, is that it's "possible".

It's "possible" to get them all for little cost.

It's "possible" to find the best ones in bargain bins.

It's "possible" to pay less today than you would have paid 10 years ago.

It's "possible" to collect Valiant in addition to anything else your heart desires.

It's "possible" that someone may wind up with the rights to those characters.

It's "possible" that one day they'll be back on the shelves with new issues.

They'll never be as "big" as Batman or Spidey... but those books stare back at

you from the shelf, and you just know you've missed 40+ years of the collection.

Valiant, on the other hand, is "possible".

 

Very well formed and articulate post: Five stars for you!

 

I was merely a peripheral Valiant Fan, with my faves being X-O and Archer and Armstrong, with Eternal Warrior as an "honorable mention". I was attracted to those titles based on the quality of the writing , which IMHO, set those books apart back during the "Spawn" (pun intended) of the Image-age.

 

Does anyone else remember the "Three Musketeers" Story that appeared in both A&A and Eternal Warrior? That was a side-splitting classic!

 

How `bout Gilad holding that bridge against the entire force of Attila's Huns?

 

You may convert me to the Church of Valiant, Reverend Valiantman!

 

-Joe

[dam60]

Does anyone else remember the "Three Musketeers" Story that appeared in both A&A and Eternal Warrior? That was a side-splitting classic!

 

Issue #8 for both of them!! What a thrill! I remember having to pony up the $4.50 in the store for it, but boy oh boy was it well worth it! Valiants really are awesome books!

 

DAM

[brian1227]

Yeah, I know what you mean. For guys like us that were born in the 1970s, that mint run of Amazing Spiderman or Fantastic Four is just not going to happen. In fact, that line of reasoning, i.e. that it's "possible" is a big part of why I collect sealed NES titles more so than comic books (for the past 6 months, anyway). It's still "possible" for me to own pristine copies of the best games. It's already stretching my budget on the the really top-notch titles, but I can still own the equivalent of a NM FF1 in that hobby. (In fact FF1 in that hobby means something different altogether - Final Fantasy #1 ).

 

Dan

 

Oh man, how much do I love Final Fantasy #1

 

Hey, can anyone recommend a good NES emulator for the computer that's preferrably free (although don't mind paying for quality) with a good source of games (although I am really only interested in Leged of Zelda, Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy) - the other games I like would probably be better suited with a joystick type of gizmo which I don't have. Laptop baby, I don't even use a real mouse!

 

Actually, wait, I will start a new thread on the subject so as not to hijack this one. . .

 

DAM

 

Dam, I've been playing NES games on all their consoles for the past 15 years. Legend of Zelda:A Link to the Past, is the best game I ever played. The latest Zelda game was not as good. All the Metroid games were also very good.

[Bronty]

Legend of Zelda :alttp is magnificent. Super Metroid and Earthbound are unbelievable as well

[joe_collector]

Dam, I've been playing NES games on all their consoles for the past 15 years. Legend of Zelda:A Link to the Past, is the best game I ever played.

 

Tell me about it. I got a Gameboy last Xmas (what a freaky surprise gift) and the Zelda: LTTP game really brought back some fond memories.

[dam60]

Yeah, I know what you mean. For guys like us that were born in the 1970s, that mint run of Amazing Spiderman or Fantastic Four is just not going to happen. In fact, that line of reasoning, i.e. that it's "possible" is a big part of why I collect sealed NES titles more so than comic books (for the past 6 months, anyway). It's still "possible" for me to own pristine copies of the best games. It's already stretching my budget on the the really top-notch titles, but I can still own the equivalent of a NM FF1 in that hobby. (In fact FF1 in that hobby means something different altogether - Final Fantasy #1 ).

 

Dan

 

Oh man, how much do I love Final Fantasy #1

 

Hey, can anyone recommend a good NES emulator for the computer that's preferrably free (although don't mind paying for quality) with a good source of games (although I am really only interested in Leged of Zelda, Dragon Warrior and Final Fantasy) - the other games I like would probably be better suited with a joystick type of gizmo which I don't have. Laptop baby, I don't even use a real mouse!

