The monthly why you should use CGC instead of PGX thread with PICs

[TheShadowKnows]

As shown with your Swamp Thing, the biggest problem with PGX grading is their inability to spot restoration.

 

What I'm most surprised at are the large GPA price jumps for .5 differences under 8.0. I can see how the label chasing mentality drives multiples in the 9.X grades, but given the almost random differences in even a broadly accepted 6.5 vs.7.0 or 7.0 vs. 7.5 and that none of those qualify as tough grades for a SA book, I would have expected the value jumps to be more modest.

 

I think a link that I saw posted earlier seemed to suggest that this wasn't exactly an accident... PGX spotting restoration, that is...

Exactly.Do you really think that war book with the big rip was missed?If it walks and quacks like a duck its a duck.

[buttock]

Just to comment on the conclusions being drawn from this thread...

 

The "facts" - and remember this is all statistics of small numbers - ONLY suggest that CGC and PGX don't agree on grade. CGC doesn't agree on its own grades. I just got an email from a friend who re-subbed 8 books, all previously CGC graded. 6 of them went up in grade. As much as two points.

 

 

I was wondering this. It seems I had seen some instances where CGC slabbed books were resubbed and came back with different grades. I could see lower grades or a tad bit higher but when you are talking about a 2 point increase

 

I would have guessed subjectivity wouldn't have such a large range in grades.

 

I should clarify that by "two points" I mean two notches on the CGC scale - i.e. 9.0 to 9.4, 8.5 to 9.2, etc.

 

I'm not surprised, as many if not most books have a 2-3 grade range that reasonable people following the same standards could agree on, yet those same people will often pay widely differing prices for the same book depending on what the current encapsulated grade is.

 

Yup. Silly to pay the multiples.

 

I think the more significant observation is not that the grades vary, but the manner in which they do. It's pretty unlikely -- given 8 books, with the options to go up, down, or stay the same in grade -- that 6 will go up and two will stay the same. You couple this with the way CGC is handing out 9.8s left and right lately, and you have to think that something has changed. This is in contrast to a year or two when the grades seemed exceptionally harsh.

 

 

I dunno, I got some extremely harsh grades out of this last submission as well. For instance, tell me why this is a 6.0? I still don't get it. No visible flaws that I see...

 

 

I'd call for the notes on that one.

[slym2none]

Is that a stain on the cover, near the "20¢" on the spine???

 

 

 

-slym

[mschmidt]

Great info on this thread, by the original poster. It illustates to me what some have already mentioned. Grading is subjective and can and WILL change on the same book, when graded by different professionals on different days.

 

I do want to say that money wise, overall, it seems that buying select PGX graded books paid off in the long run.

 

I also want to say that the premise the original poster has throughout this thread is that CGC got it right and PGX did not. Why do "we" assume that? Couldn't it be that PGX got it more right and CGC got it less right? CGC has in the past designated books as being trimmed that the submitters swear they purchased off the stand as OO, and no trimming was possible in their opinions.

 

Going with the premise that CGC is the final authority in most cases (there are of course exceptions and mistakes by any and all companies), and that CGC gets it right when they disagree with PGX, is a mistaken placement of confidence.

 

But, all of my PGX books will be eventually CGC slabbed. But not because of confidence in CGC or lack thereof in PGX. Strictly because of future sales by my heirs. Heritage does not accept PGX books (as I understand it, they are associated in business with CGC).

 

Oh. One final point. If you think that CGC personal do not submit their own books to CGC to be graded, you are sadly mistaken.

 

Unless you have some actual evidence to back up this claim, I'd suggest you be very careful about making a statement like this - you're trying to cast doubt on CGC's reputation as an impartial grading service, and if I were them, I wouldn't hesitate to throw a libel lawsuit your way.

 

Not that I believe you, but still ...

 

CGC is welcome to throw a lawsuit my way. I don't state things that I can not prove. Momma didn't raise no fools.

 

Seriously though, I do not believe it is against their companies policies and conditions they have previously stated concerning this situation. I do not believe that it is in fact a conflict of interest. It would be silly to have the only credible grading company and not allow the fan boys that work there, the ability to avail themselves of the services. After all, surely most if not all of the employees of CGC are or were collectors of comic books (except maybe a few shippers or what-have-you).

