PROBATION DISCUSSIONS 21 21

[CAHokie]

Now that both parties are on here together, is there any way the two of you can work things out. It seems obvious that neither side had any bad intentions with the deal, just different perceptions. Spider-Dan, is there any thing that could be done by the buyer that would satisfy you to release him from the deal and the probation list? Bomber, is your feelings at this time to not go forward with the deal because of the stain that is very important to you?

 

I am just hoping for a way to make peace with you two. We could give our opinions all day but that will not help with a solution.

 

 

Edit....sorry, I guess as I was posting this, others posted similar statements and both parties stated their current position at the same time.

[HarveySwick]

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

But did this discussion take place before or after Bob decided he was going to back out?

[MetalPSI]

Is there negotiation for price w/stain?

 

I am confused. There is an offer of 16k cash, or a trade of books. The buyer decided he didn't want to trade books, just cash.

 

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

[jsilverjanet]

Bob, can you please post the slab scan pictures you are referencing? Or if you don't have them, can Dan please post them?

 

I think a copy of the notes if you have them as well.

 

 

The notes are in the sales thread Hector, but the scans are not. I just double checked.

 

thanks Sharon, I don't hang out there. Where is that again?

[comix4fun]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

[DR.X]

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Lots of us would be picky on a book like this with a stain and a 16K price tag. The notes are saying this stain runs the length of the book. This is what kind of baffles me. I've had books just hammered for a tiny dot sized stain.

[skypinkblu]

I'm having trouble with the fact that the "scans" are kind of darkish photos not scans and that they were not added to the sales thread. I don't get that?

 

Dan, I asked you if you would have taken a return if he had paid cash, and your response was kind of circumventing the issue.

 

I know you know why I asked that question.

 

My solution would be for Bob to send you a pretend check. You send Bob a pretend package.

 

Bob can then send you a pretend PM saying ..."sorry buddy, looks like that lighting was a stain after all, and I'm just too particular to accept that in an 8.0" and you can say

 

 

"OK, Bob, sorry it didn't work out, I love the book myself, but I'm a great guy, no problem"...then send him a pretend refund.

Seriously...there are just too many gray areas here, I think you are both nice people, just shake hands and walk away.

 

[Bio-Rupp]

Is there negotiation for price w/stain?

 

I am confused. There is an offer of 16k cash, or a trade of books. The buyer decided he didn't want to trade books, just cash.

 

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Initial offer ( I believe ) was cash and trade. The trade was beneficial to Dan, thus making him more apt to take the deal.

[skypinkblu]

Bob, can you please post the slab scan pictures you are referencing? Or if you don't have them, can Dan please post them?

 

I think a copy of the notes if you have them as well.

 

 

The notes are in the sales thread Hector, but the scans are not. I just double checked.

 

thanks Sharon, I don't hang out there. Where is that again?

 

In Dan's sales thread.

[rodan57]

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Lots of us would be picky on a book like this with a stain and a 16K price tag. The notes are saying this stain runs the length of the book. This is what kind of baffles me. I've had books just hammered for a tiny dot sized stain.

 

As long as the notes say the stain goes throughout the book, it will affect any future sales of the book in this slab.

[Spider-Dan]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

It was before the stain was even an issue. If we negotiate a cash/trade deal. We both agree on the deal (and have PM's to prove it) then after that PM buyer tries to re-negotiate the deal, is that not a form of backing out. The deal wasn't cash only. Buyer approached me with the cash/trade deal. It was better than a cash only deal for me. Why would I want to change that??

[Jimmy Linguini]

I went back a couple pages and just read Dan's side.

 

That being said - when you buy a cgc book arn't you just buying it for the label and stated grade / page quality?

 

Yes. Yes you are. I side with Dan.

[Bio-Rupp]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

It was before the stain was even an issue. If we negotiate a cash/trade deal. We both agree on the deal (and have PM's to prove it) then after that PM buyer tries to re-negotiate the deal, is that not a form of backing out. The deal wasn't cash only. Buyer approached me with the cash/trade deal. It was better than a cash only deal for me. Why would I want to change that??

 

That's how I read it. The buyer initially had "trade remorse" correct?

[MetalPSI]

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Lots of us would be picky on a book like this with a stain and a 16K price tag. The notes are saying this stain runs the length of the book. This is what kind of baffles me. I've had books just hammered for a tiny dot sized stain.

 

I totally agree. If I could even afford a 16k book right now, I would be more than picky about it's condition and I would make more than sure it's exactly what I would want. I am just curious if the seller hasn't made another offer. The seller clearly didn't realize the stain was there, and from what pics I have seen, it was a really hard defect to spot.

 

IF it was me (and I hate doing what if's) I would express my disappointment as a buyer and decline altogether and look for a more desirable copy.

 

IF I was the seller, I would totally discount my price based on what CGC has issued. Or unslab it completely and have it as a raw sale.

