Looking for opinions

[DrWatson]

BDJ usually only has one connotation, or I am off base

We were at TGIFriday's in Detroit. Bob dubbed me Big Doc Johnson. It has morphed into various colorful phrase since then, but the first is the cleanest. He actually made me blush.

[Subliminal]

Forgive me for bailing, but I have too many other things to do. Feel free to PM.

Joe

 

we forgive you; we only wish you'da bailed 35 pages ago.

 

You know, the more I think about it. I wish he had bailed even prior to that.

 

It sucks his book was damaged, and I feel for him or any collector that has a book damaged.

 

But the more I re-read some of this thread, the less empathy I have for him. As Matt pointed out he scored very well on the 28 or 29 books he submitted. One was damaged. He was offered a very fair, by any account, compensation for the damage. He declined and asked for additional compenstation that wasn't due, by any standard I am aware of. Unless you consider punitive damages, but since there is no evidence to support intentional damage by Matt, and it would be ridiculous to assume there was, his stance was unreasonable.

 

Then it appears when he wasn't satisfied with the offer of compenstation he attempted to "extort" or "coerce" Matt into agreeing to the additional compensation by threatening to take the matter public onto the CGC boards.

 

He claims he just wanted opinions of whether or not he was entitled to 9.0 compenstation for the damage, but deflected 20 pages of assertions that he wasn't entitled to any more than was being offered.

 

Seems to me it is more likely that "here to lern" was seeking validation that he was right to take this ill-advised tactic with Matt.

 

Hopefully he has "lerned" the error of his ways.

 

Did I miss anything? Or does this about cover it?

 

 

Thanks Bill you just saved me hours of reading to probably type out the same thing.

 

No need for me to pile on Joe with my opinions because it sounds like he and Matt have settled the issue, which is good to hear.

 

 

 

Personally I'm glad he aired his grievance because now I know to steer clear of his over priced pressed books if he tries to sell them here.

Thank you Joe (thumbs u

[G.A.tor]

BDJ usually only has one connotation, or I am off base

We were at TGIFriday's in Detroit. Bob dubbed me Big Doc Johnson. It has morphed into various colorful phrase since then, but the first is the cleanest. He actually made me blush.

(thumbs u

[fantastic_four]

How is it fun for them?

 

Are there comic book mafia enforcers out there I'm unaware of forcing people to buy books? If you're paying $7K for a book, you've got to REALLY want that book in that grade. And you've gotten it. If it doesn't make you happy...then stop buying high grade. How many decades yet to come of endless railing about pressing will it take for this to finally sink in with people...if you have a moral or ethical problem with pressing high-grade books into higher-grade books--if it sickens you to think that you've just paid top dollar for a book that's been pressed to a higher grade--it's simply time to stop buying high grade, as it's not going to be fun for you for a long, long time, and possibly forever.

 

I continue to buy high grade books. Are some of them pressed? Beyond a doubt. Does it trouble me, does it make landing an issue I want in a sweet grade taste more bitter? No, and if it did, I wouldn't still be buying.

[TheShadowKnows]

the thread originator answered every query, page after page, EXCEPT the two times he was asked about the results of the other pressed books. i had a suspicion then, and now it is confirmed. assuming those anonymous books above are good books, looks like he made out real fine.

Are you suggesting the end justifies the means? That isn't the point.

 

What is the point, then? From where I am sitting, the OP engaged a contractor for 29 services. 28 of the 29 were at or above the specifications for acceptable-excellent service. One was not. Despite the fact the OP agreed that the limitation of his damages was a credit for the fees or a refund, the contractor has agreed to provide additional recompense.

 

Apparently, the OP has decided that he wants more than the offered additional recompense. The OP wants to be recompensed for the value of the book in the condition that it was supposedly in after the services had been provided. Without making any value judgement as to whether the OP is acting in a dirtbaggy fashion by requesting such additional recompense, there does not appear to be any theory in reality or reasonable fiction that would support such additional recompense.

Can you type that without the 25 cent words?

 

He had a book damaged. Reimbursement of some fashion has been agreed upon. What is in dispute is the amount. He tendered an 8.0 book. He should be reimbursed for an 8.0 book as opposed to the value between a 7.5 and an 8.0.

I agree.That 8.0 looked way better than that 7.5 which I wouldnt want to own.

[Ogami]

in before Rick closes the thread.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

for the fifth time.

[Lebowski]

['cause evidently, this is where the cool kids are posting]

[namisgr]

Unless the presser provides a guarantee upfront as to the quality of their work, they are under no obligation to reimburse the cost of an 8.0 copy of ASM17. Ethically, yes, but in practice no. They should, however, refund the cost of the pressing and re-encapsulation.

 

I'd like to know who pressed this book, because it certainly appears their work is unreliable.

Unreliable due to one instance? C'mon Bob.

No one is infallible. Well, except me

 

"Reliable" means to achieve the same result on successive trials. I've learned from this thread that for even one of the best professional restorers in the biz, pressing comes with risk and infrequently can cause damage. I'd not heard that admission before, and think it's a good thing to know for anybody considering having the work done on some books. (thumbs u

[arexcrooke]

You really didnt think that damage never occured? With the amount of books that people work on?

C'mon, stop trying to crawfish out of your earlier foot-n-mouth comment

[namisgr]

You really didnt think that damage never occured? With the amount of books that people work on?