 

I do not begrudge CGC employees the ability to submit their own books for grading. As long as the grading is not done TO THEIR OWN BOOKS BY THEIR OWN SELVES. Other employees can grade their books. Is it a little spooky that the possibility exists of favoritism. Sure. But what business doesn't have favoritism towards fellow workers or family? It is part of life. If I am a cop and I pull over my best friends dad for speeding, he ain't gonna get a ticket. He will get a warning to slow down, but no ticket. Like it or not, that is the way of the world.

 

[blah removed]

 

To CGC. I do not believe it is necessary and would not ask that true comic book collectors that are employees of your company, would have to shun and avoid the services of your company, in the pursuit of their hobby. What other options would they have? Quit collecting and having books graded? Go to your competitors? That wouldn't make any sense at all. No. Just don't let someone grade their own book/s. That is all I ask. Realistically, one could not ask for more of lovers of this hobby.

 

You're kidding, right? This is no different than lottery companies or auction houses - both of which prohibits their employees from participating in their lotteries/auctions. Just because you think it's ok doesn't mean it isn't a gigantic conflict of interest - it's completely irrelevant whether a CGC employee grades his own book, or another CGC employee does it, because this would remove the iron-clad curtain that's supposed to be between the impartial grader & the book that's being graded.

 

It's funny because this accusation seems to pop up on these boards once every 6 months or so - and when people are called on them, they all claim they have "evidence" to back it up. Yet, when they're asked to produce said evidence, nobody ever does.

 

So ... please ... produce the evidence.

[ChasingKingKirby]

Is that a stain on the cover, near the "20¢" on the spine???

 

 

 

-slym

 

It's ink over spray I believe.

[Designer Toast]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

 

Another difference would be that one's a real business and the other one's not.

 

Isn't the FBI investigating a sports card grading service for this same thing? All someone has to do is prove a single instance of this and report it. The Feds love cases like these involving collectibles and there are more and more investigations happening into these areas where fraud is suspected. You don't want a federal investigator from the DOJ or FBI snooping around because they love to dig and they are very good at it.

 

You would have to be a complete insufficiently_thoughtful_person if you were trying to cash in on the moment instead of building an honest business for your future.

[DarkKnightReturns]

You know what these examples prove? That grading is not a exact science . It just proves that all grading is subjective to ones own oppionion . Me personally I have seen books from CGC that were overgraded undergraded and the same for PGX however, I do trust CGC a hell of alot more than PGX on determing restoration. Although the micro trimming scandal with CGC did cause me to lose alittle faith for a while. But CGC offered refunds on those I bet PGX wouldn't do that.

 

Well, one difference is that there has been numerous sightings of Daniel Patterson from PGX at conventions, where he then proceeded to buy up raw books, slab them himself & then re-sell them in their fancy new PGX holders.

 

Another difference would be that one's a real business and the other one's not.

 

Isn't the FBI investigating a sports card grading service for this same thing? All someone has to do is prove a single instance of this and report it. The Feds love cases like these involving collectibles and there are more and more investigations happening into these areas where fraud is suspected. You don't want a federal investigator from the DOJ or FBI snooping around because they love to dig and they are very good at it.

 

You would have to be a complete insufficiently_thoughtful_person if you were trying to cash in on the moment instead of building an honest business for your future.

hmm quick cash grab or honest company raking in money for years and years

 

[slym2none]

Is that a stain on the cover, near the "20¢" on the spine???

 

It's ink over spray I believe.

 

I ask only because I know they will hammer a book for a stain, especially if it goes through the cover into the interior wraps.

 

(thumbs u

 

 

 

-slym

[ChasingKingKirby]

Is that a stain on the cover, near the "20¢" on the spine???

 

It's ink over spray I believe.

 

I ask only because I know they will hammer a book for a stain, especially if it goes through the cover into the interior wraps.

 

(thumbs u

 

 

 

-slym

 

Yup. You're absolutely right. I made a VERY dumb mistake with another book that I submitted, I prescreened it, checked the front cover, the interior pages and totally forgot the back cover. I estimated the grade at about 9.0. It came back as a 5.0. Why? Because there were about 5 water spots on the BACK cover that I forgot to check. Here's a pic in case your interested. The light spot on the ULC is not a chip, it's a section that where the ink didn't take, its glossed over. Odd flaw, but it is production related.

 

[slym2none]

Wow, never seen a book that had a "no-colour" spot like that... gloss finish and everything.

 

(thumbs u

 

 

 

-slym

[ChasingKingKirby]

Yeah, I thought it was weird too.

 

 

[conditionfreak]

Great info on this thread, by the original poster. It illustates to me what some have already mentioned. Grading is subjective and can and WILL change on the same book, when graded by different professionals on different days.

