Need help introducing and finding OA!...

[521strom-migration]

At the end of last year, I recently sold a majority of my business which I had started more than 10 years ago from scratch. Less than what I could have gotten for it in better times, but thankful to close the deal in this economy.

 

I've decided to allocate roughly $120k-$150k to comics OA and humbly ask you boardies for help as to what quality material could be acquired with that amount. I'm not new to comics - I've been a collector for most of my adult life and been able to acquire a few HG SA keys, visiting the forums a few times to find out about what I was interested in. But I am rather new to OA, not owning a single OA yet since having been outbid twice at Heritage.

 

I know $120k, even $150k, doesn't buy what it used to. My interest is directed towards SA/BA hero covers and splashes, but I'm open to new areas. I always take advice with a grain of salt, but am appreciative nonetheless. Don't get me wrong, even though I have "money to spend", I have no problem being patient or not spending the money at all if nothing arises, and I don't plan on mindlessly plunking down cash on the first good OA pieces that I see.

 

Being an avid comic collector, but OA newbie, I'm less certain of what quality material (yes, I know when it comes to art, it is in the eye of the beholder) is currently on the market and who/where to go looking for high end OA pieces. So any help/comments would be welcomed!

[comix4fun]

There is no simple answer to your question.

 

However, I will tell you the most important thing you need to know as you enter into this hobby. BEWARE of any advice people give you on what you should buy unless you are 100% sure they don't actually own (and may be trying to sell) the item they are advising you to purchase.

 

I have met, literally, hundreds of really great people in this hobby. They are helpful, honest, upstanding connoisseurs of original comic artwork. There are, however, several "sharks in the water" that would be more than happy to relieve you of your cash in deals that are less than mutually rewarding. This is true in this side of the hobby, even more so than in the Comic Book side of things, because values are more esoteric and fluid and more susceptible to manipulation.

 

You need to read as much as you can on this board. You should join other forums (such as Comic Art L on Yahoo) where OA is discussed. You should take the time to go to ComicArtFans.com and go through the market data there and on Heritage's site.

 

You should also determine what your end goal is. If you goal is to attain some grail level pieces for the purposes of holding for a long period of time then $150,000 will get you anywhere from 1 to 20 pieces of artwork. If your goal is to turn a profit or to invest in he artwork for monetary gain then you would be able to use that high level of liquid cash to attain a larger amount of artwork at a severely discounted price and piece the artwork out selling a bit at a time for profit.

 

If your goal is to attain something special to hang onto. Then you really have to determine what artists you really like and appreciate and find an example of that artist at the peak of his powers. That is a personal choice and something only you can figure out for yourself.

 

If your goal is to buy and turn pieces to make your investment grow then you must really educate yourself on the nuances of the hobby.For example, if you like Neal Adams, and you have a chance to purchase some of his art, do you know what era of Adams' artwork is most desirable, which titles and issues in those titles is most desirable, which inker over his pencils is most desirable? Answering these questions accurately is the difference in thousands of dollars per piece of artwork in value.

 

The best advice I can give you is to take your time. Make some friends in this hobby and before you make a decision on a purchase get MANY points of view and don't rely on any one person to guide you through the process unless you get to know them outside the hobby and can be sure they aren't trying to get you to buy something you should not be at a price you should not pay.

 

I hope this helps a bit.

 

Best,

Chris

 

[westform]

pm sent.

[Bronty]

There is no simple answer to your question.

 

However, I will tell you the most important thing you need to know as you enter into this hobby. BEWARE of any advice people give you on what you should buy unless you are 100% sure they don't actually own (and may be trying to sell) the item they are advising you to purchase.

 

I have met, literally, hundreds of really great people in this hobby. They are helpful, honest, upstanding connoisseurs of original comic artwork. There are, however, several "sharks in the water" that would be more than happy to relieve you of your cash in deals that are less than mutually rewarding. This is true in this side of the hobby, even more so than in the Comic Book side of things, because values are more esoteric and fluid and more susceptible to manipulation.

