Why Moderns Suck...

[NewWorldOrder]

well todays moderns are a million times better than than the from the 1990's so I am happy.

 

I am just real picky on what I spend my 3.00 per comic on.

[seank]

 

While I plan to read the FF story in one sitting when it is collected, I did actually read FF 554 on the way back from LA last Monday and it's exactly what I expected it to be, a set up for the next five issues where nothing actually happens. It's pretty much standard Mark Millar with some nice artwork by Bryan Hitch.

 

 

Why should I buy six issues where nothing actually happens? That was ok for Seinfeld, but I don't think it's ok for Fantastic Four.

 

And, just to some more, I find Bryan Hitch's artwork completely unsuited to the FF. They don't look right to me.

 

Do or don't buy it, that's entirely up to you. As with most Millar books I'm sure it will read well enough when it's finished and in a single volume, but yes, as with any episode of Star Trek, by the time this is over the characters will be right back to where we found them for the next creative team.

 

Star Trek is a whole different story! The 1960's Trek at least had some great stories and character interaction. But as of the last ten years, the franchise fell into the stalest of formulas where you could set your clock by what was happening on the screen.

 

To some extent, I don't mind serial fiction if the episodes are interesting, but at soem point, freshness needs to come in. This is a whole new thread here, or a good evening of discussion over a few beers (or Mai Tais!).

 

Do you watch Torchwood? They killed one of the main characters recently, then brought him back to "life" with an alien artifact. He's dead, but walking around. Easily one of the best SF series out there right now.

[Norrin_Radd]

Was Bone ultra violent?

 

No. It had some violence, but in a similar vein as cartoons. Bone was great. We need more fun, all-ages adventure stories.

[Old Fashion PB and J]

So many good modern titles. I just cant agree. I find it hard to read alot of the stuff I grew up on these days. The storys on some of the "great" titles sucked, luckily I was 11 at the time. But the books that are out now, I have problems not buying comics, let alone dropping books. Most the flagship titles at both marvel and DC are good, let alone anything Geoff Jones or Ed Brubaker are writing is just gold.

 

The FF storyline has been dragging, but I will still wait to see what the book builds to. Millar and Hitch have there work cut out for them for a title that has been drowning for how many years ? They have to build something with this book to make it interesting again, otherwise Marvel may as well can it.

 

And I still havent read walking dead. I dont want to think how much it would cost to backtrack that series and im not a GN fan.

[kidcolt]

That is the best part about this hobby, there are so many different things to collect that there is something for everyone. If you like moderns then collect moderns, if you like silverage then collect silver, if you like everything then collect everything. There should be more appreceiation for every comic age, the hobby needs people to be positive instead of negitive.

[joe_collector]

Remember, there was plenty of drek in the other "ages" of comics too.

 

Sure, but they were priced realistically, and with the insane price gouging of today's depressed and ever-shrinking market, they NEED to give readers their money's worth.

[the blob]

what are you talking about JC? the buck a piece I pay for moderns is pretty good adjusted for inflation (and my income!) compared to the 60 cents I was paying back in 1984.

 

And heck, I could probably pay less, but the guys over at my LCS are nice so I feel decent spending money there.

[joe_collector]

what are you talking about JC? the buck a piece I pay for moderns is pretty good adjusted for inflation (and my income!) compared to the 60 cents I was paying back in 1984.

 

 

Come up here and buy a few.

[MightyBeanComics]

Remember, there was plenty of drek in the other "ages" of comics too.

 

Sure, but they were priced realistically, and with the insane price gouging of today's depressed and ever-shrinking market, they NEED to give readers their money's worth.

 

I wholly agree with you on the pricing JC.

[NewWorldOrder]

Remember, there was plenty of drek in the other "ages" of comics too.

 

Sure, but they were priced realistically, and with the insane price gouging of today's depressed and ever-shrinking market, they NEED to give readers their money's worth.

 

I wholly agree with you on the pricing JC.

 

Everything today is over priced. gas, movies, food, it's all the same.

[General Zod]

Was Bone ultra violent?

 

No. It had some violence, but in a similar vein as cartoons. Bone was great. We need more fun, all-ages adventure stories.

 

That's why I recommend The Spirit (well, the Darwyn Cooke issues, anyway) to those looking for such a thing.

[joe_collector]

Everything today is over priced. gas, movies, food, it's all the same.

 

As I, and many others have stated, the only commodity to even approach the rampant comic book inflation is coffee.

[seank]

Everything today is over priced. gas, movies, food, it's all the same.

 

As I, and many others have stated, the only commodity to even approach the rampant comic book inflation is coffee.

 

Friends don't let friends drink at Starbucks.

 

But a good cup of coffee is a marvelous thing. Much better than a good modern.