 

I do want to say that money wise, overall, it seems that buying select PGX graded books paid off in the long run.

 

I also want to say that the premise the original poster has throughout this thread is that CGC got it right and PGX did not. Why do "we" assume that? Couldn't it be that PGX got it more right and CGC got it less right? CGC has in the past designated books as being trimmed that the submitters swear they purchased off the stand as OO, and no trimming was possible in their opinions.

 

Going with the premise that CGC is the final authority in most cases (there are of course exceptions and mistakes by any and all companies), and that CGC gets it right when they disagree with PGX, is a mistaken placement of confidence.

 

But, all of my PGX books will be eventually CGC slabbed. But not because of confidence in CGC or lack thereof in PGX. Strictly because of future sales by my heirs. Heritage does not accept PGX books (as I understand it, they are associated in business with CGC).

 

Oh. One final point. If you think that CGC personal do not submit their own books to CGC to be graded, you are sadly mistaken.

 

Unless you have some actual evidence to back up this claim, I'd suggest you be very careful about making a statement like this - you're trying to cast doubt on CGC's reputation as an impartial grading service, and if I were them, I wouldn't hesitate to throw a libel lawsuit your way.

 

Not that I believe you, but still ...

 

CGC is welcome to throw a lawsuit my way. I don't state things that I can not prove. Momma didn't raise no fools.

 

Seriously though, I do not believe it is against their companies policies and conditions they have previously stated concerning this situation. I do not believe that it is in fact a conflict of interest. It would be silly to have the only credible grading company and not allow the fan boys that work there, the ability to avail themselves of the services. After all, surely most if not all of the employees of CGC are or were collectors of comic books (except maybe a few shippers or what-have-you).

 

I do not begrudge CGC employees the ability to submit their own books for grading. As long as the grading is not done TO THEIR OWN BOOKS BY THEIR OWN SELVES. Other employees can grade their books. Is it a little spooky that the possibility exists of favoritism. Sure. But what business doesn't have favoritism towards fellow workers or family? It is part of life. If I am a cop and I pull over my best friends dad for speeding, he ain't gonna get a ticket. He will get a warning to slow down, but no ticket. Like it or not, that is the way of the world.

 

[blah removed]

 

To CGC. I do not believe it is necessary and would not ask that true comic book collectors that are employees of your company, would have to shun and avoid the services of your company, in the pursuit of their hobby. What other options would they have? Quit collecting and having books graded? Go to your competitors? That wouldn't make any sense at all. No. Just don't let someone grade their own book/s. That is all I ask. Realistically, one could not ask for more of lovers of this hobby.

 

You're kidding, right? This is no different than lottery companies or auction houses - both of which prohibits their employees from participating in their lotteries/auctions. Just because you think it's ok doesn't mean it isn't a gigantic conflict of interest - it's completely irrelevant whether a CGC employee grades his own book, or another CGC employee does it, because this would remove the iron-clad curtain that's supposed to be between the impartial grader & the book that's being graded.

 

It's funny because this accusation seems to pop up on these boards once every 6 months or so - and when people are called on them, they all claim they have "evidence" to back it up. Yet, when they're asked to produce said evidence, nobody ever does.

 

So ... please ... produce the evidence.

 

First off. I do not owe you or anyone else any evidence, until a court tells me to produce it. Secondly, I will produce it if CGC asks me too, or if they deny what I wrote. What I wrote is the business of CGC to ignore (which could be considered a tacit admission that my statement is true), deny, ban me from the site, or take legal action against me. Or, perhaps, just perhaps, they will state their policy and how they view it.

 

Now, let's just see what happens.

 

As I have already stated. I know it is not a violation of law for them to allow their employees to avail themselves of the companies service. I also believe it is not unethical. Your comparison to an auction or a lottery is totally out in left field. Is an employee of Ebay allowed to bid on Ebay items? Is a bank employee allowed to get a home or car loan from the bank they work for? Can not Congress vote and pass a pay raise for themselves?

 

Just how do you think Borock got all of those CGC slabbed books he was selling here, that were books issued during his time as a CGC employee. Nothing wrong with it, again, as long as someone else dealt with the grading and labeling of the books.

 

Wake up and smell the coffee.

 

CGC, I beg you to tell me if I am right or wrong. On this thread. If you say that I am wrong, I will accept your word and I will apologize loudly.