 

You need to read as much as you can on this board. You should join other forums (such as Comic Art L on Yahoo) where OA is discussed. You should take the time to go to ComicArtFans.com and go through the market data there and on Heritage's site.

 

You should also determine what your end goal is. If you goal is to attain some grail level pieces for the purposes of holding for a long period of time then $xxx will get you anywhere from 1 to 20 pieces of artwork. If your goal is to turn a profit or to invest in he artwork for monetary gain then you would be able to use that high level of liquid cash to attain a larger amount of artwork at a severely discounted price and piece the artwork out selling a bit at a time for profit.

 

If your goal is to attain something special to hang onto. Then you really have to determine what artists you really like and appreciate and find an example of that artist at the peak of his powers. That is a personal choice and something only you can figure out for yourself.

 

If your goal is to buy and turn pieces to make your investment grow then you must really educate yourself on the nuances of the hobby.For example, if you like Neal Adams, and you have a chance to purchase some of his art, do you know what era of Adams' artwork is most desirable, which titles and issues in those titles is most desirable, which inker over his pencils is most desirable? Answering these questions accurately is the difference in thousands of dollars per piece of artwork in value.

 

The best advice I can give you is to take your time. Make some friends in this hobby and before you make a decision on a purchase get MANY points of view and don't rely on any one person to guide you through the process unless you get to know them outside the hobby and can be sure they aren't trying to get you to buy something you should not be at a price you should not pay.

 

I hope this helps a bit.

 

Best,

Chris

 

Great advice.

 

I think another good piece of advice would have been to not let everybody know how much money you are playing with but I guess that ship has sailed As chris said values are more fluid, there is going to be more negotiation unless you are just buying straight off of an auction site like heritage, so nobody really needs to know what you will or won't spend. If it were me, I'd edit that out of my post. Its a different game..... comics prices are what they are, oa prices are what you make them.

[westform]

Hi Chris; the advice sounds good and is hard to argue with but; I can honestly say that I've been given so much bad advice over the years in this hobby by folks who don't have or collect what I collect that I have given up taking it at all. Mostly, when I ask advice of a fellow collector I get told that the price seems high and I should wait... then the piece sells, and I wait forever for one I like as much. In other words, collectors always think the price seems high, especially when they are not buying... When they have to do the gut-check oftentimes they jump in and swallow the high price because that's what it takes to get the good stuff.

 

Now, if you are content with ok stuff, average stuff, then by all means wait, there is comic art for sale every day; but if someone offers you a prime piece at a *ahem* prime price... well, then it is gut check time and 50/50 whether you should go for it depending on your goals. Prime pieces do not go around all the time and you may wait forever for another example to reappear.

 

So, as it happens, I have learned to take the advice of the would be seller regarding buying decisions more often than not. If they know the history of the piece and can in some small way justify the price given then I will listen and use that advice. Yes, obviously, they are interested in a sale, but often their are other folks they can sell to and being offered a piece can turn out to be a favor not something to shy away from.

 

Ultimately, I know the markets and make the decisions, but sadly I have learned that my collector buddies, god luv em, don't always steer me in the right direction...

[bocaratondefense]

X-Men #2 page 1

 

 

 

 

[Ferran Delgado]

This is Comicart-L FAQ:

http://groups.google.es/group/originals-fans/web/comicalrt-l-f-a-q?hl=es

 

While it doesn't answer what to do with all your money, at least it'll help you to understand this hobby.

[comix4fun]

Hey Dan,

All true, but more for a guy like you with decades of experience in the hobby over someone just now dipping their toe in.

 

At this point in your collecting life you have heard it all I would guess. The OP hasn't heard any of it. He has no OA experience to fall back on to tell him whether the sales pitch he is getting will net him a Bentley or a lemon flavored Yugo.

 

I don't think anyone who is just getting into this hobby has any idea what they really like or what things are really worth to them without absorbing a TON of information from all kinds of sources, discussion boards, web sites, auction results, and even going back and reading comics they enjoyed in their formative years.

