So what do you think the future of comics holds in store??/

[Black Lantern]

it's really hard to tell what the future holds for the market. but one thing is for sure, there won't be as much collectors around in 20-30 years as are today. i mean, how many editions were printed from one book in the 70s and how many today? i think that says it all.

 

when i started collecting with the age of 15, i always thought every comic i buy will be worth more than i paid for. ok, i was young and didn't know better but i'm 33 now and i will be happy, if i even get the money i paid for my collection or 75%, when i'm selling some day. it's nice if it would be more, but i don't want my expectations be to high because the market is so unpredictable.

[Monstro]

how much are we talking here? if it's an amount where you need to take out a loan or even put it on CC to pay it off i would say stay away.

[THE_BEYONDER]

Do you think prices will continue to rise sharply? OR do you think prices will go stagnant? OR will prices eventually DROP hard?

 

Yes, Yes......and Yes.

[Bosco685]

For anyone that collected in the mid-80's and saw books like Aircel's Samurai and Elflord commanding ridiculous prices where people were trading in Silver and Bronze Age books to get them, or the early 90's when people were trading in Silver and Bronze to pick up early Valiant or (gulp) Image books, the trend keeps coming up of fads and temporary dedication to the hobby for fun or profit.

 

What makes it worse is when outsiders to the hobby come in for pure investment. Going back to the 80's, there were people that collected on the fringe of what was going on and thought the prices were so sustainable, they were purchasing in bulk. There was one story in Comics Buyer's Guide where a fellow working for an investment bank convinced the governing board to purchase 600 copies of Samurai Penguin 1 because comics were turning out to be a better investment than the market. The same was going on in the 90's with Bloodshot 1, Superman 75, Turok, and many other books that are now cheap sells (if you can sell them).

 

So following those trends, imagine what is going on now when you have CGC standardizing what to expect when you purchase a book, which then also drives up the value of a book in the multiples level over Overstreet. Then outsiders are seeing the money being made with this new trend, and dealing with a horrible stock market they consider taking any future investments from their salary and curtail putting this into their 401K because they have a "sure bet" in collectibles. Especially when they see stories about ComicLink or the New York Convention delivering statements like "What Recession?"

 

Those books are going to make their way back out to the market one day when these folks want their guaranteed investment realized. The more these books come pouring out, those of us who have always been there are going to start to wonder even more what we are paying for if demand drives up prices, but supply shows there is a steady stream of these rare books that disappeared for a time.

 

I'm not sure we are going to see a massive drop-off in new hobby members, as even old independents attract new fans that want early works of folks like Shooter, Layton, McFarlane, or others. I've even been shocked when buyers contact me asking if I can hunt down books from Defiant Comics, Broadway Comics, Image Comics other than Spawn.

 

Hopefully, we are all here to see what the future holds, and then we can restart this thread and shake our heads together.

[Davenport]

I'm considering a very expensive purchase and it got me thinking about the short and long term future of comics. I'd like some speculation on where the hobby is going.

 

What do you think the prices will be like in 10, 20, 30 or even 40 years from now?

 

 

I think there's a phenomenon some "collectors" fail to notice. Take a look around and carefully consider the overall "ability to enjoy" comic books as a whole. As a boomer I think it's an unprecedented time in the entire history of the hobby, and will only get "better" in the future.

 

If you want to enjoy a favorite cover image, it's a click away. Many in hi-rez large formats that show art detail better than your eye can see with a book in-hand. There are websites that show covers in order of publication, details of writers, artists, and characters. There are databases, blogs, messageboards, and galleries dedicated to comic books. I saw an online statistic that proclaimed 80% of everything produced has already been scanned cover-to-cover. Like it or not, they're readily available for reading pleasure. And toss into that online mix all the compilation volumes being produced in trade paperback and hard cover.

 

It wasn't too long ago a fan might not even see a particular comic book, have no idea what one looked like, unless OS put a thumbnail in the price guide, they ordered one mail order, or they went to a convention (hard to imagine, but remember Gerber's photo-journal didn't come out until the early nineties). Today you can enjoy everything, anytime.

 

Things to consider for the future: Faster broadband, larger hard drives, large or portable monitors. In other words, speed of access, storage ability, and the ability to have, read, and enjoy.

 

For a boomer it's just an amazing time to be a fan. For future fans, who knows. Some future-fan decides they're into Spider-man, and within days has every Spider-man comic book at their fingertips. All the artwork, colors, word balloons, old ads, and letter pages. Highly detailed, backlit, and in a format they're most comfortable with.