 

I am done with this subject until that time. My statement was not to embarrass or denegrate CGC. I would love to be an employee of CGC. It would be a second dream job in my life (first being the one I retired from). But if I was an employee, what would be the use if I could not continue with my hobby? That would destroy the dream and it would just be a job.

[mschmidt]

Great info on this thread, by the original poster. It illustates to me what some have already mentioned. Grading is subjective and can and WILL change on the same book, when graded by different professionals on different days.

 

I do want to say that money wise, overall, it seems that buying select PGX graded books paid off in the long run.

 

I also want to say that the premise the original poster has throughout this thread is that CGC got it right and PGX did not. Why do "we" assume that? Couldn't it be that PGX got it more right and CGC got it less right? CGC has in the past designated books as being trimmed that the submitters swear they purchased off the stand as OO, and no trimming was possible in their opinions.

 

Going with the premise that CGC is the final authority in most cases (there are of course exceptions and mistakes by any and all companies), and that CGC gets it right when they disagree with PGX, is a mistaken placement of confidence.

 

But, all of my PGX books will be eventually CGC slabbed. But not because of confidence in CGC or lack thereof in PGX. Strictly because of future sales by my heirs. Heritage does not accept PGX books (as I understand it, they are associated in business with CGC).

 

Oh. One final point. If you think that CGC personal do not submit their own books to CGC to be graded, you are sadly mistaken.

 

Unless you have some actual evidence to back up this claim, I'd suggest you be very careful about making a statement like this - you're trying to cast doubt on CGC's reputation as an impartial grading service, and if I were them, I wouldn't hesitate to throw a libel lawsuit your way.

 

Not that I believe you, but still ...

 

CGC is welcome to throw a lawsuit my way. I don't state things that I can not prove. Momma didn't raise no fools.

 

Seriously though, I do not believe it is against their companies policies and conditions they have previously stated concerning this situation. I do not believe that it is in fact a conflict of interest. It would be silly to have the only credible grading company and not allow the fan boys that work there, the ability to avail themselves of the services. After all, surely most if not all of the employees of CGC are or were collectors of comic books (except maybe a few shippers or what-have-you).

 

I do not begrudge CGC employees the ability to submit their own books for grading. As long as the grading is not done TO THEIR OWN BOOKS BY THEIR OWN SELVES. Other employees can grade their books. Is it a little spooky that the possibility exists of favoritism. Sure. But what business doesn't have favoritism towards fellow workers or family? It is part of life. If I am a cop and I pull over my best friends dad for speeding, he ain't gonna get a ticket. He will get a warning to slow down, but no ticket. Like it or not, that is the way of the world.

 

[blah removed]

 

To CGC. I do not believe it is necessary and would not ask that true comic book collectors that are employees of your company, would have to shun and avoid the services of your company, in the pursuit of their hobby. What other options would they have? Quit collecting and having books graded? Go to your competitors? That wouldn't make any sense at all. No. Just don't let someone grade their own book/s. That is all I ask. Realistically, one could not ask for more of lovers of this hobby.

 

You're kidding, right? This is no different than lottery companies or auction houses - both of which prohibits their employees from participating in their lotteries/auctions. Just because you think it's ok doesn't mean it isn't a gigantic conflict of interest - it's completely irrelevant whether a CGC employee grades his own book, or another CGC employee does it, because this would remove the iron-clad curtain that's supposed to be between the impartial grader & the book that's being graded.

 

It's funny because this accusation seems to pop up on these boards once every 6 months or so - and when people are called on them, they all claim they have "evidence" to back it up. Yet, when they're asked to produce said evidence, nobody ever does.

 

So ... please ... produce the evidence.

 

First off. I do not owe you or anyone else any evidence, until a court tells me to produce it. Secondly, I will produce it if CGC asks me too, or if they deny what I wrote. What I wrote is the business of CGC to ignore (which could be considered a tacit admission that my statement is true), deny, ban me from the site, or take legal action against me. Or, perhaps, just perhaps, they will state their policy and how they view it.

 

Now, let's just see what happens.

 

As I have already stated. I know it is not a violation of law for them to allow their employees to avail themselves of the companies service. I also believe it is not unethical. Your comparison to an auction or a lottery is totally out in left field. Is an employee of Ebay allowed to bid on Ebay items? Is a bank employee allowed to get a home or car loan from the bank they work for? Can not Congress vote and pass a pay raise for themselves?

 

Just how do you think Borock got all of those CGC slabbed books he was selling here, that were books issued during his time as a CGC employee. Nothing wrong with it, again, as long as someone else dealt with the grading and labeling of the books.

