top ten silver

[Speedy-D]

Seems no matter what the criteria, Marvel's beating out DC. I always wonder about that. In my little world, Marvel doesn't hold a candle to DC. Spider-Man and The X-Men as both awesome. I collect X-Men and will one day probably get me some Spideys. But the FF? I have zero interest aside from the dope Kirby art.

 

So, what is it about Marvel that everyone loves so much? Maybe it's because I don't actually read many comics that I don't get it. For me, the hobby's all about my favorite artists and characters, and DC wins in those two areas as far as I'm concerned. Is it the writing? I've read some SA Marvel and they were pretty lame. Stan's just not a good writer (sorry guys). Is it the characters? As far as I'm concerned, almost all Superheroes are vague enough that they can be great when in the hands of a good creative team and crappy otherwise.

 

I've got 8 short boxes of SA DC & Marvel comics, and I've probably not read more than 100 of them! And those were mostly Flash and Mystery In Space.

[shadroch]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

[Speedy-D]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

So it's the writing for you? That's cool. But as I said, I don't read any of them. Although I think I might prefer the Superman for its silliness over Stan Lee's attempt at teen angst. And I'd definitely prefer Infantino Batman over whoever was doing Iron Man. Gene Colan as it? He's great, but not Infantino great.

[JohnT]

Seems no matter what the criteria, Marvel's beating out DC. I always wonder about that. In my little world, Marvel doesn't hold a candle to DC. Spider-Man and The X-Men as both awesome. I collect X-Men and will one day probably get me some Spideys. But the FF? I have zero interest aside from the dope Kirby art.

 

So, what is it about Marvel that everyone loves so much? Maybe it's because I don't actually read many comics that I don't get it. For me, the hobby's all about my favorite artists and characters, and DC wins in those two areas as far as I'm concerned. Is it the writing? I've read some SA Marvel and they were pretty lame. Stan's just not a good writer (sorry guys). Is it the characters? As far as I'm concerned, almost all Superheroes are vague enough that they can be great when in the hands of a good creative team and crappy otherwise.

 

I've got 8 short boxes of SA DC & Marvel comics, and I've probably not read more than 100 of them! And those were mostly Flash and Mystery In Space.

 

It's the story content. Marvels were targeted at teens and college age kids, and also appealed to adults. DCs were for kids. Marvels dealt with personal conflicts (romances, rivalries, and moral dilemmas...i.e. the things most young adults were thinking about). DCs dealt with fantasy: strange worlds, strange creatures, super powered good guys and super powered bad guys. They were just two vastly different kinds of books.

 

Really, there were two Silver Ages. The DC silver age was a recreation of the GA, as sanctioned by the Comic Code Authority. The Marvel SA was an entirely new take on what comics could be, with an emphasis on realism (of sorts) and character development. Comparing the two is like comparing apples and oranges, really.

 

Both styles grew tiresome after awhile. But both were great in their own way.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

And this is not just personal opinion; many DC writers of the day are on record as to how they could "out-silly" each other, since they were only writing "comic books", which was, to them, a shameful profession.

 

Marvel, by comparison, at least aimed for a more literate audience. While silly supervillains abounded, at least Lee et al made an attempt to work within the bounds of reason and logic, and the characters changed, evolved, grew. That's one of the reasons why Spiderman is so wildly popular.

[damonwad]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

And this is not just personal opinion; many DC writers of the day are on record as to how they could "out-silly" each other, since they were only writing "comic books", which was, to them, a shameful profession.

 

Marvel, by comparison, at least aimed for a more literate audience. While silly supervillains abounded, at least Lee et al made an attempt to work within the bounds of reason and logic, and the characters changed, evolved, grew. That's one of the reasons why Spiderman is so wildly popular.

I have never been able to stomach many of the main Silver Age DC super hero books for the above reasons. I did/do like Adam Strange, Challengers of the Unknown and the war books.

