The monthly why you should use CGC instead of PGX thread with PICs

[ChasingKingKirby]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

Fair point. But tit for tat, I don't recall PGX offering to regrade those books that they have missed trimming on, though I could be wrong on that.

[ChasingKingKirby]

Here's the link that refers to that:

 

http://www.justafanboy.com/PGX/

 

[JazzMan]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

[ChasingKingKirby]

Went I was cracking this one out, I KNEW this was going to be trouble. It's got a 1 inch tear on the back, real nice book, but CGC does tend to frown on those sorts of things. PQ up two ticks.

 

 

 

Well is it the First or Second appearance of ODIN?

 

Good point. I dunno. This is even different than the usual 86 labels, usually they just say "Second appearance of Odin". This one also references the tomorrow man.

[Mr 9.8]

I have some Miracleman #1's PGX'd that I'm thinking about sending to CGC. Would you recomend sending them in the PGX case or take them out?

[mschmidt]

I have some Miracleman #1's PGX'd that I'm thinking about sending to CGC. Would you recomend sending them in the PGX case or take them out?

 

It doesn't really matter, CGC will crack it out of its PGX case if you ask them to. In my personal experience, though, more often than not a modern PGX 9.8 will end up a 9.6 if reslabbed by CGC, so if I were you, I wouldn't risk it for a book that can found very, very easily in high grade raw.

[CheezyWhiz]

Does this sound about like the other experiences people have had? To me, it looks like PGX is taking the shot gun approach. Grade all over the map and occasionally, you'll get it right.

 

I often feel this way about CGCs page quality designations. They seem terribly inconsistent. :shrug:

[rjpb]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

I'm not suggesting that only PGX misses trimming (or other forms of resto for that matter), but over the years there's been ample evidence that PGX is perhaps more likely to miss it than catch it - whereas CGC has built a reputation for being better than most at spotting it. Expert microtrimming is probably the hardest manipulation to catch outside of pressing, and while the whole Ewert fiasco was embarrasing to CGC, I don't think anyone would have had an easy time spotting it.

 

If you're relying on third party certification for resto inspection, would you rather a company that might on occasion miss hard to spot resto, or one that with a strong possibility of missing (or as has been rumored - conveniently ignoring) hard to spot resto every time?

[Trey Cannon]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion .If you took one book and let 100 people grade it I'd bet that you would have at least 50 different grade s on that 1 book . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

[ChasingKingKirby]

I have some Miracleman #1's PGX'd that I'm thinking about sending to CGC. Would you recomend sending them in the PGX case or take them out?

 

To be honest, I felt a little paranoid, so I cracked them out, cut off the PGX label and shipped them in the inner well. I KNOW CGC is impartial, but I couldn't help but feel, that CGC might slam the grade if I left the labels on. I know probably paranoia, but...

[rjpb]

Does this sound about like the other experiences people have had? To me, it looks like PGX is taking the shot gun approach. Grade all over the map and occasionally, you'll get it right.

 

I often feel this way about CGCs page quality designations. They seem terribly inconsistent. :shrug:

 

While the general opinion is that PGX is at times tougher on high grade books and softer on lower grade than CGC - I'm not sure that this is evidence of inconsistency in grading. "Getting it right" is as subjective as grading itself - the boards are full of discussions about books that many feel CGC didn't "get right". And the results of many in resubbing books without added manipulation has shown that CGC can be as inconsistent as the next guy. Unless you have an incredible memory or check records beforehand - I doubt anyone on the boards would grade every book in their collection the same way twice.

[ChasingKingKirby]

Does this sound about like the other experiences people have had? To me, it looks like PGX is taking the shot gun approach. Grade all over the map and occasionally, you'll get it right.

 

I often feel this way about CGCs page quality designations. They seem terribly inconsistent. :shrug:

 

While the general opinion is that PGX is at times tougher on high grade books and softer on lower grade than CGC - I'm not sure that this is evidence of inconsistency in grading. "Getting it right" is as subjective as grading itself - the boards are full of discussions about books that many feel CGC didn't "get right". And the results of many in resubbing books without added manipulation has shown that CGC can be as inconsistent as the next guy. Unless you have an incredible memory or check records beforehand - I doubt anyone on the boards would grade every book in their collection the same way twice.