 

Wake up and smell the coffee.

 

CGC, I beg you to tell me if I am right or wrong. On this thread. If you say that I am wrong, I will accept your word and I will apologize loudly.

 

I am done with this subject until that time. My statement was not to embarrass or denegrate CGC. I would love to be an employee of CGC. It would be a second dream job in my life (first being the one I retired from). But if I was an employee, what would be the use if I could not continue with my hobby? That would destroy the dream and it would just be a job.

 

You're completely missing the point here.

 

If you work for a lottery company, one could very easily claim that you, whether on purpose or not, would have access to items or people that could unduly influence the lottery drawings - which is exactly the same as the situation that CGC is in.

 

Anyway ... seeing as you're unwilling to provide proof (big surprise there), there's really no need to continue this conversation.

[Davenport]

 

It's funny because this accusation seems to pop up on these boards once every 6 months or so - and when people are called on them, they all claim they have "evidence" to back it up. Yet, when they're asked to produce said evidence, nobody ever does.

 

So ... please ... produce the evidence.

Ok...again...I'm pretty sure CGC clarified the record on this as YES. That's YES employees CAN submit books. And that "to engage in the commercial buying or selling of comics" covers very specific behaviors, not ALL.

 

There was thread that held the official CGC answers. I can't find it, but I can see one in Google. Their "Cached" feature only shows the first page. Anything else results in "Access denied." But here are the thread's particulars, if anyone else remembers it:

 

Thread title: "CGC employees are not allowed to..."

#2010771 - 11/11/07 12:51 PM

Thread's author: PedigreeMan

 

There's a factual answer to CGC's policy. Let's go for details before words like "accusation" start.

 

 

[conditionfreak]

Please don't muddle the schmidty waters with facts. It is easy to tell someone to put up or shut up, but what happens after the "put up"? Does the demander then apologize? Or just not post anymore.

 

If CGC verify's that they allow their employees to submit books for grading, does the demander of proof apologize to ME? If, as the above poster suggests, CGC has already clarified this allowance, do I get an apology?

 

I doubt it.

[CAP Freak]

Great info on this thread, by the original poster. It illustates to me what some have already mentioned. Grading is subjective and can and WILL change on the same book, when graded by different professionals on different days.

 

I do want to say that money wise, overall, it seems that buying select PGX graded books paid off in the long run.

 

I also want to say that the premise the original poster has throughout this thread is that CGC got it right and PGX did not. Why do "we" assume that? Couldn't it be that PGX got it more right and CGC got it less right? CGC has in the past designated books as being trimmed that the submitters swear they purchased off the stand as OO, and no trimming was possible in their opinions.

 

Going with the premise that CGC is the final authority in most cases (there are of course exceptions and mistakes by any and all companies), and that CGC gets it right when they disagree with PGX, is a mistaken placement of confidence.

 

But, all of my PGX books will be eventually CGC slabbed. But not because of confidence in CGC or lack thereof in PGX. Strictly because of future sales by my heirs. Heritage does not accept PGX books (as I understand it, they are associated in business with CGC).

 

Oh. One final point. If you think that CGC personal do not submit their own books to CGC to be graded, you are sadly mistaken.

 

Unless you have some actual evidence to back up this claim, I'd suggest you be very careful about making a statement like this - you're trying to cast doubt on CGC's reputation as an impartial grading service, and if I were them, I wouldn't hesitate to throw a libel lawsuit your way.

 

Not that I believe you, but still ...

 

CGC is welcome to throw a lawsuit my way. I don't state things that I can not prove. Momma didn't raise no fools.

 

Seriously though, I do not believe it is against their companies policies and conditions they have previously stated concerning this situation. I do not believe that it is in fact a conflict of interest. It would be silly to have the only credible grading company and not allow the fan boys that work there, the ability to avail themselves of the services. After all, surely most if not all of the employees of CGC are or were collectors of comic books (except maybe a few shippers or what-have-you).

 

I do not begrudge CGC employees the ability to submit their own books for grading. As long as the grading is not done TO THEIR OWN BOOKS BY THEIR OWN SELVES. Other employees can grade their books. Is it a little spooky that the possibility exists of favoritism. Sure. But what business doesn't have favoritism towards fellow workers or family? It is part of life. If I am a cop and I pull over my best friends dad for speeding, he ain't gonna get a ticket. He will get a warning to slow down, but no ticket. Like it or not, that is the way of the world.