[Spiderturtle]

Based on the below premise, AF15 should be number 1 on the list no question about it (thumbs u

 

In all seriousness, AF #15 is the third most important comic book ever published, which makes it de facto the most important Silver Age book published.

 

But without Famous Funnies (COC), and New Fun Comics #1, and Detective Comics #1, there probably wouldn't have been an Action #1...but are those books more important than Action #1...?

[Speedy-D]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

And this is not just personal opinion; many DC writers of the day are on record as to how they could "out-silly" each other, since they were only writing "comic books", which was, to them, a shameful profession.

 

Marvel, by comparison, at least aimed for a more literate audience. While silly supervillains abounded, at least Lee et al made an attempt to work within the bounds of reason and logic, and the characters changed, evolved, grew. That's one of the reasons why Spiderman is so wildly popular.

 

They may have aimed at a more literate audience, but they missed. I don't care how many issues have titles like "Lo, When Riseth The Behemoth" or "A God Dieth," these things just were not well written. To say that the writing was better than Lois Lane, if it's even true, is probably not to say much. If you can't get into the silliness of Silver Age comics, I really don't see the appeal.

 

Titles like The Flash and Mystery In Space were written with a sense of humor, they don't try to be more than they are, and they're actually pretty entertaining. If the dilemmas of Peter Parker actually speak to your life, then that's awesome. I've never really related to any character from the Silver Age, so that's just not one of my criteria. I like the silliness.

 

All that aside, is it true that DCs were more popular at the time? I think I've read that DC outsold Marvel by a good deal, but I could be wrong. I also remember reading that DC had some kind of leverage over Marvel's distribution, which I'm sure accounts for some of it.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

And this is not just personal opinion; many DC writers of the day are on record as to how they could "out-silly" each other, since they were only writing "comic books", which was, to them, a shameful profession.

 

Marvel, by comparison, at least aimed for a more literate audience. While silly supervillains abounded, at least Lee et al made an attempt to work within the bounds of reason and logic, and the characters changed, evolved, grew. That's one of the reasons why Spiderman is so wildly popular.

 

They may have aimed at a more literate audience, but they missed. I don't care how many issues have titles like "Lo, When Riseth The Behemoth" or "A God Dieth," these things just were not well written. To say that the writing was better than Lois Lane, if it's even true, is probably not to say much. If you can't get into the silliness of Silver Age comics, I really don't see the appeal.

 

Since you've admitted you don't read them much at all, there's really not much point in discussing them, other than to say, Silver Age Marvels are much, much higher quality than Silver Age DCs when it comes to their function as reading material.

 

To dismiss it all as derivative drivel would be a disservice. That would be like saying Catcher in the Rye is junk because you read it as an adult, when the reality is, Catcher in the Rye is aimed squarely at the 15-18 year old crowd, when life takes on a flavor that makes CITR far more evocative than it would your average 37 year old. I know when I read it as a 16 year old, it said everything I wanted to say, in words I could never come up with on my own. I read it a few years ago, in my mid-30's, and all I could think was "Man, doesn't this kid ever stop whining...?"

 

As far as "even if it's true"...I invite you to not believe anything anyone here has said, but rather read them for yourself, and see.

 

I agree with you...I cannot read ANY of it, as it's high class melodrama, which I can't tolerate. I've rarely read a superhero book prior to about 1983-84 that I could stomach. I even tried reading New Teen Titans this last year, and made it all the way to issue 10 before I gave up. It's awful. Just awful. Dark Phoenix Saga was horrid, too. I read it as an adult, and the dialogue is as bad as the campiest Telenovelas....it's just horrible.

 

And I'm sad I didn't read it as a kid. I'm sure it would have been a lot more enjoyable. One of the greatest movies I ever saw in my entire life was the Poseiden Adventure, which came out the year I was born, and was played on some random Saturday when I was 8-9. Greatest movie EVER. Flash forward to college, I pick it up because it was one of the greatest movies EVER...and was WILDLY disappointed at how trashy and campy it was.

