Another reason to consider cameos true first appearances?

[General Zod]

And that doesn't change the fact that a one panel appearance is still a "first" appearance.

 

Was my oh-so-obvious point not clear?

 

It is a BRIEF first appearance (single panel, last page), and needs to be noted like that because some people actually (gasp) READ their comics, and may actually want to READ a story about Wolverine, not a single panel.

 

That's the reason for the "brief" qualifier, and it's pretty freaking basic.

 

Roy's got a point, though. Technically, #181 is the 2nd appearance and the first full Wolverine story.

[joe_collector]

What is basic chat forum 101 is that you will never admit when you are wrong.

 

- so you're saying me, Overstreet, CGC, and virtually any comic-based publication is WRONG? And you're somehow right?

 

Sorry, but I'll sit over here with OS and CGC thank you very much.

 

If he appeared in Hulk #180 then I really don't need to ask anyone else what they think.

 

Sorry, but there are "accepted norms" in any hobby, and if you choose to totally disregard them, that's cool, but don't go around calling CGC, OS, etc. "stupid" for not "getting it".

 

I think they have a *little* more experience in the hobby than you.

[joe_collector]

And that doesn't change the fact that a one panel appearance is still a "first" appearance.

 

Was my oh-so-obvious point not clear?

 

It is a BRIEF first appearance (single panel, last page), and needs to be noted like that because some people actually (gasp) READ their comics, and may actually want to READ a story about Wolverine, not a single panel.

 

That's the reason for the "brief" qualifier, and it's pretty freaking basic.

 

Roy's got a point, though. Technically, #181 is the 2nd appearance and the first full Wolverine story.

 

Huh? It's the FIRST BRIEF APPEARANCE. That means it's the FIRST APPEARANCE, but since it was only a SINGLE PANEL, the BRIEF qualifier is required so that people who actually READ the comics know that the FIRST FULL APPEARANCE of Wolverine was in Hulk 181.

 

How much more basic can I get?

[Guest]

And that doesn't change the fact that a one panel appearance is still a "first" appearance.

 

Was my oh-so-obvious point not clear?

 

It is a BRIEF first appearance (single panel, last page), and needs to be noted like that because some people actually (gasp) READ their comics, and may actually want to READ a story about Wolverine, not a single panel.

 

That's the reason for the "brief" qualifier, and it's pretty freaking basic.

 

Roy's got a point, though. Technically, #181 is the 2nd appearance and the first full Wolverine story.

 

Huh? It's the FIRST BRIEF APPEARANCE. That means it's the FIRST APPEARANCE, but since it was only a SINGLE PANEL, the BRIEF qualifier is required so that people who actually READ the comics know that the FIRST FULL APPEARANCE of Wolverine was in Hulk 181.

 

How much more basic can I get?

 

So, you DO agree with Roy. Glad you two finally came to terms!

[VintageComics]

[joe_collector]

Hi, my name is Grails and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

[joe_collector]

I apologize to JC, as I realize that disagreeing with OS, CGC and virtually any comic book publication or organization is foolhardly at best.

 

[VintageComics]

I apologize to JC, as I realize that disagreeing with OS, CGC and virtually any comic book publication or organization is foolhardly at best.

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Hi, my name is Grails and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

 

That was supposed to be private.

[joe_collector]

Hi, my name is Grails and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

 

That was supposed to be private.

 

Too late now sucka!

[DrWatson]

Hi, my name is joe_collector and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

 

That was supposed to be private.

I wouldn't worry. He's just projecting. (thumbs u

[TheAvenger80]

Vince just because the masses do not agree does not make me wrong.

 

Nope, when you're talking comic valuations/most important "first" appearance, it most certainly does.

 

Regardless of value's, Hulk 180 IS the first appearance of the Wolverine.

#181 does of course, bring the Wolverine to life and you get litte bit of a feeling for what the Wolverine is all about. With #180 is just a panel of him, but no matter, #180 IS the VERY FIRST appearance of the Wolverine.

