Remind me-why isn't staple replacement resto?

[TFL-migration]

Staple replacement could be seen as both restoration and conservation. But I have seen staples that were rusty that were not going to cause rust to migrate to the actual paper stock. For the lack of a better definition. The rust is localized to the outside of the staple. Mid way between the bent tines.

 

I can understand wanting to keep any rust migration to the paper from ever happening. But by definition the removal/replacement of the staples is restoration IMHO. The "new" vintage staples are not from the original book. They are in better, rust free condition. There not original factory staples from that book. This can lead to a book getting a higher overall grade.

 

This grade bump can have a big impact on the book's value. It could take a key book worth $7K too a $10K+ book. Depending on how much the grade went up. It is a restorative type of conservation. IMHO If push came to shove and the rusty staples were going to cause rust migration onto the book itself. I would also have the staples replaced. Or possibly see if the original staples could be repaired then re attached to the book. It can become a slippery slope. If staple replacement is not restoration. Does this mean a non invasive, solvent free cleaning of a book is or is not restoration? Or is it conservation?

 

Either way you look at it. This is a very good thread with some very useful information.

 

[divad]

The plot thickens

 

Anyone have a Sig Series example so we can hit for the cycle

[codfish]

Here's what I want CGC to do;

 

 

Keep the PLOD for books that have non-removable or appearance-driven work done. Amateur colour touch, cleanings, trimming, reglossing, etc. These books get a purple"Restored" label.

 

 

Put books that have been conserved or professionally restored - i.e. staples replaced, tear seals, professional colour touch, japan paper etc - in a new label... a "Restored" blue.

 

 

I'm not sure what the final answer should be, but it seems to me that some forms of work need to be "punished" - i.e. less market acceptance - more than others do

 

 

 

IMO if the idea is to get more respectability for proper restoration/restorative techniques the only way to do it is punish the amateur repair out there. Keeping the current labeling system will not get rid of the existing mindset.

 

I personally WANT professional restoration to begin to earn more respect while trying to discourage amateur repairs. Heck I am all for a purple "repaired" label and a BLUE "restored".

 

(I think they should also consider ditching that damn qualified label as it is complete bunk anyway as some clods out there seem to think that it gives them full authority to grade books higher. If they are going to keep them then two grades should be on the label one which gives the actual grade and what it WOULD BE if it didn't have the major defect.)

[telerites]

I wished I would have seen this thread earlier. I saw Divad posted an example. Here's one I have. Doesn't seem to a standardized protocol for this - I was told (not by CGC) if vintage staples are used then it gets a GLOD. But the CGC quote earlier in the thread contradicts this

 

[divad]

IMHO both of the Green label examples posted here should have been Blue labels at the same grade . . .

 

But nobody asked me

 

 

It's also worthy to note that staple replacement is given a Green label only when there is evidence of such.

[cheetah]

How does CGC tell if staples have been replaced when using vintage staples from the same print run? Seems like that would be pretty tough to do.

[faster friends]

How does CGC tell if staples have been replaced when using vintage staples from the same print run? Seems like that would be pretty tough to do.

 

Sometimes there are marks or scratches on the staples from the tools used to remove and insert them

[cheetah]

But don't some people disassemble books to press them page by page? That'd do the same thing as far as possible scratching and I don't think those get a 'staple replacement' label.

 

Plus, just using plastic-coated tools would cut out most scratching (I would think).

[faster friends]

But don't some people disassemble books to press them page by page? That'd do the same thing as far as possible scratching and I don't think those get a 'staple replacement' label.

 

Plus, just using plastic-coated tools would cut out most scratching (I would think).

 

Ze-man had a post about it in a resto thread a few months ago. That is where I saw about the scratches from tools

[FFB]

But don't some people disassemble books to press them page by page? That'd do the same thing as far as possible scratching and I don't think those get a 'staple replacement' label.

 

Plus, just using plastic-coated tools would cut out most scratching (I would think).

 

It's not just marks on the staples. The paper around the staples is usually a big telltale sign because it will be frayed, even if you're careful. Also, if there is rust on the paper around the staples but no rust on the staples themselves, then you can be pretty sure the staples were cleaned or replaced.

 

Also, books aren't usually disassembled just for a pressing.

[Paratrooper]

The plot thickens

 

Anyone have a Sig Series example so we can hit for the cycle

 

As requested:

[faster friends]

Maybe the staples being replaced is not what designates the color of the label.

In this thread we have seen 4 different color labels all noting "staples replaced"

[divad]

Maybe the staples being replaced is not what designates the color of the label.

In this thread we have seen 4 different color labels all noting "staples replaced"

 

Well, I wish . . . I was told flat out by a grader on the telephone when I asked about my FF #8, "Staples replaced always gets a Green label." A suggestion/request for a Blue label with a commensurate lower grade was rejected.

[divad]

But don't some people disassemble books to press them page by page? That'd do the same thing as far as possible scratching and I don't think those get a 'staple replacement' label.

 

Plus, just using plastic-coated tools would cut out most scratching (I would think).

 

It's not just marks on the staples. The paper around the staples is usually a big telltale sign because it will be frayed, even if you're careful. Also, if there is rust on the paper around the staples but no rust on the staples themselves, then you can be pretty sure the staples were cleaned or replaced.

 

Also, books aren't usually disassembled just for a pressing.

 

Quite often the evidence of staple replacement can be as simple as the indents of the staple tines on the centerfold don't match up. Most of the time staples are replaced due to rust, and even minimal visible migration in the absence of tarnished staples is conclusive enough.

 

Other tell-tale indications are that the staple holes are enlarged or the staple doesn't appear to lay correctly, as with a manufactured book.

 

 

[fingfangfoom]

Sweet! The Rangers Comics #26 are really coming out of the woodwork this week!

 

As far as spotting staple manipulation I know this is probably a difficult assignment for CGC, especially if the work is done profesionally.

 

As far as the other comments regarding label colors, I personally like blue unrestored-purple restored. I don't buy into the psychology that the purple label creates a stigma. If I'm in the market for a restored book it makes no difference what color the label is. If anything, it makes for a quick identification tool to either include or exclude a book for consideration.

[cheetah]

I asked Steve Borock about staple replacement. He said if it was done right, he might not be able to tell. But there are a lot of signs if it isn't done right. So I'm satisfied. Didn't ask him about label color, though.

[zuckuss2003]

Any idea of the approximate cost to have staples replaced? I have a book only worth about $50 but the staples are rusty.

[DiceX]

Any idea of the approximate cost to have staples replaced? I have a book only worth about $50 but the staples are rusty.

 

It costs me about 5 minutes and the carcass of an old ratty book.

It's pretty easy to do, and saves your book from further destruction.

 

 

[zuckuss2003]

So folks in general replace the staples themselves? Ok, while not seeming hard to do I guess, any chance anyone has a guide or best practice for ensuring the book holds tight upon reassembly?

[DiceX]

1. DO NOT wallow out the holes during reinsertion. You have to go easy so the hole stays tight.

2. Don't just push the staple over. You need to bend it in an arch so it holds properly without putting strain at the hole.