Showcase #22 Club 14 14

[showcase22gr1959]

Man, that 6.0 that Mark sold last year is looking better and better each day. He had a whole collection of mid-grade keys with nice page quality.

Was this all from one collection?

[tth2]

What I meant by that comment is that B&B #28 suffers price wise for the same reason Avengers #1 does - it does not have the first appearace of any heroes.

I could be wrong in this, but my impression has always been that JLA was much more popular with DC collectors than Avengers was with Marvel collectors. Next to Batman-related titles, I'd say that JLA was usually the 2nd most popularly collected DC title, whereas I think Avengers historically trailed several of the individual titles.

 

The comparisons aren't perfect, because there were multiple Batman titles while Marvel had a limited number of titles plus several anthology titles that featured 2 characters, but I know a lot more DC collectors for whom JLA was their #1 or #2 title than Marvel collectors for whom Avengers was their #1 or #2 title.

 

Sales figures bear out your theory....Thor was actually the # 3 seller in the mid sixties and the GPA for the # 3 Marvel title shows quite a drop off from 1 and 2. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

P.S. I think Sgt. Fury was rivalling the sales of Avengers at one point.

Well, I was talking more about what was popular in the back-issue market rather than new sales. If we're using new sales as a gauge of popularity, then I believe Superman was the king. But in all my years of collecting, I've never actually known anyone who was a SA Superman collector. Literally every other DC hero, including even Hawk & Dove, Creeper and Metamorpho, but never Superman! JLA was always the most popular title after Batman.

 

Interesting that Thor was #3 in new sales, because he was never that popular among back-issue collectors.

[MstrTech]

Well, I was talking more about what was popular in the back-issue market rather than new sales. If we're using new sales as a gauge of popularity, then I believe Superman was the king. But in all my years of collecting, I've never actually known anyone who was a SA Superman collector. Literally every other DC hero, including even Hawk & Dove, Creeper and Metamorpho, but never Superman! JLA was always the most popular title after Batman.

 

Hey guys sorry to interrupt, but my dad was a huge Superman / Batman fan and the main reason he started buying JLA was because it had both characters and others so he thought he was getting more for his money.

His words. That’s why his earliest books were Superman. He also bought World's Finest for the same reason. Never thought about it but maybe JLA is what started him buying Flash and GL and that's why he didn't have the early issues or Showcase 4 or 22. But he did have Showcase 9 and 10 because of the Superman tie in. Just now thought of that.

 

We now return to your regularly scheduled discussion

 

 

(thumbs u

 

Love the thread by the way.

[tth2]

Andrew, it was very obvious from your Dad's collection that his main interests were Superman and Batman! Clearly lots of kids from your Dad's generation liked Superman and bought his books and traded for them in what constituted the back-issue market back then, since he was Numero Uno back then.

 

I was referring more to kids who began collecting when comic collecting had become a fully-fledged hobby (1970s), who never collected Superman titles when they were kids or after they had grown up, I guess because he was never considered very cool or was just plain boring. The only current collectors of SA Supermans that I know are on these boards.

[JohnT]

Andrew, it was very obvious from your Dad's collection that his main interests were Superman and Batman! Clearly lots of kids from your Dad's generation liked Superman and bought his books and traded for them in what constituted the back-issue market back then, since he was Numero Uno back then.

 

I was referring more to kids who began collecting when comic collecting had become a fully-fledged hobby (1970s), who never collected Superman titles when they were kids or after they had grown up, I guess because he was never considered very cool or was just plain boring. The only current collectors of SA Supermans that I know are on these boards.

 

Superman was the first superhero that I collected when I was a kid in the 70's.

 

I think the appeal was that he seemed "larger than life." He was the most popular, most powerful, and the first superhero...at least in my impressionable mind. I also liked the extended mythology attached to him: super dogs and cats, super relatives, a cast of arch villians, and on and on. I put together a nearly complete run of Action from abut 330-500 when I was a kid, which was no easy task without the internet. I also had quite a few early issues in the 200's.