C'mon, stop trying to crawfish out of your earlier foot-n-mouth comment

 

Of course I suspected that books occasionally get damaged during pressing and restoration, but you're still missing the point, Arex. The point is that this is the first public discussion that I'm aware of that's got an example of a book that was almost certainly damaged in pressing, along with the first public statement from a major comic restorer that pressing comes with inherent risk and books infrequently can be damaged.

 

Does everybody know already that pressing can be unreliable? Apparently not, as evidenced by the individual that started the thread. Is it important to know? I think so, and that's why I especially appreciate Matt's contribution to the thread and his owning up to the rare botched pressing job.

 

You don't really want all the little inconveniences of the hobby to be just swept under the rug, do you Arex?

[arexcrooke]

I dont see where the damage was done during pressing.

 

Bob, dont try and paint me in a corner with your last comment Thats what Zaid is for.

I think one would have to be naive in the most to think that mistakes and damage does not occur when a professional is working on a book.

 

Like I said, I think one would be pretty naive to think that way.

 

 

[G.A.tor]

before I officially close this thread, did I just correctly read that Matt Nelson presses comic books

[Bosco685]

I dont see where the damage was done during pressing.

I agree with you that none of us are clear this occurred during pressing. There are plenty of assumptions, but there is still the chance it was tape pull.

I think one would have to be naive in the most to think that mistakes and damage does not occur when a professional is working on a book.

I agree with your point, and IF the damage occurred during pressing and before it went off to CGC, the right way to handle the situation is to contact the owner and inform him what happened before submitting the book.

 

But again, I'm not convinced that damage happened at Classics Inc.

[Davenport]

How is it fun for them?

 

Are there comic book mafia enforcers out there I'm unaware of forcing people to buy books? If you're paying $7K for a book, you've got to REALLY want that book in that grade. And you've gotten it. If it doesn't make you happy...then stop buying high grade. How many decades yet to come of endless railing about pressing will it take for this to finally sink in with people...if you have a moral or ethical problem with pressing high-grade books into higher-grade books--if it sickens you to think that you've just paid top dollar for a book that's been pressed to a higher grade--it's simply time to stop buying high grade, as it's not going to be fun for you for a long, long time, and possibly forever.

 

I continue to buy high grade books. Are some of them pressed? Beyond a doubt. Does it trouble me, does it make landing an issue I want in a sweet grade taste more bitter? No, and if it did, I wouldn't still be buying.

Thanks for answering. I appreciate it and agree 100%. After a life-long collecting habit it's been a couple of years since I bought a back-issue. And I'm fine with that. I'm more of a "fan" now than I ever was, just not in the "collecting" sense.

 

Just keep in mind that the encapsulation thing evolved very slowly, and new folks may wander in or return after being gone (like the OP did). But overall there's enough info on the net now.

[joeypost]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

[NewWorldOrder]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

Pretty much sums it up!

[DrWatson]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

Pretty much sums it up!

No, it doesn't. I don't think he was being greedy. He was asking what he thought was a legitimate question. Should he be reimbursed up to 9.0 or an 8.0? I think his biggest mistake is not trying to pinpoint where the damage took place.

 

I would have been satisfied with being reimbursed for an 8.0, but I certainly would have PMed my friends and asked their opinion. The OP's biggest mistake was opening it up for the whole boards to give their two cents.

[VintageComics]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

Pretty much sums it up!

No, it doesn't. I don't think he was being greedy. He was asking what he thought was a legitimate question. Should he be reimbursed up to 9.0 or an 8.0? I think his biggest mistake is not trying to pinpoint where the damage took place.

 

I would have been satisfied with being reimbursed for an 8.0, but I certainly would have PMed my friends and asked their opinion. The OP's biggest mistake was opening it up for the whole boards to give their two cents.

 

[NewWorldOrder]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

Pretty much sums it up!

No, it doesn't. I don't think he was being greedy. He was asking what he thought was a legitimate question. Should he be reimbursed up to 9.0 or an 8.0? I think his biggest mistake is not trying to pinpoint where the damage took place.

 

I would have been satisfied with being reimbursed for an 8.0, but I certainly would have PMed my friends and asked their opinion. The OP's biggest mistake was opening it up for the whole boards to give their two cents.

 

 

Sounds Greedy to me Doc, sorry.

 

The book isn't rare and he had good results on the other 28 books.

 

The fact he is trying to Squeeze a 9.0 value out of this is .

 

Even if the book wasn't damaged there was no guarantee it would have came back a 9.0 anyway.

 

Matt did his best to accomidate him, and there was no reason to make this a public issue.

 

 

 

[whisp]

So was the conclusion nothing more than a case of greed and not understanding that this is not an exact science? Even in an exact science environment things go wrong.

 

Personally I think Matt handled this as well as he could have, and only pushed back when he absolutely needed to.

 

 

Pretty much sums it up!

No, it doesn't. I don't think he was being greedy. He was asking what he thought was a legitimate question. Should he be reimbursed up to 9.0 or an 8.0? I think his biggest mistake is not trying to pinpoint where the damage took place.

 

I would have been satisfied with being reimbursed for an 8.0, but I certainly would have PMed my friends and asked their opinion. The OP's biggest mistake was opening it up for the whole boards to give their two cents.

 

 

Sounds Greedy to me Doc, sorry.

 

The book isn't rare and he had good results on the other 28 books.

 

The fact he is trying to Squeeze a 9.0 value out of this is .

 

Even if the book wasn't damaged there was no guarantee it would have came back a 9.0 anyway.

 

Matt did his best to accomidate him, and there was no reason to make this a public issue.

 

 

 

BINGO