 

At this point the OP may not even know what a "Prime Piece" would be. When you first start into this hobby everything is "OOOOH SHINY" and there are plenty of guys out there willing to tell him that "This is a Prime Piece!" even if it's just a really good piece and not the top of the heap. The gut check only works for the war horses that have been through the battles enough to know when someone's trying to outflank them or worse, take them from the rear.

 

When I started collecting OA I could afford to take the leap of faith to grab a great piece of OA because the margin of error was only a few hundred dollars. Today, the margin is thousands. The OP has gotta make sure the boat floats before he takes it out to sea.

 

Best,

Chris

 

Hi Chris; the advice sounds good and is hard to argue with but; I can honestly say that I've been given so much bad advice over the years in this hobby by folks who don't have or collect what I collect that I have given up taking it at all. Mostly, when I ask advice of a fellow collector I get told that the price seems high and I should wait... then the piece sells, and I wait forever for one I like as much. In other words, collectors always think the price seems high, especially when they are not buying... When they have to do the gut-check oftentimes they jump in and swallow the high price because that's what it takes to get the good stuff.

 

Now, if you are content with ok stuff, average stuff, then by all means wait, there is comic art for sale every day; but if someone offers you a prime piece at a *ahem* prime price... well, then it is gut check time and 50/50 whether you should go for it depending on your goals. Prime pieces do not go around all the time and you may wait forever for another example to reappear.

 

So, as it happens, I have learned to take the advice of the would be seller regarding buying decisions more often than not. If they know the history of the piece and can in some small way justify the price given then I will listen and use that advice. Yes, obviously, they are interested in a sale, but often their are other folks they can sell to and being offered a piece can turn out to be a favor not something to shy away from.

 

Ultimately, I know the markets and make the decisions, but sadly I have learned that my collector buddies, god luv em, don't always steer me in the right direction...

[CollectingFool]

I've decided to allocate roughly $120k-$150k to comics OA and humbly ask you boardies for help as to what quality material could be acquired with that amount. I'm not new to comics - I've been a collector for most of my adult life and been able to acquire a few HG SA keys, visiting the forums a few times to find out about what I was interested in. But I am rather new to OA, not owning a single OA yet since having been outbid twice at Heritage.

 

I'll preface my comments by saying I have no reason to be suspicious of anyone and if I'm completely wrong with my assumptions below I apologize as I do not mean to offend anyone honestly interested in the hobby.

 

All that being said, is it just me or does this seem odd? Someone who's never collected artwork before and doesn't have an ID for this forum until two days ago pops in with an announcement he has a large sum of money to spend? Doesn't this seem like the perfect way to get people to speculate about what the "best" investment in comic art would be? Maybe Spiderman covers? I've heard they've gotten some Krazy prices lately.

 

Now if this is truly someone interested in the hobby and we're not being pulled into the same old krazy song and dance, I'd be more than happy to offer my opinions. I'd want to know who I'm talking to first though.

 

[Spider-Variant]

I've decided to allocate roughly $120k-$150k to comics OA and humbly ask you boardies for help as to what quality material could be acquired with that amount. I'm not new to comics - I've been a collector for most of my adult life and been able to acquire a few HG SA keys, visiting the forums a few times to find out about what I was interested in. But I am rather new to OA, not owning a single OA yet since having been outbid twice at Heritage.

 

I'll preface my comments by saying I have no reason to be suspicious of anyone and if I'm completely wrong with my assumptions below I apologize as I do not mean to offend anyone honestly interested in the hobby.

 

All that being said, is it just me or does this seem odd? Someone who's never collected artwork before and doesn't have an ID for this forum until two days ago pops in with an announcement he has a large sum of money to spend? Doesn't this seem like the perfect way to get people to speculate about what the "best" investment in comic art would be? Maybe Spiderman covers? I've heard they've gotten some Krazy prices lately.