[KryptoSpidey]

besides the 5.5 ebay sale of $3800+..the last few ebay RAW sales were of a 1.8/2.0 with tape for $400+ and this weekends sale of a 1.0/1.5 area book for $190+.... pretty safe to say that at that rate,slabbed lower grade books should have a huge price jump as well...

[G.A.tor]

Showcase #22 1st app Green Lantern (DC, 1959) CGC 5.5

Winning bid: US $3,803.54

 

That blows my mind. This is a true frenzy being driven by speculation.

if not speculation, then desperation

[G.A.tor]

Uh oh, if Rick is in the house then the rest of us might as well forget about chasing it.

Why do you say that? I have yet to see Rick WIN a high profile book at auction.

that is because books I "will" win, I keep my mouth shut on

[MstrTech]

Andrew, it was very obvious from your Dad's collection that his main interests were Superman and Batman! Clearly lots of kids from your Dad's generation liked Superman and bought his books and traded for them in what constituted the back-issue market back then, since he was Numero Uno back then.

 

I was referring more to kids who began collecting when comic collecting had become a fully-fledged hobby (1970s), who never collected Superman titles when they were kids or after they had grown up, I guess because he was never considered very cool or was just plain boring. The only current collectors of SA Supermans that I know are on these boards.

 

Sorry I misunderstood your point. I would have to agree, I know when I started collecting Superman was lame, well all DC was lame. But now I've begun to appreciate DC more, at least SA.

 

I guess a big pile of cash will do that to ya. lol

 

(thumbs u

 

 

[G.A.tor]

No...now that's the bar for a 5.5 that all other valuations will be based on...unfortunate for those of us still looking for a copy or two...though I'm sure this final price will seem cheap 6 months from now...

Maybe this high price may bring a few more 5.0's or 6.0's out. I think $15000-20000 for the 8.0 Mound City copy looks reasonable now.

 

Define "reasonable"!

This book is currently driven by supply and demand. Collectors now recognizes that SC 22 page quality is normally crm/ow. This particular 5.5 has off-white pages, and as detective27kid said " On sc22 pq is a big deal if you are looking for a separating quality over other copies". This copy deserves a premium...but $3803.64??? Regarding the Mound City 8.0, this is the only publicly high grade copy available for sale and the rest is tucked away in collections. Below are examples of other notable Silver Age keys sales which I have mentioned before. Let's use BB 28 and Avengers 1 as a comparison. The 3rd highest graded BB 28 (which there is five) sold in Comiclink for $21000. Also, let's use Avengers 1 as a comparison. A 8.0 (5th highest and 23 copies) sold in CL for $26000 and a 9.0 (4th highest and ten copies) for $20000 again in CL. Showcase 22 is in high demand and there are less high grade copies available compare to their counterparts.

 

Man, the 5.5 got almost $4k....I can't even guess what the Mound copy will bring now.

 

Tim (tth2), any thoughts on what you think that 8.0 Mound may bring at auction?

I couldn`t even guess. The market is way too fluid for this book right now, plus I really don`t follow prices of non-NM books. I guess it wouldn`t surprise me if this book broke the $10K mark, but that`s about all i can say.

I can agree with that (thumbs u

[kimik]

No...now that's the bar for a 5.5 that all other valuations will be based on...unfortunate for those of us still looking for a copy or two...though I'm sure this final price will seem cheap 6 months from now...

Maybe this high price may bring a few more 5.0's or 6.0's out. I think $15000-20000 for the 8.0 Mound City copy looks reasonable now.

 

Define "reasonable"!

This book is currently driven by supply and demand. Collectors now recognizes that SC 22 page quality is normally crm/ow. This particular 5.5 has off-white pages, and as detective27kid said " On sc22 pq is a big deal if you are looking for a separating quality over other copies". This copy deserves a premium...but $3803.64??? Regarding the Mound City 8.0, this is the only publicly high grade copy available for sale and the rest is tucked away in collections. Below are examples of other notable Silver Age keys sales which I have mentioned before. Let's use BB 28 and Avengers 1 as a comparison. The 3rd highest graded BB 28 (which there is five) sold in Comiclink for $21000. Also, let's use Avengers 1 as a comparison. A 8.0 (5th highest and 23 copies) sold in CL for $26000 and a 9.0 (4th highest and ten copies) for $20000 again in CL. Showcase 22 is in high demand and there are less high grade copies available compare to their counterparts.