 

So a lot of it has to do with when one was exposed to it. Marvels were written for literate 10-12 year olds...DCs weren't even written for idiotic 5 year olds.

 

Titles like The Flash and Mystery In Space were written with a sense of humor, they don't try to be more than they are, and they're actually pretty entertaining. If the dilemmas of Peter Parker actually speak to your life, then that's awesome.

 

Though I wasn't around at that time, and would not read a Spiderman comic book until 1990, who can't relate to the real life things happening to and around Peter Parker, aside from the superhero stuff...? Do not most of us graduate high school? Do not most of us men find it difficult to ask the really pretty girl out on a date? Do not most of us relate to jocks, or nerds, or pretty girls?

 

I've never really related to any character from the Silver Age, so that's just not one of my criteria. I like the silliness.

 

All that aside, is it true that DCs were more popular at the time? I think I've read that DC outsold Marvel by a good deal, but I could be wrong. I also remember reading that DC had some kind of leverage over Marvel's distribution, which I'm sure accounts for some of it.

 

DC consistently outsold Marvel throughout the 1960's, though the margin got smaller and smaller, until 1971, when Marvel took over and has held the crown ever since (with exceptions, natch.). But keep in mind, DC was the Goliath, and Marvel the tiny David with a lot of catching up to do. And yes, DC owned Independent News, which distributed, among other things, Marvel Comics...and restriced the amount of titles Marvel could distribute until 1968.

[Warren Oates]

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

 

Agreed, it's amazing DC was able to churn them out as long as they did. It did make for some funny covers, and sometimes thought provoking covers. But the stories never held up at all, one dimensional kids stuff. Marvel had characters and stories based on a filament of science and some continuity. Marvel characters had personalities that made them seem real. Marvel really kicked in with the quality art too, Romita and Steranko turned out some great covers.

 

Somewhere along the way DC figured out it might be nice to try something for people 16 and over, and Batman and Detective started to have better written stories and much more of an edge. I'm not sure where this happened though, I think somewhere in the 15 cent covers.

 

Some of the DC horror was OK though too.

 

[Warren Oates]

 

DC consistently outsold Marvel throughout the 1960's, though the margin got smaller and smaller, until 1971, when Marvel took over and has held the crown ever since (with exceptions, natch.). But keep in mind, DC was the Goliath, and Marvel the tiny David with a lot of catching up to do. And yes, DC owned Independent News, which distributed, among other things, Marvel Comics...and restriced the amount of titles Marvel could distribute until 1968.

 

Yep I heard that's why Marvel was restricted. When that ended Captain America, Subby, Hulk, Dr. Strange, Nick Fury, Iron Man all got their own books.

[chrisco37]

My Top 10:

 

1. AF#15 - 3rd biggest book in the hobby. Action #1 is king...Tec #27 beats it out for #2 only because of age.

 

 

 

 

Well said (thumbs u

in terms of importance, or value? Importance, introducing Spidey I can live with that behind action 1 and tec 27, but in terms of value, a Superman 1 grade for grade would spank AF 15 into the mutiverse

 

Importance, not value.

 

Unfair to compare GA vs. SA in value terms.

 

HG Supes #1 would spank nearly every book besides "the big 2" grade for grade (not that I need to tell you that).

 

But, sheer importance/impact, AF#15 has to be #3. Spidey is arguably the #1 superhero in the world.

[G.A.tor]

My Top 10:

 

1. AF#15 - 3rd biggest book in the hobby. Action #1 is king...Tec #27 beats it out for #2 only because of age.

 

 

 

 

Well said (thumbs u

in terms of importance, or value? Importance, introducing Spidey I can live with that behind action 1 and tec 27, but in terms of value, a Superman 1 grade for grade would spank AF 15 into the mutiverse

 

Importance, not value.

 

Unfair to compare GA vs. SA in value terms.

 

HG Supes #1 would spank nearly every book besides "the big 2" grade for grade (not that I need to tell you that).