 

Now if this is truly someone interested in the hobby and we're not being pulled into the same old krazy song and dance, I'd be more than happy to offer my opinions. I'd want to know who I'm talking to first though.

 

My thoughts exactly.

[Bronty]

I've decided to allocate roughly $120k-$150k to comics OA and humbly ask you boardies for help as to what quality material could be acquired with that amount. I'm not new to comics - I've been a collector for most of my adult life and been able to acquire a few HG SA keys, visiting the forums a few times to find out about what I was interested in. But I am rather new to OA, not owning a single OA yet since having been outbid twice at Heritage.

 

I'll preface my comments by saying I have no reason to be suspicious of anyone and if I'm completely wrong with my assumptions below I apologize as I do not mean to offend anyone honestly interested in the hobby.

 

All that being said, is it just me or does this seem odd? Someone who's never collected artwork before and doesn't have an ID for this forum until two days ago pops in with an announcement he has a large sum of money to spend? Doesn't this seem like the perfect way to get people to speculate about what the "best" investment in comic art would be? Maybe Spiderman covers? I've heard they've gotten some Krazy prices lately.

 

Now if this is truly someone interested in the hobby and we're not being pulled into the same old krazy song and dance, I'd be more than happy to offer my opinions. I'd want to know who I'm talking to first though.

 

the thought ran through my mind although who knows - if krazy there is at least a little better smokescreen this time

[Bronty]

 

The gut check only works for the war horses that have been through the battles enough to know when someone's trying to outflank them or worse take them from the rear.

 

 

classic

[521strom-migration]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies and advice everyone. They will help better guide my OA "journey", but I know I have to do most of my own legwork.

 

Continuing my original post, I may never spend the stated amount, or perhaps after a long period of OA exposure, I will finally find something where I have to spend quite a bit more to obtain. We will see.

 

I've no interest in "investing" in OA, or buying to sell or any of that. I've collected comics for a long while, started buying CGC books earlier this decade (or last decade as it has become) and only sold a fraction of them since I never had the need nor the original intent to sell them. I'm most interested in expanding into OA now because I've collected, for the most part, most of what I've always wanted to collect in comics. OA seems like a reasonable and exciting progression of my collecting habits!

 

 

[comix4fun]

 

The gut check only works for the war horses that have been through the battles enough to know when someone's trying to outflank them or worse, take them from the rear.

 

 

classic

 

 

I live to please the crowd.

[CollectingFool]

I'm most interested in expanding into OA now because I've collected, for the most part, most of what I've always wanted to collect in comics. OA seems like a reasonable and exciting progression of my collecting habits!

 

OK, here's one piece of advice... the best way to find stuff that isn't offered to other people (usually the better stuff) is through networking. Getting to know fellow collectors. There are dozens of people in this hobby I've helped find stuff (many of which I've never met) and plenty more I will in the future I'm sure. It all starts with a connection and getting to know people a little. Who they are, what they like and what they want.

 

To start things off, I'm Ruben Espinosa. I've been collecting OA about 15 years and I'm in the NYC area. My website is below and while I collect just about everything in OA and spent a bit of time in the 60's-70's Superhero end of things I have lately been focusing more on strip artwork and stuff that is more classically illustrated.

 

What's your name and where are you from? What part of the hobby do you think you'd be most interested in? Comic book art or comic strip art? What time periods interest you? Published or unpublished? What medium?

 

 

[westform]

Not much to argue with again, but, if you've been a long time comic collector you should have an idea of what appeals to you and what is prime or on it's way to prime. After all, it is just a part of the comic production process that we collect.

 

And, yes, info is king, and getting it from all sources and people is very helpful starting out. My main contrary advice was that most collector's are cautious with other people's money ( in other words, they think everything is too expensive) and if you wait, sometimes you lose out. So, wait at your own peril.

 

Also, yes, I like to have posts signed, or links to galleries, websites, etc. But, then again, the discussion is still legitamate no matter the legimacy of the participants....

 

Hey Dan,

All true, but more for a guy like you with decades of experience in the hobby over someone just now dipping their toe in.