 

"Ability to enjoy" now and in the future is something to consider. Coupled with continuous "record prices paid" (continuous tightening of the "collecting" niche) and its not too far-fetched to imagine the hobby will grow (how many has access), while paper artifact buying shrinks (who wants or can afford old paper).

 

[batman_fan]

I know when I was trying to finish my Batman run, I tried to buy mid-grade or higher. I have gone back and upgraded several of my mid grade Batman's with higher grade copies. Rather than hold two copies, I have tried to sell off my under copies. I can tell you, I am happy if I can get what I paid, and in any cases we are talking about buying more than 5 years ago and in some cases more than 10 years. I think this is true for all common books in mid grade. No real increase in price in the last 10 years+.

[comixcroz]

how much are we talking here? if it's an amount where you need to take out a loan or even put it on CC to pay it off i would say stay away.

 

I am thinking of buying a FF 1 cgc 5.5. I have been saving for this book for some time now. I have actually been saving for an 8.0 but seeing the prices go up and up - I am now thinking of buying this one instead. When i first started saving for the 8.0 they were going for about 22k. With a 7.5 recently selling for 35k and an 8.5 selling for 69k I am scared that by the time I have my 22k for an "8.0" it might only get me a 6.0/6.5 or less. I don't have to take out a loan or use a cc but it is a significant amount of money for me to make a purchase with. I can afford to lose the money but I sure as heck do not want to.

 

I am not really planning on selling my core FF 1-102 set at all, maybe when I retire. I just don't want to spend this much on a book and have it be worth 2k if I NEED to sell it off 20 or 30 years down the line, or god forbid sooner. On the other hand, I am scared that if I dont buy it now it will go the way of AF 15 and I won't be able to ever afford a decent copy.

 

[comixcroz]

Jason, with all my rambling, I forgot to address your reason for starting this thread. If you're considering an expensive purchase, and asking this question in order to help you rationalize going forward with it, my advice would be not to do it. If you have to sweat over it, trust me when I say that the feeling of finally owning the book isn't worth the stress. There are exceptions, and maybe it's different for you, but that's been my experience.

 

It's easy to get carried away, especially hanging around here where there are a ton of knowledgeable collectors with some amazing collections. From what I can gather, however, most of those people who have "high end" collections can be classified as one of the following "types":

 

1) They were collecting within their means, over a long period of time, and accumulated many of their books, or books they sold to GET their current books, in a gradual and affordable manner. Many of these collectors can justify spending big bucks on individual books because their overall collection (portfolio) has gained enough to compensate for "overpaying" now.

 

2) They're spending well within their means. For some people, spending 5K or even 50K on books is no big deal. This collector is obviously in the minority, but they do exist.

 

3) They're a "dealing collector". They fund their collection by buying and selling books. They may have started selling books they've had for years to get the funds(like in ex.1), or maybe they started in the business recently in order to pay for their collection. Either way it's doable if you're willing to put the time in and are savvy enough to navigate the market.

 

4) They're investing, even if they don't admit it. A large amount of their net worth is tied up into comics, or they may even be in debt for them. Basically, they're buying as much as they can, and sometimes more. These people exist in large numbers, but for obvious reasons don't like to announce themselves.

 

Obviously this doesn't cover every individual, but it's based on what I've observed in the "high end" market over the last several years.

 

Type 1 and 2 are obviously going to be the least affected by a crash. These are the hobby's mainstays; the people most likely to continue collecting for a long period of time, uninterrupted. These are the kind of people who are able to produce scan after scan of jaw-dropping stuff that you won't see on Ebay the next day, or consigned to CL.

 

Since you're my age and the ship has sailed for type 1, my advice is to be type 2. Don't have millions of dollars? Not necessary in order to operate the way this type operates. Just spend what you can afford to lose. If you really want expensive books, save up "petty cash" until it's no longer petty, and be content with quality over quantity.

 

But that's me. I enjoy taking risks, but I'll do so in other arenas where I see more potential for dividends. I don't like buying at the top.

 

That's my

 

Right now - i fall into number 3 for the past 13 months. I moved from Los Angeles where I worked in Technology Sales to come here and run a LCS (half ownership) with a buddy of mine. I started saving for this particular purchase about 4 years ago, so I certainly did not accumulate all of the money from selling under copies.

 

I'm probably a combination of 3 and 4. I do accumulate most of my spending money on selling other books. But most the books I sell are moderns. I certainly admit that I have way too much money "invested" in to comics, but it happens to be something I love. I spend most of my free time buying, selling, or talking about comics and as lame as this sounds, it's my passion.