 

Actually, wait, I will start a new thread on the subject so as not to hijack this one. . .

 

DAM

 

Dam, I've been playing NES games on all their consoles for the past 15 years. Legend of Zelda:A Link to the Past, is the best game I ever played. The latest Zelda game was not as good. All the Metroid games were also very good.

 

What great stuff!! I am so excited at the thought of being able to play the original Legend of Zelda again. Truthfully, I have never beaten that game. I got up to Gannon once, but he schooled my sorry [!@#%^&^]. I think that now being a bit more coordinated I should be able to do it . . .

 

Metroid is another game that I absolutely loved, but it got so confusing for me after a while. I could never figure out where the heck I was suppossed to be going or what I should be doing and Metroid's music was so much darker and more depressing than the fun music that they played on the Legend of Zelda. That game is so immortal!

 

BTW - for some reason, I never did Nintendo after the 8 bit system. I had a 16 bit Sega Genesis on which I played endless hours of street fighter 2, but nothing ever with SNES.

 

Some great memories . . .

 

DAM

 

[Bronty]

Yeah, people either loved Sega or hated it. Truth be told, as a kid, I never had any Nintendo OR sega system. My friend had a Nintendo which meant I got to play it a fair bit but never as much as I wanted, you know? Maybe that's why I collect now

[supapimp]

i never had any video game operating system, my friends had them, on a side note, i never had a bike either.

[localshop]

While I don't know how much impact Wizard has on collectors today...

I can easily say that Wizard had a major impact on "my generation" in 1992 and 1993.

 

Let's face it... collectors who are currently in their 20s are "just now" reaching

the age where they have more than $100 to play with. These guys were most

likely influenced by Wizard ten years ago... and whatever seeds were planted

have had 10 years to grow.

 

For me, the most important aspect of collecting comic books is the "completion factor".

I want to be able to obtain my goals as a collector, therefore, I have to set those

goals according to the realistic possibilities given my financial means.

 

If Wizard 1992 had impacted me to seek Uncanny X-Men #266 (one of the Top 10),

the "completionist" in me would say... "Ok, but what about #1 to #265?"

And, realistically, I will never own #1 in high grade... so #2 to #265 is a "bad goal"

because it doesn't "feel right". (And #1 in low-grade isn't a great feeling either.)

 

Spider-man? Even worse than X-Men... no way I'm able to go after "complete" Spider-man.

 

Ok, fine... so what are my choices? Secondary Marvel or DC characters...

Ugh... saying "secondary" is not gonna get me excited about what follows.

 

Then there's Valiant... Harbinger #1 (Top 10 - Wizard 1992).

Ok, what about Valiant? There are about 800 books in the whole universe.

Probably 600 of those can be found in high grade for much less than cover price.

Ten years ago, I really...REALLY... wanted a book like Harbinger #1, but it was $100!

Let's see... here it is on eBay... $25.

 

...and the rest, as they say... is history.

 

Beware of the young readers of Wizard from 1992... we've now got a little money to spend.

We missed so many issues of the "big boys", we might as well look elsewhere.

 

Does anyone have an opinion (and I'm sure that they do) as to whether the Vertigo run will be attractive in the same way? It's got a reasonably attainable number of copies (similar level to Valiant, maybe a few more), and none of those are particularly costly. Or does the fact that it's still churning out copies month after month make it less attractive? Is it more the allure of a complete set with no possibility of adding to it?

[valiantman]

Does anyone have an opinion (and I'm sure that they do) as to whether the Vertigo run will be attractive in the same way? It's got a reasonably attainable number of copies (similar level to Valiant, maybe a few more), and none of those are particularly costly.

I think the fact that none are particularly costly even 10 years later points to

the idea that those who want them already have them, and those who don't, don't.

[Proverbs22_2]

I don't know about that. Sandman in particular, was in TPB from the get-go. While it was great to be able to sit down and read full arcs at one go, the near immediate availability of the TPB's seemed to shackle the "secondary market" value of the books themselves.

 

-Joe