 

Man, the 5.5 got almost $4k....I can't even guess what the Mound copy will bring now.

 

Tim (tth2), any thoughts on what you think that 8.0 Mound may bring at auction?

I couldn`t even guess. The market is way too fluid for this book right now, plus I really don`t follow prices of non-NM books. I guess it wouldn`t surprise me if this book broke the $10K mark, but that`s about all i can say.

I can agree with that (thumbs u

 

It will be interesting to see where the Mound City copy ends up. Most (all?) of us here agree that it is not an 8.0 book, but that is what the label says. My guess is that it sets a new record (can it top the price paid for the 9.0s?) for SC #22 IF it gets sufficient exposure since a lot of (or most of) collectors will pay for the CGC grade, not the book in the holder. The only thing I can see that might hurt the price a bit is that they are doing the auction themselves and not on one of the big three sites (Clink, CC or Heritage).

[showcase22gr1959]

No...now that's the bar for a 5.5 that all other valuations will be based on...unfortunate for those of us still looking for a copy or two...though I'm sure this final price will seem cheap 6 months from now...

Maybe this high price may bring a few more 5.0's or 6.0's out. I think $15000-20000 for the 8.0 Mound City copy looks reasonable now.

 

Define "reasonable"!

This book is currently driven by supply and demand. Collectors now recognizes that SC 22 page quality is normally crm/ow. This particular 5.5 has off-white pages, and as detective27kid said " On sc22 pq is a big deal if you are looking for a separating quality over other copies". This copy deserves a premium...but $3803.64??? Regarding the Mound City 8.0, this is the only publicly high grade copy available for sale and the rest is tucked away in collections. Below are examples of other notable Silver Age keys sales which I have mentioned before. Let's use BB 28 and Avengers 1 as a comparison. The 3rd highest graded BB 28 (which there is five) sold in Comiclink for $21000. Also, let's use Avengers 1 as a comparison. A 8.0 (5th highest and 23 copies) sold in CL for $26000 and a 9.0 (4th highest and ten copies) for $20000 again in CL. Showcase 22 is in high demand and there are less high grade copies available compare to their counterparts.

 

Man, the 5.5 got almost $4k....I can't even guess what the Mound copy will bring now.

 

Tim (tth2), any thoughts on what you think that 8.0 Mound may bring at auction?

I couldn`t even guess. The market is way too fluid for this book right now, plus I really don`t follow prices of non-NM books. I guess it wouldn`t surprise me if this book broke the $10K mark, but that`s about all i can say.

I can agree with that (thumbs u

 

It will be interesting to see where the Mound City copy ends up. Most (all?) of us here agree that it is not an 8.0 book, but that is what the label says. My guess is that it sets a new record (can it top the price paid for the 9.0s?) for SC #22 IF it gets sufficient exposure since a lot of (or most of) collectors will pay for the CGC grade, not the book in the holder. The only thing I can see that might hurt the price a bit is that they are doing the auction themselves and not on one of the big three sites (Clink, CC or Heritage).

The grade on the CGC label is what it is. Sometimes we agree and sometimes we disagree. Since three graders examine the book, if one grades it a 7.5 and the other two is 8.0...than it is a 8.0 by them. I'm sure if all us boardie examine the book we'll have all different grades and disagree with each other. Also, CGC uses a grading technique which is consistent and accepted by most. CGC is approaching its ten year anniversary, and this present day, we have not seen a copy over 9.0. Why are there no 9.0 and above...because it may not exist? The one thing is...I don't see this copy selling for less than 10k. There is too much support under 10k for this book, because I'll be a buyer.

Edited September 7, 2009 by showcase22gr1959

[peewee22]

(thumbs u

[Aman619]

What I meant by that comment is that B&B #28 suffers price wise for the same reason Avengers #1 does - it does not have the first appearace of any heroes.

I could be wrong in this, but my impression has always been that JLA was much more popular with DC collectors than Avengers was with Marvel collectors. Next to Batman-related titles, I'd say that JLA was usually the 2nd most popularly collected DC title, whereas I think Avengers historically trailed several of the individual titles.

