The Official The Walking Dead Discussion Thread 13 13

[ThoseBackPages]

[JS]

I could of sworn James or anyone would come in and snipe that .

 

I only went to $675

 

People are sleeping right now.

 

Or has the bubble burst?!?!!

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Walking-Dead-Original-Art-Page-Issue-34-Page-7-Kirkman-Adlard1-/121206728104?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c387be5a8&nma=true&si=5MkGoFc5%252BKV8OFTLK2fXmdaQ4F8%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

that one? nice pick up!

[Hawkman]

.

Edited December 4, 2013 by Hawkman

[Hawkman]

Argh, it actually makes me angry thinking about it.

 

so, what you're saying is that kirkman obviously did a great job because he got the response out of you that he probably wanted.

[Katchoo]

No. You should expect to see 10 pages (less than half an issue) devoted to a rape revenge scene.

 

The rape revenge was the laziest writing I can even imagine and I don't think I should have to expect that (lazy writing) in any book.

 

So Rape is a lazy, brainless plot device?

 

In this case, most definitely 100% yes.

 

I'm not the first person to say this stuff. There are loads of blogs etc on rape as a plot device. Here's one example: http://www.dailylife.com.au/news-and-views/dl-opinion/can-we-stop-using-rape-as-a-plot-device-20130812-2rrwh.html. They usually say it much better than me. Or look up how much flack Mark Millar got for the rape in Kick 2 or Hitgirl or whatever it was.

 

It's 10 pages. And Michonne throws up and cries during it. She didn't want to have to do it. That's a plot device that builds character development

 

Builds character development? Because she threw up and cried? Kirkman needed to have her raped in order to build her character? Has the show suffered from having this cut out? Is Michonne a lesser developed character?

 

Walking Dead is "Suggested for Mature Readers". Take the good with the bad. Or in your case you can not take the bad (content). No worries.

 

There was nothing mature about what I'm complaining about. That's my problem with it.

 

Edited December 4, 2013 by Katchoo

[Katchoo]

.

Edited December 4, 2013 by Katchoo

[Katchoo]

Argh, it actually makes me angry thinking about it.

 

so, what you're saying is that kirkman obviously did a great job because he got the response out of you that he probably wanted.

 

Kirkman wanted me to be angry that he used a sensitive topic like rape as a plot device? He wanted me to think of him as a lazy, terrible writer appealing to the lowest common denominator?

[Hawkman]

Argh, it actually makes me angry thinking about it.

 

so, what you're saying is that kirkman obviously did a great job because he got the response out of you that he probably wanted.

 

Kirkman wanted me to be angry that he used a sensitive topic like rape as a plot device?

 

 

yes. that's what i said. and it worked perfectly.

Edited December 4, 2013 by Hawkman

[Katchoo]

Argh, it actually makes me angry thinking about it.

 

so, what you're saying is that kirkman obviously did a great job because he got the response out of you that he probably wanted.

 

Kirkman wanted me to be angry that he used a sensitive topic like rape as a plot device?

 

 

yes. that's what i said. and it worked perfectly.

 

I don't think you're making much (any) sense. It made me stop reading TWD and see him as a terrible writer. Why would he want that?

 

You're saying he used rape to get a response out of people. What kind of spooned up is that? It's not :censored:ing edgy or smart. It's pathetic. It's something I'd expect from a teenager writing their first "shocking" essay.

[dhurley]

It made me stop reading TWD and see him as a terrible writer. Why would he want that?

 

 

yeah Kirkman really sucks

 

[Katchoo]

It made me stop reading TWD and see him as a terrible writer. Why would he want that?

 

 

yeah Kirkman really sucks

 

 

LAWL what I meant to say is that Kirkman is an awesome writer and that is a fact that can be proven with SCIENCE.

 

etc

[comicsnyc22]

Nice pick up!

Thanks Bjorn.

 

Did you bid? Or was it not your cup of tea?

 

Haha-- I did bid, but decided to pass.

 

I'm still upset about that page James got that Jerry just posted! Can't believe it i missed it. I didn't even bid because I thought it was going to be 900+. Awesome pick up for him. I'm still awaiting my grail in the mail. Can't wait to show you guys.

[comicsnyc22]

I could of sworn James or anyone would come in and snipe that .

 

I only went to $675

 

People are sleeping right now.

 

Or has the bubble burst?!?!!

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Walking-Dead-Original-Art-Page-Issue-34-Page-7-Kirkman-Adlard1-/121206728104?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c387be5a8&nma=true&si=5MkGoFc5%252BKV8OFTLK2fXmdaQ4F8%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

that one? nice pick up!

 

There's the piece. Man!

[Garf]

Argh, it actually makes me angry thinking about it.

 

so, what you're saying is that kirkman obviously did a great job because he got the response out of you that he probably wanted.

 

Kirkman wanted me to be angry that he used a sensitive topic like rape as a plot device?

 

 

yes. that's what i said. and it worked perfectly.