 

But, sheer importance/impact, AF#15 has to be #3. Spidey is arguably the #1 superhero in the world.

no doubt you can't compare value, but by the same logic, without Superman 1, Batman 1, Captain America 1, etc, there would have been no AF15 or Spidey 1 etc... so, one can extend that premise backwards as well...

 

bottom line is, we have to keep the era's seperate... the Golden Age has its importance and role, as the Silver age does...

 

as far as criteria: importance, content, value, scarcity, art, etc...a myriad of ways to define a top 10 for sure...and because they are just our opinions, none are any more right than the other (thumbs u

[skypinkblu]

Go thru your collection and try and find a few Marvels and DCs that were published the same month. Then compare and contrast a FF story with a JLA story from the same month. Next compare a Spiderman with a Superman from the same month. Try a Daredevil/Hawkman comparison or a Iron Man/ Batman.

Just for kicks, compare and contrast any three months of Avengers stories with those of the Legion.

 

(thumbs u

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

And this is not just personal opinion; many DC writers of the day are on record as to how they could "out-silly" each other, since they were only writing "comic books", which was, to them, a shameful profession.

 

Marvel, by comparison, at least aimed for a more literate audience. While silly supervillains abounded, at least Lee et al made an attempt to work within the bounds of reason and logic, and the characters changed, evolved, grew. That's one of the reasons why Spiderman is so wildly popular.

 

I don't really agree...(of course I'm a DC fan;) but to me, when I first started reading Spidey, he was whiney...DC on the other hand had fantastic fantasy scenarios. It was pure escapism...Spidey made me cringe. I'm re-reading some of them now, and I still find them dark...POOR Aunt May...

 

My top 10 would have to include Action 242 and Action 252, and of COURSE Action 247.

 

Nuff said;)

[ChasingKingKirby]

Just to throw some scarcity numbers out there, I did a little comparison using census numbers in different grade ranges. Basically, I compared total census numbers for 9.0 to 10. 7.0 to 8.5 and .5 to 6.5. I compared those books that are typically accepted as the top 12 books. Here's what I found. (Only one real surprise for me, but a couple eye-openers.) This list obviously doesn't take into account resubs that haven't been purged from the registry, so I suspect that some of these books are even RARER than the registry suggests.

 

Lowest census numbers for 9.0 and above. (Suggesting scarcity in high-grades.)

 

1. Showcase 22. Far and away the scarcest book in High-grade with a total of TWO Blue copies.

 

2. Showcase 4. Still incredibly scarce in high grade with only four copies 9.0 and up.

 

3. Brave and the Bold 28. A DC sweep of the top three spots, with only 7 copies at 9.0 or higher.

 

4. Fantastic Four 1. My first surprise. I didn't realize how tough FF 1 is in high-grade. But with only 8 copies at 9.0 or higher, this is the rarest Marvel key in high-grade.

 

5. Incredible Hulk 1. I really thought this was the rarest Marvel in high-grade, but with 13 copies, it's not really that close.

 

6. Amazing Fantasy 15. With 15 copies on census. AF15 is 6th scarcest. Which makes it understandable as to why it's so valuable in HG. Few HG copies + Highest demand of any silver book = Huge price tag in 9.0 and above.

 

7. Journey into Mystery 83. Seventh on the list with 21 copies 9.0 or better. I think this is probably the book with the most room to grow value wise in 2010. But that's just me.

 

8. Amazing Spider-Man 1. Eighth on the list with 26 copies. This was relatively surprising as I expected this book to be the most common in high-grade. It's not even close.

 

9. Tales of Suspense 39. Ninth on the list with 33 copies. Still relatively scarce.

 

10. X-men 1. 10th with 37 copies.

 

11. Daredevil 1. By far the most second most common in HG with a whopping 93 copies! Found that to be surprising. I seem to see more ASM 1s and X-men 1s than I do DDs, but the numbers don't lie.

 

12. Avengers 4. There are 100 copies 9.0 and above. Wow. Easily the most common. I guess white covers really are easier in HG.

