Preview of The Twelve #1

[Fan4Fan]

I don't recall seeing #0 back in December, but this looks interesting...

 

 

[seank]

Gotta love Marvel. If I remember correctly, the Russians took Berlin. No Americans involved in the actual takeover of the city.

 

[Tatterdamillion]

Commie!

[jordanscott]

Commie!

 

Capitalist pigdog!!

 

 

While I'm going to check out the first issue, with so many of the 'throwback' characters being actual characters in current Marvel (in some form or another) I find it hard to embrace the concept as much as I am the effort over at Dynamite with Superpowers.

 

Still, it's a cool looking page.

[Aces]

Gotta love Marvel. If I remember correctly, the Russians took Berlin. No Americans involved in the actual takeover of the city.

 

 

Are you personally old enough to remember?

 

When the old guys are dead few will know any history because of the krap they teach in school now.

[seank]

Gotta love Marvel. If I remember correctly, the Russians took Berlin. No Americans involved in the actual takeover of the city.

 

 

Are you personally old enough to remember?

 

When the old guys are dead few will know any history because of the krap they teach in school now.

 

Those who don't remember history are condemned to repeat it.

 

Just because I'm not old enough to have been around in 1945, doesn't mean that the Russians didn't take Berlin. It's a fact, plain and simple.

 

What bothers me in regards to comics is that basic history and accuracy doesn't matter and it should. I can buy a small change like an African American being in Easy Company due to a SNAFU, but to have the Americans taking Berlin is too much - especially for a company that touts its "realism."

 

All in all, it's sloppy when writers and artists don't do their homework and Marvel, for a company that pretends to be the best, is very sloppy at times. Here's a panel from FF 507. That soldier is a member of the 2006 American army

 

So why is he carrying a rifle that the American army stopped using about 50 years ago? How hard would it have been to spend 30 minutes on the Internet researching modern American weaponry? Or maybe watch the evening news to see what our soldiers in Iraq are carrying. I'll be you $$$ it ain't a Garand..

 

Likewise, how hard would it have been for a Marvel writer to figure out that the Americans didn't take Berlin? It wouldn't have been hard to put Captain America or the other Invaders into the Battle of Berlin and probably would make a better story if Cap was dodging the Russians and the city defenders.

 

If you don't care about history, that's fine, but when you're putting out a product that proclaims itself to be the best around, maybe a little research wouldn't hurt.

 

And asking me if I'm old enough to remember is one lousy argument.

[Aces]

Gotta love Marvel. If I remember correctly, the Russians took Berlin. No Americans involved in the actual takeover of the city.

 

 

Are you personally old enough to remember?

 

When the old guys are dead few will know any history because of the krap they teach in school now.

 

Those who don't remember history are condemned to repeat it.

 

Just because I'm not old enough to have been around in 1945, doesn't mean that the Russians didn't take Berlin. It's a fact, plain and simple.

 

What bothers me in regards to comics is that basic history and accuracy doesn't matter and it should. I can buy a small change like an African American being in Easy Company due to a SNAFU, but to have the Americans taking Berlin is too much - especially for a company that touts its "realism."

 

All in all, it's sloppy when writers and artists don't do their homework and Marvel, for a company that pretends to be the best, is very sloppy at times. Here's a panel from FF 507. That soldier is a member of the 2006 American army

 

So why is he carrying a rifle that the American army stopped using about 50 years ago? How hard would it have been to spend 30 minutes on the Internet researching modern American weaponry? Or maybe watch the evening news to see what our soldiers in Iraq are carrying. I'll be you $$$ it ain't a Garand..

 

Likewise, how hard would it have been for a Marvel writer to figure out that the Americans didn't take Berlin? It wouldn't have been hard to put Captain America or the other Invaders into the Battle of Berlin and probably would make a better story if Cap was dodging the Russians and the city defenders.

 

If you don't care about history, that's fine, but when you're putting out a product that proclaims itself to be the best around, maybe a little research wouldn't hurt.

 

And asking me if I'm old enough to remember is one lousy argument.

I agree with you!

I was just wondering if you knew that from personal experience.

 

[Pirate]

i can't believe people actually bought the issue

[ComicSupply]

*Foggy Memory* But I already knew this.

 

The Americans could of rushed to Berlin if they wanted to. They knew they had the Russians beat but Ike believed it wasn't worth the live's of American's to make a mad dash for it. I believe they only had to cross one unguarded river and the road from the south was sparsely defended.

 

That said, there would be no Russian or British setting food inside that city if it wasn't for our involvement or our continued air campaign.

 

I have a neat little "WHAT IF" from a professor if anyone want's to see it. It was basically a "What If the American's beat Russia to Germany" It explains in nice detail why we didn't race, and what the aftereffects of that were.