 

I don't buy/sell comics. I am just a collector and not in the "business". But I could see how this is a surprise to EVERYBODY and it seems to me the classy thing to do would be discount the price or hold on to the book and resell it.

 

I really cannot see how any one person is backing out of this deal in a bad way.

[Bomber-Bob]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

That is correct. The above quote was before the grader's notes, when I was simply asking to change the deal back to cash only.

[GIJOEISAWESOME-migration]

I went back a couple pages and just read Dan's side.

 

That being said - when you buy a cgc book arn't you just buying it for the label and stated grade / page quality?

 

Yes. Yes you are. I side with Dan.

 

You can say "but the book not the label" But for that, go buy a raw.

[Spider-Dan]

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Lots of us would be picky on a book like this with a stain and a 16K price tag. The notes are saying this stain runs the length of the book. This is what kind of baffles me. I've had books just hammered for a tiny dot sized stain.

 

I totally agree. If I could even afford a 16k book right now, I would be more than picky about it's condition and I would make more than sure it's exactly what I would want. I am just curious if the seller hasn't made another offer. The seller clearly didn't realize the stain was there, and from what pics I have seen, it was a really hard defect to spot.

 

IF it was me (and I hate doing what if's) I would express my disappointment as a buyer and decline altogether and look for a more desirable copy.

 

IF I was the seller, I would totally discount my price based on what CGC has issued. Or unslab it completely and have it as a raw sale.

 

I don't buy/sell comics. I am just a collector and not in the "business". But I could see how this is a surprise to EVERYBODY and it seems to me the classy thing to do would be discount the price or hold on to the book and resell it.

 

I really cannot see how any one person is backing out of this deal in a bad way.

 

Why would I discount a book because it has a stain. CGC graded it an 8.0 WITH the stain. They didn't miss it.

 

And for the record, I don't consider myself a dealer. Just a guy who likes to buy and sell (thumbs u

Edited January 29, 2014 by Spider-Dan

[Bio-Rupp]

So the stain shows up, the seller is not budging on 16k or the buyer doesn't want a book with a stain on it?

 

Lots of us would be picky on a book like this with a stain and a 16K price tag. The notes are saying this stain runs the length of the book. This is what kind of baffles me. I've had books just hammered for a tiny dot sized stain.

 

I totally agree. If I could even afford a 16k book right now, I would be more than picky about it's condition and I would make more than sure it's exactly what I would want. I am just curious if the seller hasn't made another offer. The seller clearly didn't realize the stain was there, and from what pics I have seen, it was a really hard defect to spot.

 

IF it was me (and I hate doing what if's) I would express my disappointment as a buyer and decline altogether and look for a more desirable copy.

 

IF I was the seller, I would totally discount my price based on what CGC has issued. Or unslab it completely and have it as a raw sale.

 

I don't buy/sell comics. I am just a collector and not in the "business". But I could see how this is a surprise to EVERYBODY and it seems to me the classy thing to do would be discount the price or hold on to the book and resell it.

 

I really cannot see how any one person is backing out of this deal in a bad way.

 

Going to be hard to discount the price based on current GPA. Last copy sold at $15000 and had off white pages. Dan's has off white to white pages.

 

Dan's is clearly a better copy based on page quality at the same 8.0 grade....thus justifying the 16G price tag

[HarveySwick]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

That is correct. The above quote was before the grader's notes, when I was simply asking to change the deal back to cash only.

 

So it was discussed --> if you take Choice #3, I will have to nominate you for the PL? It wasn't a simple offer to back out of the deal?

[comix4fun]

I would think if the seller offered the prospective buyer the chance to back out of the deal completely with no mention of "punishment" then this is a non-issue IMHO.

 

 

 

-slym

 

This is what I was just wondering about as well. Did Bob KNOW you meant you were going to nominate him if he backed out or was that discussed AFTER he chose that option?

 

I believe so. It was his idea

 

Dan, I am disappointed too. I'm having trouble understanding why you were not agreeable to an all cash deal, especially since I was going to pay full asking. I'm a collector, I am having a difficult time letting go of my book, does that make me a sleazeball ? Your call whether you want to call me out on the Boards.

 

 

I thought that quote from Bob was before he found out about the stain and had nothing to do with the stain that wasn't known until after grading?

 

 

It was before the stain was even an issue. If we negotiate a cash/trade deal. We both agree on the deal (and have PM's to prove it) then after that PM buyer tries to re-negotiate the deal, is that not a form of backing out. The deal wasn't cash only. Buyer approached me with the cash/trade deal. It was better than a cash only deal for me. Why would I want to change that??

 

That's how I read it. The buyer initially had "trade remorse" correct?

 

 

Except it's the least injurious trade remorse I've ever seen...to the effect of offering 100% of the originally requested cash price.

 

The offers of full cash and alternate trade tells me that Bob still really wanted the book.

 

No one offers $16k cash for something they don't want to buy.