 

Fair point. I think that it suggests some evidence of inconsistency. I guess if I REALLY wanted to prove something, I'd submit them back through PGX and CGC again. But I'm not that dedicated.

[mschmidt]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

 

Another difference would be that one's a real business and the other one's not.

[DiceX]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

Big freakin difference. When CGC screws up, they pay for the mistake. PGX tries to play the blame game, and squirm their way out of any restitution.

 

The only time I was ever on PGX's side was when that guy with the "First Print" TMNT #1 was trying to rip them off. I don't know what ever came of that, but IIRC, they ended up giving the guy some money. The one time I know of that they ever actually gave anyone money for a mistake was the one time they likely did nothing wrong. Well...other than grade the guy's second/third print and label it a first print. That was the biggest set up ever. That guy deserved a Tony award for that performance.

 

 

[ChasingKingKirby]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

Big freakin difference. When CGC screws up, they pay for the mistake. PGX tries to play the blame game, and squirm their way out of any restitution.

 

The only time I was ever on PGX's side was when that guy with the "First Print" TMNT #1 was trying to rip them off. I don't know what ever came of that, but IIRC, they ended up giving the guy some money. The one time I know of that they ever actually gave anyone money for a mistake was the one time they likely did nothing wrong. Well...other than grade the guy's second/third print and label it a first print. That was the biggest set up ever. That guy deserved a Tony award for that performance.

 

 

That was some funny stuff.

[ChasingKingKirby]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

 

Another difference would be that one's a real business and the other one's not.

 

Wow.

[Trey Cannon]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

Holy I did not know that . Thays a big no no if your in the Professional Grading business. However, I have met dealers who will by Raw books and bump up the grade anywhere from 1/2 point to a point higher than the grade they bought it at another in my oppinion

[DR.X]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

Big freakin difference. When CGC screws up, they pay for the mistake. PGX tries to play the blame game, and squirm their way out of any restitution.

 

The only time I was ever on PGX's side was when that guy with the "First Print" TMNT #1 was trying to rip them off. I don't know what ever came of that, but IIRC, they ended up giving the guy some money. The one time I know of that they ever actually gave anyone money for a mistake was the one time they likely did nothing wrong. Well...other than grade the guy's second/third print and label it a first print. That was the biggest set up ever. That guy deserved a Tony award for that performance.

 

 

That was some funny stuff.

 

Is that the book where he just happened to have his wife video-taping the whole thing? Then acted totally shocked, claiming it was a different book? What a bunch of B.S. that was.

 

DRX

[DiceX]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

 

PGX missed trmming on this Swamp Thing.

 

But how is that any different than CGC missing all that trimming that was going on a few years ago?

 

I am not defending PGX by any means. But to say suggest that ONLY PGX missed restoration in the past, particularly trimming, is not very accurate.

 

 

Big freakin difference. When CGC screws up, they pay for the mistake. PGX tries to play the blame game, and squirm their way out of any restitution.

 

The only time I was ever on PGX's side was when that guy with the "First Print" TMNT #1 was trying to rip them off. I don't know what ever came of that, but IIRC, they ended up giving the guy some money. The one time I know of that they ever actually gave anyone money for a mistake was the one time they likely did nothing wrong. Well...other than grade the guy's second/third print and label it a first print. That was the biggest set up ever. That guy deserved a Tony award for that performance.

 

 

That was some funny stuff.

 

Is that the book where he just happened to have his wife video-taping the whole thing? Then acted totally shocked, claiming it was a different book? What a bunch of B.S. that was.

 

DRX

 

Yeah. If you went looking for that guy in the toolbox, you'd grab the screwdriver.

 

 

[rjpb]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

 

Another difference would be that one's a real business and the other one's not.

 

That's almost as unethical as an auction house allowing it's employees to bid on lots.