 

I have had a raw SA (mainly FF) collection for about 15 years but only purchased my first cgc high grade book within the last year. I have sold most of my raw collection locally to buy a few higher grade slabs and add to my savings for this FF1.

 

This is more of an emotional purchase than an investment purchase - but its hard to not think about the financial aspect when spending this kind of cash.

[Count]

All comics will be worthless in a few years. Bail out now and sell them to my at 10% of your cost while I'm still interested in buying.

[joe_collector]

All comics will be worthless in a few years. Bail out now and sell them to my at 10% of your cost while I'm still interested in buying.

 

Congratulations, you have won the award for most illogical and inane post of the month.

[Bronty]

I remember in the mid eighties when 'bronze age "comics were landfill,and I bought up

a bunch in high grade...dealers thought they would never be worth anything..I know things are so different now,but there is always hope...nostalgia is a powerful thing!

 

well let's face it, they mostly still are landfill! you were just smart enough to buy the right grades.

[Bronty]

how much are we talking here? if it's an amount where you need to take out a loan or even put it on CC to pay it off i would say stay away.

 

I am thinking of buying a FF 1 cgc 5.5. I have been saving for this book for some time now. I have actually been saving for an 8.0 but seeing the prices go up and up - I am now thinking of buying this one instead. When i first started saving for the 8.0 they were going for about 22k. With a 7.5 recently selling for 35k and an 8.5 selling for 69k I am scared that by the time I have my 22k for an "8.0" it might only get me a 6.0/6.5 or less. I don't have to take out a loan or use a cc but it is a significant amount of money for me to make a purchase with. I can afford to lose the money but I sure as heck do not want to.

 

I am not really planning on selling my core FF 1-102 set at all, maybe when I retire. I just don't want to spend this much on a book and have it be worth 2k if I NEED to sell it off 20 or 30 years down the line, or god forbid sooner. On the other hand, I am scared that if I dont buy it now it will go the way of AF 15 and I won't be able to ever afford a decent copy.

 

that's a nice book, but boy its a lot of money too. Its kind of amazing to me that a ff1 in FINE is now worth a small new car.

 

Is the condition really that important to you? For that kind of money I'd be happy to just have a 2.0 or a 6.0 slight p and pocket the difference. That's a huge amount of dough you'd save and you'd still get to finish your set. I know, I know, its not a VF but honestly who cares? wouldn't you rather save a massive amount of dough and not have to stress about whether your "investment" goes up? I think andrew is right is saying that if you have to think about it and discuss, you're probably trying to talk yourself into something that you shouldn't do.

[joe_collector]

I remember in the mid eighties when 'bronze age "comics were landfill,and I bought up

a bunch in high grade...dealers thought they would never be worth anything..I know things are so different now,but there is always hope...nostalgia is a powerful thing!

 

well let's face it, they mostly still are landfill! you were just smart enough to buy the right grades.

 

I don't ever remember key Bronze Age books EVER being landfill, and I've been collecting soon after I was born. They weren't as valuable as today, but in the 80's you couldn't walkin into a LCS and find NM copies of even near-dead books like MTU 1, HFH 1, MTIO 1, etc. being sent to the "landfill" let alone sitting in the 25-cents boxes.

 

And people forget that collectible prices are relative. Sure, MTU 1 may have been a $10-$20 book in NM back then, but everything from that era was low-priced - I can remember seeing Hulk 181's for $30 around 1984-87 or so.

 

But these were not commons and were not being sent to any landfill.

[Bronty]

I remember in the mid eighties when 'bronze age "comics were landfill,and I bought up

a bunch in high grade...dealers thought they would never be worth anything..I know things are so different now,but there is always hope...nostalgia is a powerful thing!

 

well let's face it, they mostly still are landfill! you were just smart enough to buy the right grades.

 

I don't ever remember key Bronze Age books EVER being landfill, and I've been collecting soon after I was born. They weren't as valuable as today, but in the 80's you couldn't walkin into a LCS and find NM copies of even near-dead books like MTU 1, HFH 1, MTIO 1, etc. being sent to the "landfill" let alone sitting in the 25-cents boxes.

 

And people forget that collectible prices are relative. Sure, MTU 1 may have been a $10-$20 book in NM back then, but everything from that era was low-priced - I can remember seeing Hulk 181's for $30 around 1984-87 or so.

 

But these were not commons and were not being sent to any landfill.

