How in the world did this go unnoticed???

[FlyingDonut]

300 to go!

[G.A.tor]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

 

You'd be surprised, especially with defects that aren't severe, such as the difference between 9.4 to 9.6 and 9.6 to 9.8. Although, more time is required. Again, depending on the severity of the defect.

very true...given enough time, the downward force exerted by an object (of calculated weight) placed on a comic, can have very similar if not EXACT same results to pressing a book with both pressure and heat... again, a myriad of factors come into play, the amount of weight, the ambient temperature, the amount of time, etc, etc...but in "theory", the result could be visibly the same

[DrWatson]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

Not so. I stored all my books in Mylars with the pre-molded flap. As space became a premium, I started placing two books in one Mylar separated by a backing board. I also packed the books extremely tight in the boxes, again due to space being a premium.

 

On many of the books to the back of the Mylar where the flap tucked in was left the impression of the flap on the front of the book.

[drbanner]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

Not so. I stored all my books in Mylars with the pre-molded flap. As space became a premium, I started placing two books in one Mylar separated by a backing board. I also packed the books extremely tight in the boxes, again due to space being a premium.

 

On many of the books to the back of the Mylar where the flap tucked in was left the impression of the flap on the front of the book.

 

Bummer...I know how you can get those impressions removed though, would you like me to start a new thread on how that can be done?

[DrWatson]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

Not so. I stored all my books in Mylars with the pre-molded flap. As space became a premium, I started placing two books in one Mylar separated by a backing board. I also packed the books extremely tight in the boxes, again due to space being a premium.

 

On many of the books to the back of the Mylar where the flap tucked in was left the impression of the flap on the front of the book.

 

Bummer...I know how you can get those impressions removed though, would you like me to start a new thread on how that can be done?

Thank you, but it isn't necessary. I can get them out by calling 1-407-474-7718 or logging onto www.cfpcomics.com

[Timmay]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

 

You'd be surprised, especially with defects that aren't severe, such as the difference between 9.4 to 9.6 and 9.6 to 9.8. Although, more time is required. Again, depending on the severity of the defect.

very true...given enough time, the downward force exerted by an object (of calculated weight) placed on a comic, can have very similar if not EXACT same results to pressing a book with both pressure and heat... again, a myriad of factors come into play, the amount of weight, the ambient temperature, the amount of time, etc, etc...but in "theory", the result could be visibly the same

 

I did it with a crappy IM book. The front cover had a weird waviness to it; put it in between two pieces of thick flat cardboard and left it under a foot high stack of books for a couple of months.

 

Waviness gone

[mschmidt]

......pressure alone is not usually enuff without the heat element,...

Not so. I stored all my books in Mylars with the pre-molded flap. As space became a premium, I started placing two books in one Mylar separated by a backing board. I also packed the books extremely tight in the boxes, again due to space being a premium.

 

On many of the books to the back of the Mylar where the flap tucked in was left the impression of the flap on the front of the book.

 

Bummer...I know how you can get those impressions removed though, would you like me to start a new thread on how that can be done?

Thank you, but it isn't necessary. I can get them out by calling 1-407-474-7718 or logging onto www.cfpcomics.com

 

Just got 15 books in the mail from Joey today

[Sal]

well, the point of my post wasn't to try and give hypothetical situations in which a repair to a book could be made.

 

in fact, that wasn't even a subject of said post. so, not sure why that was brought up. seems like a whole other subject altogether

 

 

[Ze-man]

Let's be fair here, all previous standards have gone by the wayside and these days, whatever CGC says is the case, that's the way people play it.

 

My point exactly.

 

We hear people parroting the CGC talking points all day long -- trimming isn't restoration... it's destruction!

 

(Yet, gouging out a color touch seems to be quite alright. )

 

The current views on trimming aren't nearly as long-standing, universal and immutable as some would have you believe. Much of it stemmed from CGC's stance. Just like the view of pressing seems to have been formed in great part by the "what would CGC do?" mentality.

 

I could not disagree more Steve, if people are parroting CGC's stance on trimming it is probably because that how they actually feel. Who currently has a vastly different view on trimming that is not in line with CGC's..do you?

 

While trimming has been around forever, even being offered as a service back in the day by Sarill and others because trimming could easily improve the appearance and grade of most any book. As I understand it trimming by itself was eventually dropped as a service even when having a book fully restored because it was viewed as destructive.

 

Fast forward to today and you see peoples reaction when they sub a book only to have it come back trimmed... even if the book is for the most part perfect in every way (except for a trimmed edge)..they hate it, they drop it like a hot potato even want to throw the book away or sell it for peanuts ..if they can. And this cannot be blamed entirely on the color of the label. It is what the label says. Trimmed.

 

Unlike pressing, which once people were made aware of became accepted on a level unknown to trimmed books. Sure there was an initial shock because it was an unknown process to most everyone(myself included) but instead of people eventually treating pressed books as if they were trimmed, the exact opposite happened.

 

Like it or not, this speaks volumes. Even if it were possible to label pressed books as PRESSED people would still entertain buying them, unlike trimmed books.

 

So to hear you talk about if CGC did a 180 and suddenly accepted trimming on any level people would jump in feet first makes me shake my head. Sure there might be some who would try and take advantage of this new angle, but overall I cannot see collectors buying into "trimming is OK" just because CGC suddenly said it was.

 

Just because pressing became the new big thing does not mean trimming is next in line. CGC does wields power in our hobby to be sure so if you want to spend your time worrying about all the possible "what ifs" then by all means go ahead. I just prefer to worry about things that have actually happened and deal with them as they do.

