What is the most important issue from the year 1980?

[DrWatson]

Just so people can really understand what's going on here, this is the high-grade breakdown of the two issues in the CGC Census:

 

Conan #1:

 

CGC 9.8 - 8 copies

CGC 9.6 - 50 copies

CGC 9.4 - 133 copies

 

Green Lantern/Green Arrow 76:

 

CGC 9.8 - 0 copies

CGC 9.6 - 1 copies

CGC 9.4 - 9 copies

 

I'd say "do the math", but even a squirrel could get those numbers.

[gernblanston]

but I believe that a concensus might emerge, which I think is just now happening in the bronze age with GL 76 (with Marvel dissenters).

 

 

Any discussion I've seen has listed Conan 1 right at the top of the list. GL/GA 76 had virtually nothing to do with the Marvel BA, which is 95% of the important stuff in the 70's.

 

right. the value of a book isn't the determining factor when talking about an "age" beginning, and Conan 1 is clearly more a defining point than GL/GA 76, which is more of a reaction than a beginning imho

 

Why not? Look at Showcase 4, it certainly has the value to go along with its influential status of being at the beginning of the Silver Age. I am not saying Conan 1 is unimportant, but if it were as key as you are saying, why wouldn't it be higher valued because of the significant investor demand for such an important issue with fewer graded copies than other Bronze Age keys referenced below.

Collectors, so far, have not been interested enough to raise the price. Since I just sold my issue, I wish they were.

It also isn't anywhere near the Hulk 181 price levels even though that book has more graded issues in 9.4 according to census numbers. It also isn't nearly comparable price wise to X-Men 94, Giant Size X-Men 1, or many others, in the same grade from the same era which should have less significance than the beginning of an entire age.

By way of comparison, Showcase 4, generally considered to be a part of the beginning of the Silver Age, and also a "lowly" DC issue, compared to Marvel hero books like Spider-Man 1, Hulk 1, and FF 1, for example, guides at the price of $43,000, and is, for the most part, higher than, these other keys of the Silver Age era, say Amazing Spider-man 1 at 34,000 guide. How would you reconcile that for Conan 1 based on your "value" and "defining" argument mentioned above? If the investor demand and key issue imporance were there, it follows the price should be higher regardless of your dismissive assertion.

[gernblanston]

I just sold a Conan 1 CGC 9.4 for just under $550. The GL 76 9.4 last traded at $8,300 or so

 

You really can't be this dense, can you?

 

To get a clue, just look at the Census, and then, try to understand that Conan #1 was THE Comic Event of the 70's, and people were buying multiples, cases, etc. and therefore its intense popularity translated into a much larger high-grade supply.

 

And I guarantee that if Conan #1 had similar Census numbers to GL/GA 76, that it would sell for multiples ABOVE the DC book. No question about it.

 

Seriously, to equate valuation with importance on BA books is the height of stupidity.

 

Yes, I am dense. Thanks for drawing that out as it adds credibility to your argument.

[gernblanston]

133 copies of a 9.4 doesn't really reflect boxes and boxes of HG books out there, does it? Hulk 181 has much more than that at 200, but somehow the price is 5 times higher. Great argument there.

[joe_collector]

Thanks for the comedy act - the amount you don't know about comic valuation could fill outer space.

 

 

[joe_collector]

133 copies of a 9.4 doesn't really reflect boxes and boxes of HG books out there, does it? Hulk 181 has much more than that at 200, but somehow the price is 5 times higher. Great argument there.

 

And I suppose you somehow believe that if the Census numbers for GL/GA 76 and Hulk 181 were equivalent, that the DC book would still sell for more?

 

Get a grip Jethro, the ONLY reason GL/GA 76 is selling so high is that buyers perceive it as "rare in high-grade" and the incredibly low Census numbers back it up. Mushroom it up to a few hundred copies in 9.4 and no one would even be talking about it.

[MutantKeys]

This is the funniest thread I have ever read in the Copper section

[gernblanston]

Thanks for the comedy act - the amount you don't know about comic valuation could fill outer space.

