How far into the '80's will the Bronze Age creep?

[TupennyConan]

Shouldn't it stop with DD158 & absolutely no later?

 

Or maybe, at the very, very latest, Dark Knight?

 

Or will it just keep right on going straight up to ASM300 & beyond?

[BronzeBruce13]

Great idea for a thread.

I was wondering this as well. I suppose we're going to get reshuffled every so often.

 

To me, Bronze will always be

"Classic Bronze" 1970-1979 (the end of '79)

 

I have not bought this year's guide, but judging from some bronze registry sets I've perused recently, I assume it's now...

"New-Age Bronze" 1970-1983 ?

 

 

I don't disagree that some of those books from 80-83ish "feel" bronze, as do some late 69 issues, but I don't know how to feel about someone deciding to shuffle the era. Is this common? Has the Golden or Silver age ever went through a date range adjustment in the guide? I know we have to create new era's such as "Copper" to allow for a new starting point whenever a new "Modern" phase begins. Even still, I'm not sure I understand why Bronze being tinkered with?

[gilbertotorres]

i think 70 to 79 would be bronze. i dont like when people keep on changing these things. i heard some say 86 for some reason.

[BronzeBruce13]

86 is a bit far... I'd rather see new "in-between" eras like they do with grades instead of moving the line.

 

Why not a "Bronze-Copper" era from 1980 to 1985 between Classic Bronze and Copper.

Sorta' like a VF/NM between VF+ and NM-

[kimik]

Actually, why can't the end of the BA be June 1977 and the Copper Age starting with Star Wars #1 in July 1977? My rationale for this is that the old timers on the board have posted numerous times that SW #1 saved the comic industry which was faltering in 1976.Wouldn't this be similar to the impact that Showcase #4 had in 1956?

 

We could have the following breaks:

 

Bronze Age 1969 - 1977 (15 cent to 25/30 covers)

Copper Age 1977 (SW #1) - 1986 or 1989 (pick your poison)

Modern Age 1990 (variant silliness begins) - now (variant silliness continues)

[gilbertotorres]

for me:

 

bronze (1970-1979)

 

copper (1980- 1995)

 

modern (1996- current)

[BronzeBruce13]

Actually, why can't the end of the BA be June 1977 and the Copper Age starting with Star Wars #1 in July 1977? My rationale for this is that the old timers on the board have posted numerous times that SW #1 saved the comic industry which was faltering in 1976.Wouldn't this be similar to the impact that Showcase #4 had in 1956?

 

We could have the following breaks:

 

Bronze Age 1969 - 1977 (15 cent to 25/30 covers)

Copper Age 1977 (SW #1) - 1986 or 1989 (pick your poison)

Modern Age 1990 (variant silliness begins) - now (variant silliness continues)

 

Interesting argument.

I don't mind this take on Bronze since, for the most part, after '77 it didn't "feel" the same to me (and also I wasn't blown away by much)... and I like the inclusion of 69 to some degree.

[DrWatson]

You just can't pick a year and chop a run off at the end of that particular year. The transition of age is different for different runs. To say that anything after 1979 isn't Bronze and that everything starting in 1980 is Copper is just silly.

[rodan57]

I collect Silver Age and I am not too familiar with later pricing structures. Is it possible to make a connection between the original price of a book and the age it belongs to?

 

 

[joe_collector]

Huh. I've never heard this before. Is there a thread about this somewhere?

 

I think he's getting Dazzler #1 mixed up with Star Wars #1.

 

And to say 1977 ends the BA is pretty bizarre, considering it cuts out a ton of seminal BA stories, the Dark Pheonix Saga being a very notable one.

 

And licensing properties, like Star Wars, is a Marvel BA trend due to the success of a licensed Conan series, and really took off through the 70's (Kull, Thongor, SW, Shogun Warriors, Godzilla, Doc Savage, Tarzan, John Carter, Logan's Run, 2001: A Space Odyssey, Human Fly, Scooby/Flintstones/Yogi, ROM, etc.), then with GI Joe ('82), only to drift away during the 80's.

 

 

[bigfiver69]

For me - a non-hero collector of war comics - one of the quintessential bronze age titles is Weird War Tales, and I put the end of the bronze age at that month of that title's demise - June, 1983.

 

I think the placement of the 'Age' brackets is a very personal thing, and a reflection of what you collect(ed). Marvel fans of particular books will have their own milestones. DC hero fans might mark the beginning of the copper age with the first issue of the New Teen Titans. For horror fans, it might be the cancellation of the horror books, while for others it's the cancellation of Jonah Hex.

 

Shep

 

 

[Mutant Manatee]

I think the placement of the 'Age' brackets is a very personal thing, and a reflection of what you collect(ed). Marvel fans of particular books will have their own milestones. DC hero fans might mark the beginning of the copper age with the first issue of the New Teen Titans. For horror fans, it might be the cancellation of the horror books, while for others it's the cancellation of Jonah Hex.

 

Well put. That's why the Bronze Age to me will always be 1970-1979. You will never get a concensus on whether Watchmen #1 ended the Bronze Age, or Dark Knight #1, or the last issue of Sgt. Fury, etc.

[BronzeBruce13]

You just can't pick a year and chop a run off at the end of that particular year. The transition of age is different for different runs. To say that anything after 1979 isn't Bronze and that everything starting in 1980 is Copper is just silly.

 

Unfortunately, it has to be kept somewhat general though.

Although I agree that "Eras" begin and end at varying junctures from a title perspective, it would be impossible to integrate that into a final date for all titles (like an average or something).