 

Did the Wolverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #180? - No!

 

Did the Woverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #181? - Yes, Hulk #180 - even if it was only one panel.

 

Should Hulk #181 be worth more than #180 - The public has spoken and the answer is YES ( I strongly agree also). If you're talking about "important" first appearances then yes #181 is far more important of an appearance then #180, but

the fact does remain that #180 is THEEE first appearance of the Wolverine.

(thumbs u

 

 

 

Haha, I believe you summed the situation up pretty well

[joe_collector]

Hi, my name is Dr Watson and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

 

That was supposed to be private.

I wouldn't worry. He's just projecting. (thumbs u

 

The only think you "project" are greggy home movies in your living room... with the shades drawn.

[DrWatson]

Hi, my name is Dr Watson and I love reading Playgirl in the bathtub with a handful of lotion

 

Fixed that for ya. (thumbs u

 

That was supposed to be private.

I wouldn't worry. He's just projecting. (thumbs u

 

The only think you "project" are greggy home movies in your living room... with the shades drawn.

I'd take greggy over you any day, Nerd King.

[brasseye]

Vince just because the masses do not agree does not make me wrong.

 

Nope, when you're talking comic valuations/most important "first" appearance, it most certainly does.

 

Regardless of value's, Hulk 180 IS the first appearance of the Wolverine.

#181 does of course, bring the Wolverine to life and you get litte bit of a feeling for what the Wolverine is all about. With #180 is just a panel of him, but no matter, #180 IS the VERY FIRST appearance of the Wolverine.

 

Did the Wolverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #180? - No!

 

Did the Woverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #181? - Yes, Hulk #180 - even if it was only one panel.

 

Should Hulk #181 be worth more than #180 - The public has spoken and the answer is YES ( I strongly agree also). If you're talking about "important" first appearances then yes #181 is far more important of an appearance then #180, but

the fact does remain that #180 is THEEE first appearance of the Wolverine.

(thumbs u

 

 

 

Haha, I believe you summed the situation up pretty well

 

People here for #180 are neglecting that the first apperance in one panel amounts to a portrait at best. Which is arguably equivalent to a house ad. Which is why many ad's are never considered 1st apperances.

 

But then we have the whole Gobblygook thing. But then those books are rare in their own, and as TMNT was just as much a brand success as a comic success, the first 'rendering' of them attracts some value over the first story line they were included in. Which goes some way to explaining the great price on the Hellboy first 'rendering' in Dime Press.

 

Not to say Wolverine is less iconic. Just to say in terms of straight value #181 combines a cover apperance, plus a full story. So in straight value terms it completely outstrips #180. #180 if anything is best described as a teaser. With no story line involved, it was gimick linking to the next issue. So more likened to an ad than a truly worthy first apperance.

 

And yes, the market accurately reflects that.

[joe_collector]

People here for #180 are neglecting that the first apperance in one panel amounts to a portrait at best. Which is arguably equivalent to a house ad.

[VintageComics]

What if they called it a 1st published appearance?

 

Would that make more sense?

[brasseye]

People here for #180 are neglecting that the first apperance in one panel amounts to a portrait at best. Which is arguably equivalent to a house ad.

 

 

mess that ad outstrips #180's contribution to Wolverine's 'first apperance' by a long way

[Mr. Zipper]

Vince just because the masses do not agree does not make me wrong.

 

Nope, when you're talking comic valuations/most important "first" appearance, it most certainly does.

 

Regardless of value's, Hulk 180 IS the first appearance of the Wolverine.

#181 does of course, bring the Wolverine to life and you get litte bit of a feeling for what the Wolverine is all about. With #180 is just a panel of him, but no matter, #180 IS the VERY FIRST appearance of the Wolverine.

 

Did the Wolverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #180? - No!

 

Did the Woverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #181? - Yes, Hulk #180 - even if it was only one panel.