[Foolkiller]

So many good modern titles. I just cant agree. I find it hard to read alot of the stuff I grew up on these days. The storys on some of the "great" titles sucked, luckily I was 11 at the time. But the books that are out now, I have problems not buying comics, let alone dropping books. Most the flagship titles at both marvel and DC are good, let alone anything Geoff Jones or Ed Brubaker are writing is just gold.

 

The FF storyline has been dragging, but I will still wait to see what the book builds to. Millar and Hitch have there work cut out for them for a title that has been drowning for how many years ? They have to build something with this book to make it interesting again, otherwise Marvel may as well can it.

 

And I still havent read walking dead. I dont want to think how much it would cost to backtrack that series and im not a GN fan.

 

From a technical standpoint, I might agree that the quality of the writing and artwork is better. But the storytelling is not as good as even during the 80s and early 90s. The problem is that comics have accelerated in price but given little back in the line of characters who you really can identify and follow. The lack of continuity really hurts because you don't care about the characters and what happens. I have cut back to 7 moderns a month, and even that's too many.

[Chi Bamm]

So many good modern titles. I just cant agree. I find it hard to read alot of the stuff I grew up on these days. The storys on some of the "great" titles sucked, luckily I was 11 at the time. But the books that are out now, I have problems not buying comics, let alone dropping books. Most the flagship titles at both marvel and DC are good, let alone anything Geoff Jones or Ed Brubaker are writing is just gold.

 

The FF storyline has been dragging, but I will still wait to see what the book builds to. Millar and Hitch have there work cut out for them for a title that has been drowning for how many years ? They have to build something with this book to make it interesting again, otherwise Marvel may as well can it.

 

And I still havent read walking dead. I dont want to think how much it would cost to backtrack that series and im not a GN fan.

 

From a technical standpoint, I might agree that the quality of the writing and artwork is better. But the storytelling is not as good as even during the 80s and early 90s. The problem is that comics have accelerated in price but given little back in the line of characters who you really can identify and follow. The lack of continuity really hurts because you don't care about the characters and what happens. I have cut back to 7 moderns a month, and even that's too many.

 

That's the same thing I was thinking. The writers have become better however they are the focus and why people buy particular runs, Millar, Bendis, Morrison. They might make the series better for the short term, but as soon as they leave readership goes down and continuity is lost. It's almost as if writers are writing a "one-shot" for a series. Case in point, the Azzarello/Lee Superman run. I got a chance to reread the series and I'm still wondering WTF happened.

 

Also, to Resurrection, I was like you for a bit as well. I hated buying trades as I loved having the singles. However, it appears that trades are becoming increasingly more popular and more easily affordable with fans. And we all know that the writing seems more geared to a "collected" approach. So, please try to get on the bandwagon.

[Kevin Boyd]

Comic book periodical production is dead. It exists at this point to serve (a) completists (b) curiosity seekers (i.e. to test a story out) © to subsidize the eventual collected edition and to keep creators paid before the royalties from the book sales come in and (d) other minor reasons. Reasons (a) and © are the main reasons for why we still have comic books published as periodicals. 3,000 North American outlets for these periodicals is nothing and service a fraction of the population.

 

As comics have withdrawn from the world, the cost of making them (that is, paying everyone) has continued to increase - which is why the cost has increased. Basically, if the 3000 direct market outlets still want these things, they are going to cost more for them to buy/sell. If you want anything custom-made it's not going to be cheap, and what we remaining comics buyers are asking for are custom jobs for an exclusive market. Now as they've been doing that they've found that binding a half-dozen issues and getting them into the much larger bookstore market does pay off. So they started steering the stories towards the growing format, while still serializing them for the "custom job" direct market.

 

At this point I'm personally buying only a handful of "can't wait for the trade" periodicals (Captain America, Brave and the Bold, Walking Dead, Invincible), although I do get to read a handful of others for a friend (JLA, Ultimate Spider-Man, Ultimate X-Men, Batman, All Star Superman, All Star Batman and Robin). For over 15 years I used to buy over 30 titles a month but now I focus in on collected editions and while I may buy fewer periodicals I'm certainly buying more than 30 titles a month in collected edition format... all titles that I just don't see the point of purchasing the periodical for.

 

Vertigo, for example, should just stop making comic periodicals, they have almost no life in this format, yet are big sellers as trade paperbacks. We'll eventually reach the point where only big name Marvel and DC characters still get the serialized format.

 

Aside from variants and early issues of popular series, or "event" issues (like the Death of Cap), modern comics have no value as collectibles whatsoever. As soon as they are collected in trade or hardcover the demand for any periodical issues disappears almost completely. They go right into those dollar bins so retailers can recoup 66% of their investment.