 

In some ways I relate to the arguments going either way (although I'm more a traditionalist in regards to Bronze). I understand the idea of extending it into the 80's a bit since other era's were not as short as bronze in length of time. That said, as I mentioned, from a personal standpoint, later bronze "felt" much different to me than earlier... although I realize that's a personal take. For instance, Warlock #1 (1972) and Moonknight #1 (1980) feel an "era" apart to me.

 

I know this is my own personal take, but when bronze extends out past 35¢... it changes to me. The "Heart of Bronze" will always be on the early side for me with (some 15¢)-20¢-25¢ covers. Once books hit 30 & 35¢ that's where (for me) it started winding down for the most part. With some exceptions, once I see 40¢-50¢ cover prices and higher, Bronze starts to "feel" like something else.

 

Of course though, it's all a personal thing... I've heard many arguments or opinions that I can't disagree with too much either.

[BronzeBruce13]

And licensing properties, like Star Wars, is a Marvel BA trend due to the success of a licensed Conan series, and really took off through the 70's (Kull, Thongor, SW, Shogun Warriors, Godzilla, Doc Savage, Tarzan, John Carter, Logan's Run, 2001: A Space Odyssey, Human Fly, Scooby/Flintstones/Yogi, ROM, etc.), then with GI Joe ('82), only to drift away during the 80's.

 

Interesting take on it

About what year does bronze stop feeling bronze to you Vince?

and.. would that date move if you factor in/out the Byrne X-men run from the equation?

[DrWatson]

You just can't pick a year and chop a run off at the end of that particular year. The transition of age is different for different runs. To say that anything after 1979 isn't Bronze and that everything starting in 1980 is Copper is just silly.

 

Unfortunately, it has to be kept somewhat general though.

Although I agree that "Eras" begin and end at varying junctures from a title perspective, it would be impossible to integrate that into a final date for all titles (like an average or something).

 

In some ways I relate to the arguments going either way (although I'm more a traditionalist in regards to Bronze). I understand the idea of extending it into the 80's a bit since other era's were not as short as bronze in length of time. That said, as I mentioned, from a personal standpoint, later bronze "felt" much different to me than earlier... although I realize that's a personal take. For instance, Warlock #1 (1972) and Moonknight #1 (1980) feel an "era" apart to me.

 

I know this is my own personal take, but when bronze extends out past 35¢... it changes to me. The "Heart of Bronze" will always be on the early side for me with (some 15¢)-20¢-25¢ covers. Once books hit 30 & 35¢ that's where (for me) it started winding down for the most part. With some exceptions, once I see 40¢-50¢ cover prices and higher, Bronze starts to "feel" like something else.

 

Of course though, it's all a personal thing... I've heard many arguments or opinions that I can't disagree with too much either.

I like to think of it along the lines of geological time. For example, the Bronze Age can be thought of as the Mesozoic era. Then, as the Mesozoic era is divide into three periods; the Triassic, Jurassic and the Cretaceous, we have early Bronze, middle Bronze and late Bronze. Of course there will be some line blurring with respective comic book titles as late Silver age bleeds into early Bronze and as late Bronze bleeds into early Copper. To put an exact beginning and an exact ending on an Age, to me, still seems to be a reach; however, I do believe that it can be done on a per issue basis. Such as, Fantastic Four 232 is a Copper age book and X-Men 125 is a Bronze age book and so on and so forth.

[BronzeBruce13]

I like to think of it along the lines of geological time. For example, the Bronze Age can be thought of as the Mesozoic era. Then, as the Mesozoic era is divide into three periods; the Triassic, Jurassic and the Cretaceous, we have early Bronze, middle Bronze and late Bronze. Of course there will be some line blurring with respective comic book titles as late Silver age bleeds into early Bronze and as late Bronze bleeds into early Copper. To put an exact beginning and an exact ending on an Age, to me, still seems to be a reach; however, I do believe that it can be done on a per issue basis. Such as, Fantastic Four 232 is a Copper age book and X-Men 125 is a Bronze age book and so on and so forth.

 

I like it...

[DrWatson]

Thanks. I hurt my brain on that post.

[mjacobs8]

Some say the end of the "Bronze Age" is marked by the emergence of the "direct market", not the begining or end of any comic title, or event. I disagree with this notion. Judging by the responses in this thread the "Bronze Age" ended over a period of several years.

[Mutant Manatee]

To me, it is so easy and clean to say that books with cover dates up to December 1979 are Bronze Age and books with covers dates of January 1980 or later are Copper Age. That way there is no blurring or debate.

 

Sure, you can divide the Bronze Age into Early Bronze, Mid Bronze and Late Bronze, but then how do you decide which books are in those sub-categories? It seems somewhat arbitrary.

 

In a way it also makes sense to me that the Bronze Age didn't last as long as the Gold or Silver Ages, because in the 1970's cover prices were increasing much more frequently.

 

The Bronze Age era has been debated to death, opinions vary widely, and it doesn't appear that there will ever be a consensus.

[kimik]

Huh. I've never heard this before. Is there a thread about this somewhere?

 

I think he's getting Dazzler #1 mixed up with Star Wars #1.

 

 

Nope. Here is the link to one of Chuck's rants (where did the earlier post go?), Evolution of the Direct Market, on the MH website that provides further details. Basically, the industry was in the tank until SW #1 came around, there were really no other licensed products at the time, so that issue brought the industry out of the doldrums.

 

Here is an interesting quote from that rant:

 

It is a little know fact that while finding the Edgar Church collection of mint Golden Age comics helped increase sales at Mile High Comics during 1977, sales of STAR WARS merchandise actually helped us generate far more income. Of even more importance was the fact that STAR WARS #1 sold over a million copies during its various printings, proving to all the comics publishers that there was still some life out there, if you could just find the right subject material. In my opinion, that was one substantial reason reason why Marvel and DC didn't just shut down during that dreadful year.