 

I don't think you're making much (any) sense. It made me stop reading TWD and see him as a terrible writer. Why would he want that?

 

You're saying he used rape to get a response out of people. What kind of spooned up is that? It's not :censored:ing edgy or smart. It's pathetic. It's something I'd expect from a teenager writing their first "shocking" essay.

 

Fair enough...

 

Something I was discussing on PM which is kind of related (or touches on this) is that I can't understand the interest in these scenes when it comes to the art. There are some less than savoury moments depicting children having been beheaded, rape, mother and daughter shot, torture and generally assorted nasty endings to quite a few characters without naming them all. I just don't get why there is still a high value on these pieces when they are essentially taken outside of the context of the story. It's just a page containing only this content. Yuk!

 

I can understand your take on things but I think they are fitting within the context of a tale of horror, the human condition and survival without society. It is getting less effective over time though... but it's hard to knock it just because it is distasteful. The grim reality of this planet is that similar and worse things happen every day and that is with society being in place... it makes some of TWD seem not that far fetched.

[retrothecollector]

I could of sworn James or anyone would come in and snipe that .

 

I only went to $675

 

People are sleeping right now.

 

Or has the bubble burst?!?!!

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Walking-Dead-Original-Art-Page-Issue-34-Page-7-Kirkman-Adlard1-/121206728104?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c387be5a8&nma=true&si=5MkGoFc5%252BKV8OFTLK2fXmdaQ4F8%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

 

that one? nice pick up!

 

There's the piece. Man!

No I didn't get that one. I was sleeping that night. James got that one. I got this one...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/370951256384?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

[awakeintheashes]

 

It's 10 pages. And Michonne throws up and cries during it. She didn't want to have to do it. That's a plot device that builds character development

 

Builds character development? Because she threw up and cried? Kirkman needed to have her raped in order to build her character? Has the show suffered from having this cut out? Is Michonne a lesser developed character?

 

 

Michonne is a vastly lesser developed character, but it doesn't have anything to do with the rape scene being cut out. It has more to do with the producer for Season 2 and 3. He played played nicely with AMC but had no idea what the hell he was doing in translating the story and characters to television. He was finally replaced this season, and in my opinion, we have some of the best written, directed and... well...produced episodes of the series.

 

There is still a scene depicting the Governor's exerting his dominance over a woman through somewhat sexual means, but it is much much tamer than the comic and done more to mess with Glenn than anything else.

Edited December 4, 2013 by awakeintheashes

[comicsnyc22]

It's a plot device, plain and simple. Girl in the fridge to the nth degree. It's as cheap of a ploy as the guy hiding in the shower with the knife. Lazy...

[nikocb]

I must be a simpleton, because I love every aspect of the story. It's lazy? Who gives a mess if it's lazy? It's supposed to be entertaining, not introspective or profound.

I know that I was effected emotionally by those scenes in the book.. because I thoroughly cared for the character. And that's the thing I think Kirman does best. He creates characters and makes you care for them. That's not an easy thing to do and I don't think it should be undervalued.

Edited December 4, 2013 by nikocb

[Katchoo]

Fair enough...

 

Something I was discussing on PM which is kind of related (or touches on this) is that I can't understand the interest in these scenes when it comes to the art. There are some less than savoury moments depicting children having been beheaded, rape, mother and daughter shot, torture and generally assorted nasty endings to quite a few characters without naming them all. I just don't get why there is still a high value on these pieces when they are essentially taken outside of the context of the story. It's just a page containing only this content. Yuk!

 

I can understand your take on things but I think they are fitting within the context of a tale of horror, the human condition and survival without society. It is getting less effective over time though... but it's hard to knock it just because it is distasteful. The grim reality of this planet is that similar and worse things happen every day and that is with society being in place... it makes some of TWD seem not that far fetched.

 

Like I said, other people can argue this much more eloquently than me but you can read about the backlash Mark Millar recently got for pretty much the same thing.

 

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Why-Kick--2-Creator-Mark-Millar-Rape-Comments-Have-So-Many-People-Angry-38950.html - that article puts it quite well but it was the first one google found for me so I'm sure there are better.

 

I think the argument of including rape so that the story remains realistic is problematic for a number of reasons but in this case I find it hard to believe that this extra bit of realism is needed in a zombie book.

 

By the way, the person who said that Kirkman wanted to make people angry by including the rape scene - that's pretty much the hallmark of a hack.

[Solar]

Something I was discussing on PM which is kind of related (or touches on this) is that I can't understand the interest in these scenes when it comes to the art. There are some less than savoury moments depicting children having been beheaded, rape, mother and daughter shot, torture and generally assorted nasty endings to quite a few characters without naming them all. I just don't get why there is still a high value on these pieces when they are essentially taken outside of the context of the story. It's just a page containing only this content. Yuk!

 

But comic art isn't collected outside of the context of the story. Most comic art is if you're looking at it from a purely aesthetic POV, but some of that art is highly sought after as a memento of a story the collector has interest in.