 

This is only an indicator of scarcity, but maybe this helps somewhat in determining the top ten.

 

 

[kimik]

 

There's very little, by the time the Silver Age kicked into high gear, that was comparable between Marvel & DC. DC books, with some exceptions, are almost impossible to read as an adult.

 

Pick up an issue of Superboy, and it's little better than See Spot Run. In fact, it's worse, because many DC stories from the SA stretch the boundaries of reason and logic to breaking. The characters never evolved, never changed, never did anything but tackle the same types of villains, often sans logic, issue after issue after issue.

 

Read any issue of Lois Lane, or Superboy, or even Superman to see how this is true.

 

 

Agreed, it's amazing DC was able to churn them out as long as they did. It did make for some funny covers, and sometimes thought provoking covers. But the stories never held up at all, one dimensional kids stuff. Marvel had characters and stories based on a filament of science and some continuity. Marvel characters had personalities that made them seem real. Marvel really kicked in with the quality art too, Romita and Steranko turned out some great covers.

 

Somewhere along the way DC figured out it might be nice to try something for people 16 and over, and Batman and Detective started to have better written stories and much more of an edge. I'm not sure where this happened though, I think somewhere in the 15 cent covers.

 

Some of the DC horror was OK though too.

 

The interesting thing is that you almost see the reverse playing out now with some of the Marvel stalwarts like FF and Spidey where the characters have become stale for more than a decade now (even longer in FFs case - not much to get excited about since the 80s Byrne run). The Avengers is continually needing to be reinvented in order to try to stay interesting/relevant (but based on the number of restarts, it is likely fading) and the X-Men really got messed up in the early 90s and is arbuably still not back to its peak (I dropped the two main books a year or two after the split as the whole X-family of titles started getting too convoluted).

 

That being said, it is more due to the creative talent the companies have on board than anything. Right now DC has several solid books thanks to getting talent behind them that are trying to evolve the characters (although I still think Morrison is screwing up Batman royally) while JoeQ is not doing as much development at Marvel. Granted, DC has a long way to go to catch up, but if they keep moving things forward creatively while JoeQ stays the course then they will likely overtake Marvel again.

[Sal]

Since you've admitted you don't read them much at all, there's really not much point in discussing them, other than to say, Silver Age Marvels are much, much higher quality than Silver Age DCs when it comes to their function as reading material.

 

To dismiss it all as derivative drivel would be a disservice. That would be like saying Catcher in the Rye is junk because you read it as an adult, when the reality is, Catcher in the Rye is aimed squarely at the 15-18 year old crowd, when life takes on a flavor that makes CITR far more evocative than it would your average 37 year old. I know when I read it as a 16 year old, it said everything I wanted to say, in words I could never come up with on my own. I read it a few years ago, in my mid-30's, and all I could think was "Man, doesn't this kid ever stop whining...?"

 

So a lot of it has to do with when one was exposed to it. Marvels were written for literate 10-12 year olds...DCs weren't even written for idiotic 5 year olds

 

Yeah, sorry, but for a guy who stands firm on specificity and logic, you've made a really, really, really widespread - and patently false - claim here that i really can't let stand.

 

 

DC superhero books can be cleanly divided into two camps; books written for kids, and books written for young adults. the Batman and Superman lines were not all that suited for young teenagers, yes. Zebra Bat-Man, Bat-Mite, the Lois Lane books, the Jimmy Olsen books, World's Finest, all of them are hard to read if you're not approaching them from a whimsical and nostalgic viewpoint.

 

but to say that DCs weren't even written for "idiotic 5 year olds" really exposes a gross negligence of the full line of DC books in the Silver Age, and specifically a lack of specificity.

 

pick up a copy of Hawkman, Atom, Green Lantern, Mystery In Space. no, these books aren't written for the typical teen-ager with a head full of angst and rebellion against authority. but to say they are written for 5 year olds is a stretch. the secondary lines of DC books in the Silver Age were written from a "Sci-Fi" viewpoint and their plot devices and even the heroes themselves are firmly planted in that vein. furthermore, DC books were specifically designed to be absorbed in a single seating, with stories that resolved themselves in one or two pamphlets. the Marvel style of having plots and subplots that carried for months and even years was something DC chose not to do, but i don't think it was because they weren't aiming for a teen-age reader.