 

Most people believe that the cold war started when the Russians got there first, as well as the 40 some years of a seperated Germany.

[seank]

*Foggy Memory* But I already knew this.

 

The Americans could of rushed to Berlin if they wanted to. They knew they had the Russians beat but Ike believed it wasn't worth the live's of American's to make a mad dash for it. I believe they only had to cross one unguarded river and the road from the south was sparsely defended.

 

That said, there would be no Russian or British setting food inside that city if it wasn't for our involvement or our continued air campaign.

 

I have a neat little "WHAT IF" from a professor if anyone want's to see it. It was basically a "What If the American's beat Russia to Germany" It explains in nice detail why we didn't race, and what the aftereffects of that were.

 

Most people believe that the cold war started when the Russians got there first, as well as the 40 some years of a seperated Germany.

 

Ike wanted to give the Russians Berlin because of the destruction the Germans caused on the Eastern front. The Russians suffered horrible losses defending their country.

 

Patton wanted Berlin and he was extraordinarily pissed at Eisenhower for that decision.

[Jayman]

I actually enjoyed the book and look forward to the next issue!

They mention in the story how the Russians got to most of Berlin first before the American soldiers did. In the story just the supes got there early...

[ComicSupply]

*Foggy Memory* But I already knew this.

 

The Americans could of rushed to Berlin if they wanted to. They knew they had the Russians beat but Ike believed it wasn't worth the live's of American's to make a mad dash for it. I believe they only had to cross one unguarded river and the road from the south was sparsely defended.

 

That said, there would be no Russian or British setting food inside that city if it wasn't for our involvement or our continued air campaign.

 

I have a neat little "WHAT IF" from a professor if anyone want's to see it. It was basically a "What If the American's beat Russia to Germany" It explains in nice detail why we didn't race, and what the aftereffects of that were.

 

Most people believe that the cold war started when the Russians got there first, as well as the 40 some years of a seperated Germany.

 

Ike wanted to give the Russians Berlin because of the destruction the Germans caused on the Eastern front. The Russians suffered horrible losses defending their country.

 

Patton wanted Berlin and he was extraordinarily pissed at Eisenhower for that decision.

 

Yes, but a lot of those horrible losses were due to what I would call "stupid" fighting. They would just rush positions with no regard for their lives or strategy.

 

It reminds me of the scene in one of those war movies where 2 Russians soldiers are given 1 gun and told that the one with the gun will shoot until he is dead, then the 2nd man will pick up the gun.

 

Ike probably shouldn't of ever given one ounce of mercy to the Russians as a lot of their behavior during the war should of been with the level of war crimes.

 

USA did beat everyone to Hitler's mountain hideaway where I believe many people thought he would be hiding.

 

I think that if your dealing with historical content in a comic book you really should get it right. Being rushed and silly only lends credibility to the people who think comics are just "silly fun"

 

 

 

[MightyBeanComics]

Aces, where is that 1st photo from? Its magnificent!

[seank]

Aces, where is that 1st photo from? Its magnificent!

 

It's a Russian soldier putting the Russian flag up on top of the Reichstag after they took Berlin.

[Aces]

Aces, where is that 1st photo from? Its magnificent!

 

It's a Russian soldier putting the Russian flag up on top of the Reichstag after they took Berlin.

 

seank got the pic.

And it's what he said.

 

I always like the film seen were the stone NAZI swastika is being blow to bits off the top of the building in Nuremburg.

[MedicAR]

I actually enjoyed the book and look forward to the next issue!

They mention in the story how the Russians got to most of Berlin first before the American soldiers did. In the story just the supes got there early...

 

Same here! Good clean (more or less) fun! (thumbs u

[followtheleader]

Just finished reading it.

 

The WWII history has very little to do with the story.

 

I just looked past that and ended up enjoying it.

 

I must admit, I don't know how they could put a Teen+ on it though. A guy fondling a knocked out women's breasts and using the word scheisse doesn't seem teen appropriate. Love it though.

 

I get the feeling that Straz$#$#$$## is going for a Watchmen type feel.

 

Pat

[MedicAR]

I get the feeling that Straz$#$#$$## is going for a Watchmen type feel.

 

Funny you should say that. I got the same vibe from it. I also got that vibe from Rising Stars. I think Watchmen may have had a profound effect on JMS and that he wants to remake it in his own way. Just think though, newer readers most likely won't have read Watchmen and won't make the comparison.

 

Also, that comparison isn't meant to insult JMS, and I don't think he's swiping anything directly from Alan Moore. The books just have a very similar feel.

[Ares]

Are these Marvel Heroes Or Past Golden age Public Domain heroes?

[MedicAR]

They are Timely heroes from the 40's, I don't know if they slipped into PD or not.