Copies and copy cats

[Artemaria]

Since a certain auction for decent copies of Neal Adams pages resulted in jaw dropping prices (for copies at least) a few months ago, there have been a series of subsequent auctions for copies: Here are a couple:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=220291128097

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/UNCANNY-X-MEN-116-ORIGINAL-PROOF-PAGE-JOHN-BYRNE-ART_W0QQitemZ360097490837QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item360097490837&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ebayphotohosting

 

--- if the links are broken, these are auctions for copies of Jim Lee Wildcats pages, which ended for less than $10 for the lot of copies, and a current auction for a self-described photo proof copy of a John Byrne X-men page with an asking of $649. In all fairness, the John Byrne page was hand signed, while the Jim Lee was not.

 

There is some precedent for this in that mechanical copies of covers of historical covers recently have fetched some decent returns. And, while a mechanical cover or a proof copy of a panel page is not something that would make its way into my collection, the argument is clearer for the mechanical cover in that it has a stamp on the back, possibly some original art in the margins and was somehow significantly involved in the production process. The relevance, if any, of the proof copy other than it is a full sized copy of the page possibly checked for typos is somewhat less clear.

 

Certainly, the argument can be made that the emergence of proof copies and mechanical covers is the creation of a second tier of art for collectors who currently find themselves priced out of an original 1960s Kirby cover. But is this really a harbinger of things to come? Or, is it a market anomaly to satisfy an overwhelming current demand for the same few pieces in which everyone seems to be interested?

 

As always, thanks for your thoughts.

 

Best regards.

 

- A

[spider9698]

I would say anomaly. Certainly in these economic times that would be the exception rather than the rule.

 

[CAP Freak]

I might fancy myself a nice large copy of a Kirby Splash or Panel Page for framing purposes.

[*paull*]

Are you talking about the Adams X-Men color guides that sold a couple months ago?

[Sharkey]

$8.30 for some photocopies of Jim Lee OA is kind of odd. But hey, it's ebay -- people will buy almost anything. And you can spend $8 in worse ways I suppose.

 

$649 for a proof of a Byrne page seems a little Krazy. I work in the publishing biz and I happen to like mechanicals and production art, but I wouldn't pay that much for a proof of an interior page. I do own a couple stat covers (the horror!) and a Kirby pencil recreation piece, but stats or proofs of interior pages don't do much for me.

 

In this particular situation I think it's a case of the seller asking high on a fairly unique item featuring well known characters in a classic comic book by the definitive X-men artist of that run.

 

I can't explain why someone would sell -- or buy -- photocopies of Jim Lee Wildcats art. If that's a new collecting focus, I'm going to get my butt over to Kinkos and start copying some of my early image comics.

 

 

 

[Artemaria]

Are you talking about the Adams X-Men color guides that sold a couple months ago?

 

I don't think so. The copies to which I am referring were some kind of copies that apparently were sent to a South American comic company for re-processing into Spanish Language comics. They were black and white copies. And if memory serves me well, they sold for about $40 per page of copy - several hundred dollars for the whole lot.

 

- A

[*paull*]

Right.... saw those too.

 

There were also color guides for sale recently, so I wasn't sure which ones you were referring to.

[Mister Trent]

Currently on eBay, with a BIN of $1,499.99 . . .

 

 

Here's the seller's blurb:

 

"This is an original cover proof for Daredevil #4, published by Marvel Comics in October of 1964, and featuring cover art by Jack Kirby. This is a full-color single sheet printed proof of the cover, including both the front and back covers, and with printing on both sides of the covers, the same way it looks in the published comic. It measures roughly 10 1/2" by 14". Please note that this is NOT a mass-produced print or lithograph. It is a cover proof that is created during the production process for the comic, and used internally by the comic company. The piece is in good condition, particularly considering the incredible age of the piece (more than 40 years old!), but does have some general wear, along with a few small color touch tape pulls (these can be seen in the scan if you look next to the #4 box at the upper right, on the top of the building at the middle-left and on the building next to DD's knee ). The piece has been trimmed on the sides down to standard comic book size, and it is overall in good shape.

 

The cover features probably one of the greatest Dare Devil images Jack "King" Kirby ever did, with DD shown in a fantastic straight-on image as he practically leaps out at you right off the cover! This is a super-early issue, featuring DD still in his original yellow costume (before he later switched to red), and is the 4th-ever appearance of The Man Without Fear. The villain The Purple Man is shown in the background, and made his first appearance in this issue.

 

To say that this piece is rare would be a truly major understatement. Silver Age Marvel production art is extremely scarce, particularly since there was no Marvel equivalent to DC's Jack Adler that made a conscious effort to save production pieces. So there is generally not believed to be nearly as much Marvel SA prod. artwork still in existence, as there is in the Adler collection of DC pieces. And to get a significant piece from the early classic 1960's Stan Lee and Jack Kirby time period is a truly rare find. And a cover this early (the 4th issue!!!) in a major well-known series is practically unheard of. With Kirby's 60's original drawn covers going for upwards of $30,000, this is a much more reasonable way to own a piece of production art from the series. An exceptional and unbelievably rare piece of comic production art, that would look great framed, and be a true key piece in any collection."