 

Since publishers don't make money from the sale of back issues, more power to them if they can find a way to keep their products available and reorderable. Alan Moore hasn't produced regular comics in a while and yet he's still one of the best selling comics creator month after month. Look at Miracleman. Miracleman issues fetch large prices in the back issue market because there's no Miracleman trade out there for people to buy and read. If there was, back issues would sink like a stone. Conversely, Watchmen and V for Vendetta are perennial sellers as trades, reordered month after month and kept in print, yet the first printing serialized issues of those titles are available on the back issue market for only slightly more than they would have cost to get 20 years ago.

 

Sure, we can lament the old days, I miss them too... but going back and re-reading those comics I grew up with... the real standouts are the mini-series, the graphic novels and the short runs by popular creators. For every Byrne Fantastic Four run there's a forgettable DeFalco/Frenz FF run of by-the-numbers pseudo-Lee/Kirby. And more recently, for every Waid/Wieringo run there's a McDuffie/Pelletier run. Since I can pull those issue off the shelf and re-read them anytime, the mediocre stuff will pale by comparison. Why not just re-read the better books until the next great story comes along?

[Zonker]

I think that is mainly right on, but with this caveat--

 

Far from having periodicals reserved only for the big names, I'm thinking the periodicals may have some remaining life as the farm system to develop the next generation of talent. Otherwise, what publisher would front the money on an unproven talent's Original Graphical Novel pitch, much less a multi-TPB franchise like most of the Verigo library has become? The monthly serialization lets publishers a) place a smaller bet on the emerging skills of upcoming talent, and b) produce the equivalent of several pilot episodes for the monthly market before deciding to collect them.

 

Otherwise, where are the publishers going to find their next Brian K Vaughn?

[joe_collector]

Otherwise, where are the publishers going to find their next Brian K Vaughn?

 

Who?

[Kevin Boyd]

I think that is mainly right on, but with this caveat--

 

Far from having periodicals reserved only for the big names, I'm thinking the periodicals may have some remaining life as the farm system to develop the next generation of talent. Otherwise, what publisher would front the money on an unproven talent's Original Graphical Novel pitch, much less a multi-TPB franchise like most of the Verigo library has become? The monthly serialization lets publishers a) place a smaller bet on the emerging skills of upcoming talent, and b) produce the equivalent of several pilot episodes for the monthly market before deciding to collect them.

 

Otherwise, where are the publishers going to find their next Brian K Vaughn?

 

True enough. Vertigo --- and by extension it's sister line Minx --- are talent farms. However, Minx bypasses the periodical stage entirely and goes right to the graphic novel stage (with the exception that they are black and white). Vertigo could try to do the same thing on some of their concepts.

[Old Fashion PB and J]

So many good modern titles. I just cant agree. I find it hard to read alot of the stuff I grew up on these days. The storys on some of the "great" titles sucked, luckily I was 11 at the time. But the books that are out now, I have problems not buying comics, let alone dropping books. Most the flagship titles at both marvel and DC are good, let alone anything Geoff Jones or Ed Brubaker are writing is just gold.

 

The FF storyline has been dragging, but I will still wait to see what the book builds to. Millar and Hitch have there work cut out for them for a title that has been drowning for how many years ? They have to build something with this book to make it interesting again, otherwise Marvel may as well can it.

 

And I still havent read walking dead. I dont want to think how much it would cost to backtrack that series and im not a GN fan.

 

From a technical standpoint, I might agree that the quality of the writing and artwork is better. But the storytelling is not as good as even during the 80s and early 90s. The problem is that comics have accelerated in price but given little back in the line of characters who you really can identify and follow. The lack of continuity really hurts because you don't care about the characters and what happens. I have cut back to 7 moderns a month, and even that's too many.

 

That's the same thing I was thinking. The writers have become better however they are the focus and why people buy particular runs, Millar, Bendis, Morrison. They might make the series better for the short term, but as soon as they leave readership goes down and continuity is lost. It's almost as if writers are writing a "one-shot" for a series. Case in point, the Azzarello/Lee Superman run. I got a chance to reread the series and I'm still wondering WTF happened.

 

Also, to Resurrection, I was like you for a bit as well. I hated buying trades as I loved having the singles. However, it appears that trades are becoming increasingly more popular and more easily affordable with fans. And we all know that the writing seems more geared to a "collected" approach. So, please try to get on the bandwagon.

 

I read trades, I just dont buy them. A friend of mine buys almost only trades, so if curiosity peaks I borrow it. As far as my regular titles, im ok with singles. Besides the stuf I dont like eventually makes it way to one of my "bargain boxes".

 

Best statement in this thread " So please try and get on the bandwagon" . Thats funny.