 

were a lot of Silver Age DC stories simplistic? sure. but there are a lot of complicated scenarios, language, concepts and situations in Silver Age DCs that your overly simplistic statement fails to address.

 

 

[fantastic_four]

The interesting thing is that you almost see the reverse playing out now with some of the Marvel stalwarts like FF and Spidey where the characters have become stale for more than a decade now (even longer in FFs case - not much to get excited about since the 80s Byrne run).

 

As a fan of both the classic issues and the more recent newsstand issues from the last decade I can confidently say that you're wrong--both Spidey and FF have had some memorable runs and some decent popularity within the last ten years. Ultimate Spider-Man and Ultimate Fantastic Four were big successes for a period of time, and back in the main universe titles, Stracynzski had a great run on Spider-Man and Waid/Wieringo had a terrific run on Fantastic Four cut short by a famous feud between Waid and the then-President Bill Jemas when Jemas was interfering creatively with the title and ticked Waid off enough for him to quit...after which Jemas got moved by Marvel to a different position where he wouldn't have any more creative input. I bought and read the Byrne run off the stands in the 1980s, and the Waid/Wieringo run was at least as good as Byrne's in terms of story and art quality.

[fantastic_four]

4. Fantastic Four 1. My first surprise. I didn't realize how tough FF 1 is in high-grade. But with only 8 copies at 9.0 or higher, this is the rarest Marvel key in high-grade.

 

I knew, which is why SAGAT saying that Overstreet valuing it above ASM #1 is so ludicrous when in reality Overstreet is UNDER-documenting the actual market prices that FF #1 garners. The book goes for triple what equivalently-graded ASM #1 copies do because it's at least three times rarer in high grade. Had you taken the range you looked at down to 8.0 you would've seen roughly the same patterns of rarity as you do at the 9.0 and up level.

 

I think most people are completely unaware that even today, Fantastic Four sells more Silver Age back issues than any Marvel or DC title except Spidey. FF #1 sells for about 20% - 30% less than AF15 copies in the same grade, although I fully expect that the AF15 will leave it farther behind as time goes on, as the only reason they're close now is specifically due to the greater rarity of FF #1. Certainly the demand for and popularity of Spider-Man is much greater and the prices on AF #15 will eventually reflect that.

[ChasingKingKirby]

4. Fantastic Four 1. My first surprise. I didn't realize how tough FF 1 is in high-grade. But with only 8 copies at 9.0 or higher, this is the rarest Marvel key in high-grade.

 

I knew, which is why SAGAT saying that Overstreet valuing it above ASM #1 is so ludicrous when in reality Overstreet is UNDER-documenting the actual market prices that FF #1 garners. The book goes for triple what equivalently-graded ASM #1 copies do because it's at least three times rarer in high grade. Had you taken the range you looked at down to 8.0 you would've seen roughly the same patterns of rarity as you do at the 9.0 and up level.

 

I think most people are completely unaware that even today, Fantastic Four sells more Silver Age back issues than any Marvel or DC title except Spidey. FF #1 sells for about 20% - 30% less than AF15 copies in the same grade, although I fully expect that the AF15 will leave it farther behind as time goes on, as the only reason they're close now is specifically due to the greater rarity of FF #1. Certainly the demand for and popularity of Spider-Man is much greater and the prices on AF #15 will eventually reflect that.

 

Actually, the top spot as far as rarity for Marvel keys in 7.0 to 8.5 is Hulk 1. FF 1 is second and JIM 83 is 3rd. (I did extrapolate, I just didn't post it, if anyone is interested, I'll be happy to post.)

 

And, I agree 100%, I'll take a FF1 over a ASM 1 every time when all things are equal. Price, grade, etc.