Is it time for CGC board marketplace sales to be reported to GPA?

[Silver Surfer]

Dealers sell on these boards all of the time and I'm betting they report those sales to GPA (they should). It might be difficut to administer at first but it doesn't mean its a bad idea.

[DrWatson]

I never thought I would ever say this, but I can see where Jim is coming from. It's not the people that I would trust that I have a problem with, it's the ones I don't. How do you allow one and not the other?

[awe4one]

I can understand some of your concerns. However, I'm lost as to why you would trust my data less than you would the stuff received from Doug 'Can I pay for those with a company check?' Schmell?

 

It's not a matter of trust Nick. GPA has a system in place where they can get their information from a number of sources, like them or not, that allows them to consolidate data to get a gauge on what is selling and for how much. They don't need Board sells to get this information and even though you are honest doesn't mean they won't register someone that isn't in a moment of weakness. And the chance for the headcases here is more than the established network that's been set-up. Also, the number of sales here probably isn't worth their time vs. the potential headaches that could occur.

 

If you were George would you sacrifice your good standing in the hobby, not to mention the $8.95 a month, to pursue an avenue of information that is limited and much more of a headache considering the numbers of different people involved?

 

Lke I say, there no need to break what's already working to satisfy the whims of message board posters, and occasional sellers, unless that new source of information is relatively rock solid. Sales on a message board doesn't meet that criteria in my opinion...

 

Jim

[VintageComics]

I never thought I would ever say this, but I can where Jim is coming from. It's not the people that I would trust that I have a problem with, it's the ones I don't. How do you allow one and not the other?

 

Jim, how do you decipher who to trust on Ebay, or if a shill drives a bid up on another site?

 

 

You can't ever know for sure...but we police ourselves better on here than most others.

 

R.

 

 

[awe4one]

You are obviously daft, lazy, don't care or all of the above.

 

You obviously didn't like the answer...

 

1) Yes

 

2) No way of knowing but you can't argue that GPA has become the established model using that data. So either they are reliable using that data or not. That's for you to decide...

 

Jim

[DrWatson]

I never thought I would ever say this, but I can where Jim is coming from. It's not the people that I would trust that I have a problem with, it's the ones I don't. How do you allow one and not the other?

 

Jim, how do you decipher who to trust on Ebay, or if a shill drives a bid up on another site?

 

 

You can't ever know for sure...but we police ourselves better on here than most others.

 

R.

 

Who is reporting this data from the forum to GPA?

[VintageComics]

I never thought I would ever say this, but I can where Jim is coming from. It's not the people that I would trust that I have a problem with, it's the ones I don't. How do you allow one and not the other?

 

Jim, how do you decipher who to trust on Ebay, or if a shill drives a bid up on another site?

 

 

You can't ever know for sure...but we police ourselves better on here than most others.

 

R.

 

Who is reporting this data from the forum to GPA?

 

Right now?

 

I'm assuming only dealers that already report GPA data from sales made elswhere.

 

R.

 

 

[fantastic_four]

Again, these would be board members pre-approved by George. New forum IDs created by Hammer, Bugaboo or Major Khaos wouldn't make the grade.

 

How does George determine that you're reputable and MajorKhaos is an arrogant dipwad?

[DrWatson]

If GPA data is taken from the forum, then who is reporting that data to GPA? Not everyone who sells there is a dealer. I guess what I am asking is who is reporting the data in your and Jeff's scenario of all the forum sales being reported to GPA?

[VintageComics]

 

2) No way of knowing but you can't argue that GPA has become the established model using that data. So either they are reliable using that data or not. That's for you to decide...

 

 

That is such a "throw the baby with the bathwater" statement. Just because it's too much work for you to think about and do something about it does mean it is the same for others.

 

GPA does not know the legitimacy of the sales anymore than you or I do.

 

1) They go by the word of the person or dealer supplying the data OR

 

2) by recording Ebay sales.

 

In the case of #1 I'm quite sure George does not phone every buyer or seller to verify sales completion. In fact in the case of auctions where buyers are anonymous he can't do this.

 

In the case of #2 how is there any less shill bidding, dishonest transactions or any other funny business than we would have here?

 

[nearmint]

If GPA data is taken from the forum, then who is reporting that data to GPA? Not everyone who sells there is a dealer. I guess what I am asking is who is reporting the data in your and Jeff's scenario of all the forum sales being reported to GPA?

 

One thought mentioned earlier was to have a specific thread where sales could be listed. George could extract from that thread, or someone could take on the task of submitting it to him.

[nearmint]

Again, these would be board members pre-approved by George. New forum IDs created by Hammer, Bugaboo or Major Khaos wouldn't make the grade.

 

How does George determine that you're reputable and MajorKhaos is an arrogant dipwad?

 

Reputation, I suppose. The same way he currently makes that determination with dealers, auction houses, etc.