 

The comparisons aren't perfect, because there were multiple Batman titles while Marvel had a limited number of titles plus several anthology titles that featured 2 characters, but I know a lot more DC collectors for whom JLA was their #1 or #2 title than Marvel collectors for whom Avengers was their #1 or #2 title.

 

Sales figures bear out your theory....Thor was actually the # 3 seller in the mid sixties and the GPA for the # 3 Marvel title shows quite a drop off from 1 and 2. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus) (thumbs u

 

P.S. I think Sgt. Fury was rivalling the sales of Avengers at one point.

Well, I was talking more about what was popular in the back-issue market rather than new sales. If we're using new sales as a gauge of popularity, then I believe Superman was the king. But in all my years of collecting, I've never actually known anyone who was a SA Superman collector. Literally every other DC hero, including even Hawk & Dove, Creeper and Metamorpho, but never Superman! JLA was always the most popular title after Batman.

 

Interesting that Thor was #3 in new sales, because he was never that popular among back-issue collectors.

 

nope. say hello to another SA Superman collector! And someone who bought but had diminiishing interest in JLA. Superman may have gotten a bit redundant after the 170s, but it was readable. But JLA fought third rate villains with dumb plots 8 times a year, and even the JSA crossovers got more and more boring with lamer and lamer heroes, AND, it was all drawn by Sekowsky!! I appreciate his art now, but he was DCs Don Heck.

[Aman619]

Andrew, it was very obvious from your Dad's collection that his main interests were Superman and Batman! Clearly lots of kids from your Dad's generation liked Superman and bought his books and traded for them in what constituted the back-issue market back then, since he was Numero Uno back then.

 

I was referring more to kids who began collecting when comic collecting had become a fully-fledged hobby (1970s), who never collected Superman titles when they were kids or after they had grown up, I guess because he was never considered very cool or was just plain boring. The only current collectors of SA Supermans that I know are on these boards.

 

oh, you meant 70s Superman? yeah, pretty consistently lousy by then, But IMO, JLA was a total joke too. You young guys love your BA books because you grew up on them. But us SA guys thought they were dreck! And always did until recent price surges made dealers and collectors reevaluate these stragglers in our collections.

[Aman619]

back to the list and the possibility of a 9.2 or 9.4 copy - - -where is the Bethlehem copy? that run was pretty nice overall. No reason to expect the 22 to be subpar. When the run was available around 10 years ago, the 22 was already gone.

[showcase22gr1959]

back to the list and the possibility of a 9.2 or 9.4 copy - - -where is the Bethlehem copy? that run was pretty nice overall. No reason to expect the 22 to be subpar. When the run was available around 10 years ago, the 22 was already gone.

Could anyone else confirm there is a SC22 Bethlehem copy? Some notable Bethlehem keys: SC8 8.0, SC 9 8.0, SC13 9.0, SC24 9.0. There is a possibility, but it's a long shot.

[peewee22]

back to the list and the possibility of a 9.2 or 9.4 copy - - -where is the Bethlehem copy? that run was pretty nice overall. No reason to expect the 22 to be subpar. When the run was available around 10 years ago, the 22 was already gone.

Could anyone else confirm there is a SC22 Bethlehem copy? Some notable Bethlehem keys: SC8 8.0, SC 9 8.0, SC13 9.0, SC24 9.0. There is a possibility, but it's a long shot.

 

Maybe the guy died and it was buried with 'em. In that case, it will always be a 9.2 or 9.4...we just won't know about it....

 

[showcase22gr1959]

[Bomber-Bob]

back to the list and the possibility of a 9.2 or 9.4 copy - - -where is the Bethlehem copy? that run was pretty nice overall. No reason to expect the 22 to be subpar. When the run was available around 10 years ago, the 22 was already gone.

 

I purchased the Bethlehem copies of SC 29 - 32 about 10 years ago. I still have the 30 and 31. I know the 22 was not offered to me because I would have grabbed it. Do you know who brought the Bethlehems to market ? I got my copies from a Canadian dealer.