 

 

[Sharkey]

I agree with the seller that there's great historical significance in a production proof of a key Marvel Silver Age #1 comic book, but $1500 seems a bit, um, ambitious for a cover proof..... The same guy is selling the cover proof to FF 50 for $3999.00!!

 

Per Artemis' original query, there have been a huge number of Silver Age Marvel cover reproductions sold on ebay that apparently were from a publisher in Brazil who made Brazilian editions of the comics. Some were basically mechanical stat covers with the copy translated.

 

There are also a bunch of acetate cover reproductions that someone seems to have made to project covers on the wall using an overhead projector. Kind of interesting.

 

Link to Thor acetate cover

 

While I find such things fascinating and have a lot of curiosity about the process of creating them and what and how they were used to create alternate editions, it's not something I'd personally collect en masse. However, I could see the appeal to someone who does think those things are interesting and worth collecting, and I could understand the novelty of owning one or two if they were cover images you really loved.

 

This is a new niche? I don't know. Certainly they might appeal to collectors on a budget (well, the acetate covers anyway -- not those DD1 and FF50 cover proofs!!)

 

[Mister Trent]

Currently on eBay, with a BIN of $1,499.99 . . .

 

 

" . . . The piece has been trimmed on the sides down to standard comic book size, and it is overall in good shape."

 

 

And looking at the scan, the 'proof' has stress lines running the length of its centre-fold . . . as though it once enveloped interior comic-book pages.

 

Now, I'm straining to look for staple holes . . .

 

 

[NelsonAI]

From my understanding, the cover proof and acetates were used as a final review by the publishers to make any last minute changes before the production run of the comic book was printed.

 

These appear to be the same size as the comic and not an oversized "poster format".

 

Every person has their own collecting preferences and price points. I personally would buy a high grade slabbed CGC book instead.

 

Cheers!

N

[Artemaria]

And looking at the scan, the 'proof' has stress lines running the length of its centre-fold . . . as though it once enveloped interior comic-book pages.

 

Now, I'm straining to look for staple holes . . .

 

 

Now that's funny -

[Mister Trent]

I agree with the seller that there's great historical significance in a production proof of a key Marvel Silver Age #1 comic book, but $1500 seems a bit, um, ambitious for a cover proof..... The same guy is selling the cover proof to FF 50 for $3999.00!!

 

This is a new niche? I don't know. Certainly they might appeal to collectors on a budget (well, the acetate covers anyway -- not those DD1 and FF50 cover proofs!!)

 

DD # 4 . . .

 

Just doing some proof reading of your post . . .

[Sharkey]

I agree with the seller that there's great historical significance in a production proof of a key Marvel Silver Age #1 comic book, but $1500 seems a bit, um, ambitious for a cover proof..... The same guy is selling the cover proof to FF 50 for $3999.00!!

 

This is a new niche? I don't know. Certainly they might appeal to collectors on a budget (well, the acetate covers anyway -- not those DD1 and FF50 cover proofs!!)

 

DD # 4 . . .

 

Just doing some proof reading of your post . . .

 

Posting too fast and confusing the numbers. It's FF 49 he has too, not 50. That's what I get for posting at work.

 

But he does have a Dr. Strange #1 cover proof for $599 and Ultimate X-Men #1 cover proof for $399...

 

 

[Weird Paper]

A real proof from this era would most likely be a flap proof like a color key, or a laminated proof like a matchprint. It would be the same size as the printed cover. Current proofs might be oversized, but they did not have ink jet proofers (or computers to run them, obviously) in the mid-60s. The other possibility would be that it would be a set-up sheet from the press, but, again, it would be the same size as the cover, just possibly on different stock.

 

Something like this would be very, very easy to fake. Even the cover veloxes that have been floating around lately could be faked without having the original art to shoot them from. Plus a real velox or color key/matchprint would not be archival.

[bronzilla]

I collect Aproval covers and other various items used in the Comic printing process! I really enjoy this aspect of the Hobby, and the scarcity Of these items for me makes it even more Fun! True Authenticity is something you have to be carefull of! A lot of these Items, I Buy from my Buddy here in Phoenix, He bought out the JACK ADLER collection, so I can be confident they are originals and they come with Certs.

Here are a few of my Aproval covers and Hand painted OA

 

 

[bronzilla]

One of my favorite covers of all time. Here is the Aproval cover.

 

[bronzilla]

Heres the Acetate to SINISTER HOUSE OF SECRET LOVE #3 I have #1 and 2 around here somewheres.

 

 

[bronzilla]

I really enjoy these two especially the Laurel and Hardy #2 this Comic was advertised but never printed. There were 2 of these aproval covers in the Adler Collection, and since this was never printed this makes this the most rare Superman cover I know of... Any one want to trade me there Action Comics # 1 for this ??!!!!

 

 

[bronzilla]

Sinister House of Secret Love Acetates #1 and 2One of these days I would love to Frame these With a soft light behind them, not sure if I will since it could potentially destroy them.