 

 

It is simple. If there is demand, a price goes higher. If there is not, it does not. I guess the foundation of our economic system is "stupid" to you. I suppose a lot of people go around paying high prices for unimportant books that have had 37 years to settle in price. That makes sense. Keep the keen analysis coming with elementary school barbs.

[joe_collector]

It is simple. If there is demand, a price goes higher. If there is not, it does not. I guess the foundation of our economic system is "stupid" to you

 

 

Oh man, this is too much.

 

If there is demand, a price goes higher. If there is not, it does not.

 

Now you've gone and put all the nation's Economists out of a job.

[gernblanston]

We don't know how much demand there is for GL 76 vs.Conan 1 because of the disparity in census numbers, and the significantly higher prices for GL 76, that tends to cause more investors to be disinterested as the price climbs higher, but it doesn't follow that the valuation would be higher for Conan 1 if the census numbers were closer.

[joe_collector]

a) Go buy an Economics text.

b) Stop using Hulk 181 when you need to prove a point. That book defies all known rules of the Universe.

c) Quit while you have an ounce of dignity left.

[gernblanston]

a) Go buy an Economics text.

b) Quit while you have an ounce of dignity left.

Based on what, your unsubstantiated personal point of view. Okay.

[joe_collector]

Based on what, your unsubstanted personal point of view. Okay.

 

And your view is "substanted"?

 

You can't prove anything 100% in a bizarre world like funny books, but I guarantee only a fool would draw valuation comparisons between two 1970 comics, one with FIFTY-EIGHT copies on CGC 9.6 and higher, and the other with ONE.

 

FIFTY-EIGHT is SIGNIFICANTLY larger than ONE. In fact, it's FIFTY-EIGHT times larger.

 

Do the math.

[gernblanston]

a) Go buy an Economics text.

b) Stop using Hulk 181 when you need to prove a point. That book defies all known rules of the Universe.

c) Quit while you have an ounce of dignity left.

 

I didn't realize discussing comic book values involved dignity.

[gernblanston]

Based on what, your unsubstanted personal point of view. Okay.

 

And your view is "substanted"?

 

You can't prove anything 100% in a bizarre world like funny books, but I guarantee only a fool would draw valuation comparisons between two 1970 comics, one with FIFTY-EIGHT copies on CGC 9.6 and higher, and the other with ONE.

 

FIFTY-EIGHT is SIGNIFICANTLY larger than ONE. In fact, it's FIFTY-EIGHT times larger.

 

Do the math.

 

I am not asserting absolutes like you. Never said I was. You just didn't read the previous post about Showcase 4 and comparing it too the Marvels of the Silver Age. However, census numbers are not the only story. If your logic were valid, dime bin books with 1 submission at 9.6 would be worth more than key books with 100. That doesn't involve Hulk 181.

[DrWatson]

Silly question. Why should the current market value of any given book relate to the book's importance in its given age bracket?

[gernblanston]

Silly question. Why should the current market value of any given book relate to the book's importance in its given age bracket?

 

It certainly does not hurt. It just does not make sense to me to discount the importance of a book as it relates to value. It is not the only factor, but it counts more than is being indicated here. If that makes me foolish, then give me more as I have an entire collection of "worthless" books based on that reasoning.

[joe_collector]

Silly question. Why should the current market value of any given book relate to the book's importance in its given age bracket?

 

It should not. Only speculators and investors would make the mistake of confusing the two, since to them, money = importance.

[DrWatson]

I think that what is going on here is possibly that rare in high grade is being translated in to importance in age, which isn't always the case. Take modern X-men books, right now there are a few that only have 1 CGC graded copy, period. They are selling for around $150-$200. They certainly have no importance in their age bracket. Once someone slabs 50 or 60 copies in high grade the price will drop like a rock.

[gernblanston]

My point is that important books from an era, unless it has a huge number of high grade issues slabbed, and not just 100 or 200, as I think there are more collectors than that out there collecting these books, should sell for more than average important ones. X-Men 94 is considered a key, with 107 9.4s out there. Conan 1 has 133 in 9.4. So, the reason X-Men 94 in that grade goes for over 4 times more than the Conan 1 has solely to do with the extra 26 HG books? I just don't agree with that and don't see why that is so controversial as to raise scorn.