[DrWatson]

I still feel that the opportunity for manipulation is too great, not to say that it isn't an admirable idea. Two or three people just keep jumping to the front of my mind.

[nearmint]

I still feel that the opportunity for manipulation is too great, not to say that it isn't an admirable idea. Two or three people just keep jumping to the front of my mind.

 

Are they naked?

[VintageComics]

If GPA data is taken from the forum, then who is reporting that data to GPA? Not everyone who sells there is a dealer. I guess what I am asking is who is reporting the data in your and Jeff's scenario of all the forum sales being reported to GPA?

 

One thought mentioned earlier was to have a specific thread where sales could be listed. George could extract from that thread, or someone could take on the task of submitting it to him.

 

To take it a step further, you can have a pre-approved submitter's list based on criteria.

 

The criteria can be something along the lines of

 

a) prerequesite amount of time on the board.

b) prerequisite amount of references within the hobby/forum

c) prerequisite amount of outside forum references (such as Ebay feedback, etc)

 

Those that are approved would be allowed to make a post in the GPA reporting thread. Any non approved posts would be either deleted or ignored.

Any discrepencies could also be followed up on.

 

 

For example. Seller A says he sold a book to B. Then B says it's in his collection forever. A month later member C joins the boards and shows everyone how he has bought the same book from the A/B transaction...but from another source.

 

The book is tracked using the CGC cert number.

 

That A/B transaction is stricken, and A/B are banned from reporting to GPA.

 

Just a few loose thoughts.

 

R.

 

 

[nearmint]

Works for me. (thumbs u

[fantastic_four]

Reputation, I suppose. The same way he currently makes that determination with dealers, auction houses, etc.

 

He can immediately have greater trust in professional dealers and auction houses simply because of the vested interest professionals have in keeping their business going. Individual reputation passes via word of mouth, which George usually wouldn't have access to. How does George discover that you, Nearmint, are a reputable seller? And how does he discover if you at some point become disreputable?

 

A better question is how did George decide to start accepting sales from Mark Zaid? Zaid doesn't sell comics for a living.

[DrWatson]

I still feel that the opportunity for manipulation is too great, not to say that it isn't an admirable idea. Two or three people just keep jumping to the front of my mind.

 

Are they naked?

God, I hope not.

[nearmint]

Reputation, I suppose. The same way he currently makes that determination with dealers, auction houses, etc.

 

He can immediately have greater trust in professional dealers and auction houses simply because of the vested interest professionals have in keeping their business going. Individual reputation passes via word of mouth, which George usually wouldn't have access to. How does George discover that you, Nearmint, are a reputable seller? And how does he discover if you at some point become disreputable?

 

A better question is how did George decide to start accepting sales from Mark Zaid? Zaid doesn't sell comics for a living.

 

George is more plugged into the hobby than you seem to think. Why wouldn't he have as much access to word-of-mouth as anyone else?

 

How does he discover that I'm a reputable seller? Well, there's my 500+ 100% ebay feedback rating, my reputation here on the boards, or he could ask dealers that he already accepts data from about me.

 

The idea that a dealer is instantly trustworthy because comics are his main source of income is ridiculous. We've all encountered unscrupulous dealers who were more concerned about making a buck than they were about their reputation.

[burntboy]

I can understand some of your concerns. However, I'm lost as to why you would trust my data less than you would the stuff received from Doug 'Can I pay for those with a company check?' Schmell?

 

It's not a matter of trust Nick. GPA has a system in place where they can get their information from a number of sources, like them or not, that allows them to consolidate data to get a gauge on what is selling and for how much. They don't need Board sells to get this information and even though you are honest doesn't mean they won't register someone that isn't in a moment of weakness. And the chance for the headcases here is more than the established network that's been set-up. Also, the number of sales here probably isn't worth their time vs. the potential headaches that could occur.

 

If you were George would you sacrifice your good standing in the hobby, not to mention the $8.95 a month, to pursue an avenue of information that is limited and much more of a headache considering the numbers of different people involved?

 

Lke I say, there no need to break what's already working to satisfy the whims of message board posters, and occasional sellers, unless that new source of information is relatively rock solid. Sales on a message board doesn't meet that criteria in my opinion...

 

Jim

 

Well we're back to normal now...

 

Here's what i truly don't understand with your stance versus Roy's;

 

You are apparently satisfied with the way things are with GPA, and you feel info from these specific message boards would dilute the overall level of accuracy.

 

But how can you possibly feel that the level of veracity with E-bay sales data (which is almost certainly the preponderance of the data) could ever exceed what you'd get from THIS board??

 

E-Bay is anonymous. the only real check and balance in the e-bay transaction is IF the e-bay fee got paid and even that don't necessarily mean diddly squat.

 

Personally, I'd trust the sales data compiled here much more, particularly if the list of authorized sellers were limited to those with credibility and some measurable sales data. the transparency and Peer pressure of this board would nicely police the data IMHO.

 

the methodology of determining whose data to accept seems to be the only sticking point..........