[Flaming_Telepath]

Unlike pressing, which once people were made aware of became accepted on a level unknown to trimmed books. Sure there was an initial shock because it was an unknown process to most everyone(myself included) but instead of people treating pressed books as if they were trimmed, the exact opposite happened.

 

Two things, Kenny.

 

One, the shock related to the fact that pressing had always been considered restoration. It had little to nothing to do with it being 'unknown' but rather that it was known...as taboo.

 

Two, many people came to 'accept' pressing because CGC did, and because there was money in doing so.

[Ze-man]

Unlike pressing, which once people were made aware of became accepted on a level unknown to trimmed books. Sure there was an initial shock because it was an unknown process to most everyone(myself included) but instead of people treating pressed books as if they were trimmed, the exact opposite happened.

 

Two things, Kenny.

 

One, the shock related to the fact that pressing had always been considered restoration. It had little to nothing to do with it being 'unknown' but rather that it was known...as taboo.

 

Two, many people came to 'accept' pressing because CGC did, and because there was money in doing so.

 

I think you underestimate how few people really knew about pressing, and what it was. Sure once the shock wore off people saw dollar signs, and the crack out games commenced. But my point was just because that was the case with pressing, does not mean trimming will be next in line.

 

If it does then I think you would see a groundswell of opposition, the same groundswell anti pressers hoped would happen, but didn't.

 

Hows the office coming?

 

 

[whisp]

[Mr. Zipper]

I could not disagree more Steve

 

How dare you?!?!?

 

Fast forward to today and you see peoples reaction when they sub a book only to have it come back trimmed...

 

I think you underestimate the power of groupthink + potential for profit.

 

If an influential entity such as CGC stated years ago that, within certain parameters, very slight trimming was nothing more than correcting the book so it was within the size specifications that were originally intended at the printer... sure, plenty of people would jump on that bandwagon. There'd be plenty of people ready to slice off a bit of that ugly, torn overhang -- it wasn't meant to be there in the first place.

 

Certainly not everyone... you'd have plenty of people against it as well.

 

Hey... it's all just an intellectual exercise anyway. My point was that standards evolve and shift over time. And with a little creative spin, trimming wouldn't be nearly as rejected as it is now. Rejection of trimming is not something that is built into our DNA, it is a learned social more.

 

Exhibit A is the recent thread in the grading/resto forum where a newbie asked if his book was a good candidate for "pressing and a trim." He had no clue he was proposing doing something that is reviled.

[whisp]

Is overhang on a book excess paper that isn't suppose to be there according to standard measurements of a cover?

[Ze-man]

Sounds like we are both doing our fair share of underestimating!

 

I do hear you Steve, I just chose to not lose sleep over the possibility of CGC suddenly greenlighting Trimming. It was kinda hard to just dive into this thread after a few days away, your post was the first thing that caught my eye.

 

Then I got stuck trying to figure out if DP and NDP meant Disclosed Pressing and Non Disclosed Pressing. Or Disasembly Pressing and Non Disasembly pressing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[drbanner]

I could not disagree more Steve

 

How dare you?!?!?

 

Fast forward to today and you see peoples reaction when they sub a book only to have it come back trimmed...

 

I think you underestimate the power of groupthink + potential for profit.

 

If an influential entity such as CGC stated years ago that, within certain parameters, very slight trimming was nothing more than correcting the book so it was within the size specifications that were originally intended at the printer... sure, plenty of people would jump on that bandwagon. There'd be plenty of people ready to slice off a bit of that ugly, torn overhang -- it wasn't meant to be there in the first place.

 

Certainly not everyone... you'd have plenty of people against it as well.

 

Hey... it's all just an intellectual exercise anyway. My point was that standards evolve and shift over time. And with a little creative spin, trimming wouldn't be nearly as rejected as it is now. Rejection of trimming is not something that is built into our DNA, it is a learned social more.

 

Exhibit A is the recent thread in the grading/resto forum where a newbie asked if his book was a good candidate for "pressing and a trim." He had no clue he was proposing doing something that is reviled.

 

I'll have to dig up the exact quote, but IIRC, the early Overstreets actually recommended binding/trimming your books into a hardback for "conservation and preservation", which I assume is where all the bound copies came from. It seems more and more we're seeing those once bound-and-trimmed copies unbound and sold individually. I wonder if they kept the existing staples intact when putting these together?

 

Bound copy of Superman 1-12.

[JiveTurkeyMoFo]

 

Two, many people came to 'accept' pressing because CGC did, and because there was money in doing so.

 

I'm not going to deny that statement, as its largely true as it pertains to my own embracing of the Dark Side. I was initially very strongly against the concept of pressing, until I learned more about, found out what it really entailed, and that yes, in some instances, it can make a book more valuable when it comes time to sell.

 

I would never have had a single book pressed if I had found a convincing amount of evidence that it damaged a book, provided it was done by someone who knew what they were doing. Trust me, none of my irreplacable GA gems (only a few of which have actually been pressed) would've gone near Joey's or Matt's waffle-irons if I felt there was significant chance they would be damaged.

 

Of course, it didn't hurt that all the cool kids were doing it...

[Silver Surfer]

George I am your father.

[Sal]

if CGC said that trimming was now okay and that trimming was something they weren't going to consider restoration, i am pretty sure that in a year or so, trimming would be pretty rampant.

 

you could fill a swimming pool with the number of overhangs that would be taken off the top edges of mid-60s Marvels in the first month

[alecholland]

Even if it were possible to label pressed books as PRESSED people would still entertain buying them, unlike trimmed books.

 

I think this would make for an interesting test. If CGC were to add PRESSED to the label of a few of the graded books they knew to be pressed, I wonder what the outcome would be.

 

Could someone send in books that have been pressed and request that CGC add PRESSED to the label? Would they do something like that for a customer?