 

At this point in your collecting life you have heard it all I would guess. The OP hasn't heard any of it. He has no OA experience to fall back on to tell him whether the sales pitch he is getting will net him a Bentley or a lemon flavored Yugo.

 

I don't think anyone who is just getting into this hobby has any idea what they really like or what things are really worth to them without absorbing a TON of information from all kinds of sources, discussion boards, web sites, auction results, and even going back and reading comics they enjoyed in their formative years.

 

At this point the OP may not even know what a "Prime Piece" would be. When you first start into this hobby everything is "OOOOH SHINY" and there are plenty of guys out there willing to tell him that "This is a Prime Piece!" even if it's just a really good piece and not the top of the heap. The gut check only works for the war horses that have been through the battles enough to know when someone's trying to outflank them or worse, take them from the rear.

 

When I started collecting OA I could afford to take the leap of faith to grab a great piece of OA because the margin of error was only a few hundred dollars. Today, the margin is thousands. The OP has gotta make sure the boat floats before he takes it out to sea.

 

Best,

Chris

 

Hi Chris; the advice sounds good and is hard to argue with but; I can honestly say that I've been given so much bad advice over the years in this hobby by folks who don't have or collect what I collect that I have given up taking it at all. Mostly, when I ask advice of a fellow collector I get told that the price seems high and I should wait... then the piece sells, and I wait forever for one I like as much. In other words, collectors always think the price seems high, especially when they are not buying... When they have to do the gut-check oftentimes they jump in and swallow the high price because that's what it takes to get the good stuff.

 

Now, if you are content with ok stuff, average stuff, then by all means wait, there is comic art for sale every day; but if someone offers you a prime piece at a *ahem* prime price... well, then it is gut check time and 50/50 whether you should go for it depending on your goals. Prime pieces do not go around all the time and you may wait forever for another example to reappear.

 

So, as it happens, I have learned to take the advice of the would be seller regarding buying decisions more often than not. If they know the history of the piece and can in some small way justify the price given then I will listen and use that advice. Yes, obviously, they are interested in a sale, but often their are other folks they can sell to and being offered a piece can turn out to be a favor not something to shy away from.

 

Ultimately, I know the markets and make the decisions, but sadly I have learned that my collector buddies, god luv em, don't always steer me in the right direction...

[spider9698]

My quick two cents.

 

Dont buy ANYTHING for the first six months. Resist the temptation and educate yourself by reading, researching and network with any and all collectors/dealers, etc. A well-educated consumer is a happy consumer.

 

Good luck

S

[delekkerste]

Dont buy ANYTHING for the first six months. Resist the temptation and educate yourself by reading, researching and network with any and all collectors/dealers, etc. A well-educated consumer is a happy consumer.

 

+1

 

There is no rush to jump into the market here, especially since prices are not galloping away like they were a couple of years ago.

 

I agree with Steve - educate yourself first. Only then can you "buy what you like" with confidence. When I started collecting about 7 years ago, I just jumped right into it and "bought what I liked". Looking back, those were the absolute worst purchases of my collecting career (though, I did manage to luck into some good stuff as well). Had I done my homework, I could have easily bought something else I liked that might be worth more than 50 or 60 cents on the dollar today versus what I paid back then.

[MutantKeys]

I agree... I learned the hard way

[Bronty]

I like that advice for sure, but I'm of the mind that you also need to see as much art in person as possible before, after, and during any self-imposed buying moratorium. All the internet research and looking at jpgs in the world isn't quite the same as seeing a piece in person and getting to discuss it with collector friends. Those real life viewings and discussions will help you go a long way towards your understanding why a prime piece is a prime piece. It used to totally baffle me why one piece was more expensive than another or viewed as more desirable. You do have to try and soak it all up for a while but ultimately however much info you soak up, you will make some early buying mistakes. You kind of have to fall down a few times before learning to stand. Get ready for it. I don't know if you need to wait six months..... but definitely make those early purchases small. You will learn from each one.