 

Did I say key? Did I say high grade? I am talking about Average Joe's comic collection. Full of vf's of hero for hire 35, defenders 22, avengers 120 etc. Those kinds of books have never been "hot" but they are deader than dead now and flatlining, and form a good chunk of the average guy's collection.

[joe_collector]

I was agreeing with you and replying to the other guy.

 

Any NM Bronze Age comic that is worth significant money today, was NOT being sent to the landfill in the 80's. It's just a fantasy.

[comixcroz]

how much are we talking here? if it's an amount where you need to take out a loan or even put it on CC to pay it off i would say stay away.

 

I am thinking of buying a FF 1 cgc 5.5. I have been saving for this book for some time now. I have actually been saving for an 8.0 but seeing the prices go up and up - I am now thinking of buying this one instead. When i first started saving for the 8.0 they were going for about 22k. With a 7.5 recently selling for 35k and an 8.5 selling for 69k I am scared that by the time I have my 22k for an "8.0" it might only get me a 6.0/6.5 or less. I don't have to take out a loan or use a cc but it is a significant amount of money for me to make a purchase with. I can afford to lose the money but I sure as heck do not want to.

 

I am not really planning on selling my core FF 1-102 set at all, maybe when I retire. I just don't want to spend this much on a book and have it be worth 2k if I NEED to sell it off 20 or 30 years down the line, or god forbid sooner. On the other hand, I am scared that if I dont buy it now it will go the way of AF 15 and I won't be able to ever afford a decent copy.

 

that's a nice book, but boy its a lot of money too. Its kind of amazing to me that a ff1 in FINE is now worth a small new car.

 

Is the condition really that important to you? For that kind of money I'd be happy to just have a 2.0 or a 6.0 slight p and pocket the difference. That's a huge amount of dough you'd save and you'd still get to finish your set. I know, I know, its not a VF but honestly who cares? wouldn't you rather save a massive amount of dough and not have to stress about whether your "investment" goes up? I think andrew is right is saying that if you have to think about it and discuss, you're probably trying to talk yourself into something that you shouldn't do.

I don't think I could settle for a 2.0. Unless it had some very nice eye appeal. I could settle for a fair priced 4.0 or 4.5 though. I can't seem to find any though that are priced anywhere near GPA. there is a nice 4.0 FS but the asking price is higher than what most 4.5s sell for. I'm not willing to overpay on a book just to "save" money. The 4.5 on comiclink is ok - but the pieces of tape on the fc will bug the out of me. if you guys know of any other FF1s for sale - please let me know. I am willing to consider a restored copy as long as peices haven't been added and there was no trimming. I would glady buy a ct copy if the price is current to the market.

[Bronty]

its funny that you say that I was actually going to post again suggesting a 4.0 as well. at these levels unless you have a ton of dough I just don't see paying to get up the grade scale as being any kind of worthwhile proposition.

 

I'm not aware of any other ff1's fs atm, but they will be out there if you keep looking. Have you tried negotiating with the 4.0 seller?

[Bronty]

I was agreeing with you and replying to the other guy.

 

Any NM Bronze Age comic that is worth significant money today, was NOT being sent to the landfill in the 80's. It's just a fantasy.

 

Fair enough. Really back then, at least around here, they were tough to find period because they weren't priced highly enough for anybody to want to sell their 'keeper copies'. I looked for nm bronze age neal adams books all throughout the 80s/90s locally and never did have much luck 8.0-9.0s were the best that ever seemed to be available, at least around here.

[500Club]

The thing that always concerns me when considering the future is the lack of cultivation of new and younger fans.

 

Newsstands don't carry comics anymore.

 

Kids are more interested in digital entertainment.

 

Despite the fact comic characters are getting more pop culture exposure than at any point in history, it does not seem to be translating into COMIC BOOK interest.

 

I think the best hope for the future is the legitimization of comics as a true investment vehicle, and people outside of the hobby adding them as part of an investment portfolio.

[comixcroz]

its funny that you say that I was actually going to post again suggesting a 4.0 as well. at these levels unless you have a ton of dough I just don't see paying to get up the grade scale as being any kind of worthwhile proposition.

 

I'm not aware of any other ff1's fs atm, but they will be out there if you keep looking. Have you tried negotiating with the 4.0 seller?

one of my friends was also considering it and he's not budging on it. I sent him an email just asking if it was for sale and he responded with "yes, but the price has not changed" - that was the only communication I've had with him.

do you guys think the prices of FF1 will be going up soon or what?