 

[blah removed]

 

To CGC. I do not believe it is necessary and would not ask that true comic book collectors that are employees of your company, would have to shun and avoid the services of your company, in the pursuit of their hobby. What other options would they have? Quit collecting and having books graded? Go to your competitors? That wouldn't make any sense at all. No. Just don't let someone grade their own book/s. That is all I ask. Realistically, one could not ask for more of lovers of this hobby.

 

You're kidding, right? This is no different than lottery companies or auction houses - both of which prohibits their employees from participating in their lotteries/auctions. Just because you think it's ok doesn't mean it isn't a gigantic conflict of interest - it's completely irrelevant whether a CGC employee grades his own book, or another CGC employee does it, because this would remove the iron-clad curtain that's supposed to be between the impartial grader & the book that's being graded.

 

It's funny because this accusation seems to pop up on these boards once every 6 months or so - and when people are called on them, they all claim they have "evidence" to back it up. Yet, when they're asked to produce said evidence, nobody ever does.

 

So ... please ... produce the evidence.

 

First off. I do not owe you or anyone else any evidence, until a court tells me to produce it. Secondly, I will produce it if CGC asks me too, or if they deny what I wrote. What I wrote is the business of CGC to ignore (which could be considered a tacit admission that my statement is true), deny, ban me from the site, or take legal action against me. Or, perhaps, just perhaps, they will state their policy and how they view it.

 

Now, let's just see what happens.

 

As I have already stated. I know it is not a violation of law for them to allow their employees to avail themselves of the companies service. I also believe it is not unethical. Your comparison to an auction or a lottery is totally out in left field. Is an employee of Ebay allowed to bid on Ebay items? Is a bank employee allowed to get a home or car loan from the bank they work for? Can not Congress vote and pass a pay raise for themselves?

 

Just how do you think Borock got all of those CGC slabbed books he was selling here, that were books issued during his time as a CGC employee. Nothing wrong with it, again, as long as someone else dealt with the grading and labeling of the books.

 

Wake up and smell the coffee.

I don't thnk this is true.

[mschmidt]

Please don't muddle the schmidty waters with facts. It is easy to tell someone to put up or shut up, but what happens after? Does the demander then apologize? Or just not post anymore.

 

If CGC verify's that they allow their employees to submit books for grading, does the demander of proof apologize to ME? If, as the above poster suggests, CGC has already clarified this allowance, do I get an apology?

 

I doubt it.

 

Which facts? Did you even look at the link? All you can see is one page where some forum members are speculating on what CGC considers "commercial selling & buying".

 

If you turn out to be correct, I'll happily post a public apology aimed specifically at you, but you're still missing the point - yes, I asked you to "put up or shut up", but did you actually put anything up? No, you didn't - just like everyone else who's made this accusation.

[conditionfreak]

Here is the only thing I can find with a google search, concerning this subject.

 

": CGC is described as independent and third-party. What does that mean?

 

A: CGC does not buy or sell magazines and does not have a financial interest in the magazines we certify. In fact, employees of CGC are prohibited from buying and selling collectibles commercially."

 

From this web site: http://www.cgcmagazines.com/faq.aspx#q2-11

 

Now, this statemnt is the same as the poster above referenced, so nothing new. It does leave a wide margin for interpretation though.

 

During my google searching, I also found some info that Heritage Auctions, does indeed allow employees to bid on items auctioned there. I do not have insider info about whether or not this is actually true though. I do have insider info concerning employees of CGC and the policy we have been discussing. I do not want to get anyone fired and will not provide any more info than I already have.

 

Live with it.

 

Where is your proof that they do not allow employees to submit books with them, for certification? hmmm............

 

 

[Mr 9.8]

''ms vs. condition'' *I like this thread, IT'S EXCITING!

[Davenport]

 

Which facts? Did you even look at the link? All you can see is one page where some forum members are speculating on what CGC considers "commercial selling & buying".

 

If you turn out to be correct, I'll happily post a public apology aimed specifically at you, but you're still missing the point - yes, I asked you to "put up or shut up", but did you actually put anything up? No, you didn't - just like everyone else who's made this accusation.

Ok...try this thread. CLICK HERE

 

Scroll down to where The Beyonder posts "Um........CGC employees are allowed to build CGC collections & submit books for grading. It's not a conspiracy theory. "

Then look at the response to it. The implication is, It's common knowledge, so why bring that up when it doesn't fit the conversation.

 

I just wish someone would pull up the official policy explaination. Frustratiing, relying on memory.