 

Should Hulk #181 be worth more than #180 - The public has spoken and the answer is YES ( I strongly agree also). If you're talking about "important" first appearances then yes #181 is far more important of an appearance then #180, but

the fact does remain that #180 is THEEE first appearance of the Wolverine.

(thumbs u

 

 

 

Haha, I believe you summed the situation up pretty well

 

People here for #180 are neglecting that the first apperance in one panel amounts to a portrait at best. Which is arguably equivalent to a house ad. Which is why many ad's are never considered 1st apperances.

 

But then we have the whole Gobblygook thing. But then those books are rare in their own, and as TMNT was just as much a brand success as a comic success, the first 'rendering' of them attracts some value over the first story line they were included in. Which goes some way to explaining the great price on the Hellboy first 'rendering' in Dime Press.

 

Not to say Wolverine is less iconic. Just to say in terms of straight value #181 combines a cover apperance, plus a full story. So in straight value terms it completely outstrips #180. #180 if anything is best described as a teaser. With no story line involved, it was gimick linking to the next issue. So more likened to an ad than a truly worthy first apperance.

 

And yes, the market accurately reflects that.

 

I agree with half of your point.

 

If I recall correctly, the Wolverine speaks and is named in the last panel of 180. Thus, he is part of the story and the cliffhanger which leads into 181. So, it amounts to far more than a "house ad." It is the "first appearance" however brief.

 

In terms of the valuation, I agree with you and that point really can't be debated as the market has decided that the first cover and first full appearance is more desirable than the technical "first appearance."

[General Zod]

Vince just because the masses do not agree does not make me wrong.

 

Nope, when you're talking comic valuations/most important "first" appearance, it most certainly does.

 

Regardless of value's, Hulk 180 IS the first appearance of the Wolverine.

#181 does of course, bring the Wolverine to life and you get litte bit of a feeling for what the Wolverine is all about. With #180 is just a panel of him, but no matter, #180 IS the VERY FIRST appearance of the Wolverine.

 

Did the Wolverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #180? - No!

 

Did the Woverine appear in another book prior to Hulk #181? - Yes, Hulk #180 - even if it was only one panel.

 

Should Hulk #181 be worth more than #180 - The public has spoken and the answer is YES ( I strongly agree also). If you're talking about "important" first appearances then yes #181 is far more important of an appearance then #180, but

the fact does remain that #180 is THEEE first appearance of the Wolverine.

(thumbs u

 

 

 

Haha, I believe you summed the situation up pretty well

 

People here for #180 are neglecting that the first apperance in one panel amounts to a portrait at best. Which is arguably equivalent to a house ad. Which is why many ad's are never considered 1st apperances.

 

But then we have the whole Gobblygook thing. But then those books are rare in their own, and as TMNT was just as much a brand success as a comic success, the first 'rendering' of them attracts some value over the first story line they were included in. Which goes some way to explaining the great price on the Hellboy first 'rendering' in Dime Press.

 

Not to say Wolverine is less iconic. Just to say in terms of straight value #181 combines a cover apperance, plus a full story. So in straight value terms it completely outstrips #180. #180 if anything is best described as a teaser. With no story line involved, it was gimick linking to the next issue. So more likened to an ad than a truly worthy first apperance.

 

And yes, the market accurately reflects that.

 

I agree with half of your point.

 

If I recall correctly, the Wolverine speaks and is named in the last panel of 180. Thus, he is part of the story and the cliffhanger which leads into 181. So, it amounts to far more than a "house ad." It is the "first appearance" however brief.

 

In terms of the valuation, I agree with you and that point really can't be debated as the market has decided that the first cover and first full appearance is more desirable than the technical "first appearance."

 

Bingo. It is still correctly the 2nd appearance but first cover and "full" story featuring said character. However brief his first time in the book was, it was still part of the (continued) storyline and not an ad or promo. The market likes seeing the character show up on the cover, therefore that is why they will spend more money on that.