Ayn, Neal and the world around me...

[namisgr]

Think the Founding Fathers ever envisioned 400 million Americans and covered all contingencies for same?

 

 

In cases of Liberty vs. Legislated Protection or the will of the Collective good will; I will choose Liberty.

 

Bankers unleashed. Civil rights restricted. There are side effects that are quite profound.

 

Maybe Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac can take over everything for us. Go Feds, go!!!!!!!

 

Glad you're behind providing liberty to Bank of America and HSBC 110%.

[seanfingh]

Think the Founding Fathers ever envisioned 400 million Americans and covered all contingencies for same?

 

 

In cases of Liberty vs. Legislated Protection or the will of the Collective good will; I will choose Liberty.

 

Bankers unleashed. Civil rights restricted. There are side effects that are quite profound.

 

Maybe Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac can take over everything for us. Go Feds, go!!!!!!!

 

Glad you're behind providing liberty to Bank of America and HSBC 110%.

 

I don't have all the answers, Bob, but I will always come down on the side that believes that expanded (and, where we appear to be headed, unmitigated) federal authority is bad for the union and bad for the individual.

[namisgr]

There we can agree, that unchecked and unmitigated Federal authority is very bad.

[dover]

Think the Founding Fathers ever envisioned 400 million Americans and covered all contingencies for same?

 

 

In cases of Liberty vs. Legislated Protection or the will of the Collective good will; I will choose Liberty.

 

Bankers unleashed. There are side effects that are quite profound.

 

Maybe Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac can take over everything for us. Go Feds, go!!!!!!!

 

Bankers unleashed?

 

So Fannie and Freddie were holding a large bag of money (our money), prodded by their protectors (and benefactors) to lend regardless and it is the bankers who are to blame?

 

Only in America.

 

 

I always ask, "if they did not think they could make money, why would they have bought and sold such items? If they feared losing their assests or being held accountable, would they have done it?"

 

Answer: because there was a pool of money to be tapped whose goal was to create the model citizen. It was again the regulated and controlled by the elected system, funded by the tax payer, that went awry. They knew we would come to their rescue.

 

Conclusion: there is no place for social engineering of the governed by men who are obviously not angels.

 

Seek liberty and its protection, not the development of the voter to a mold created by the elected to serve their power.

 

Funny, in the end, they were told don't worry do anything you want you will simply get bailed out of the problem. Funding failure and bad practice; wonder why that was not in the top ten?

 

 

 

 

[namisgr]

Matt Taibbi. I'm sure you'll hate him.

 

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/bank-of-america-too-crooked-to-fail-20120314

[namisgr]

Conclusion: there is no place for social engineering of the governed by men who are obviously not angels.

 

The Civil Rights movement would beg to differ.

 

Unbridled 'liberty' for the enfranchised and empowered (the "liberty to take advantage of") comes at the expense of liberty for all.

[cheetah]

Conclusion: there is no place for social engineering of the governed by men who are obviously not angels.

 

The Civil Rights movement would beg to differ.

 

Unbridled 'liberty' for the enfranchised and empowered (the "liberty to take advantage of") comes at the expense of liberty for all.

 

An undeniable right of citizens under a government is their protection from the greed and villainy of the powerful and immoral.

[dover]

Think the Founding Fathers ever envisioned 400 million Americans and covered all contingencies for same?

 

 

In cases of Liberty vs. Legislated Protection or the will of the Collective good will; I will choose Liberty.

 

Bankers unleashed. Civil rights restricted. There are side effects that are quite profound.

 

Maybe Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac can take over everything for us. Go Feds, go!!!!!!!

 

Glad you're behind providing liberty to Bank of America and HSBC 110%.

 

I don't have all the answers, Bob, but I will always come down on the side that believes that expanded (and, where we appear to be headed, unmitigated) federal authority is bad for the union and bad for the individual.

 

Hear hear!!

 

 

 

 

 

[dover]

Conclusion: there is no place for social engineering of the governed by men who are obviously not angels.

 

The Civil Rights movement would beg to differ.

 

Unbridled 'liberty' for the enfranchised and empowered (the "liberty to take advantage of") comes at the expense of liberty for all.

 

An undeniable right of citizens under a government is their protection from the greed and villainy of the powerful and immoral.

 

 

We each have different villains.

 

The unalienable rights of the citizen do not come from or under the Government; they are protected by it. The extent of this protection is a clear line in the sand as to which level of Liberty you are willing to sacrifice. In my mind the Federal Government should never have been allowed to set up the bag of money to be used to secure voting shares as well as houses and the good citizen.

 

Prosecute the banks, please do. The trail of Fiat will end at Fannie and behind the door will be a long list of elected officials cowering in fear and claiming to be doing the good will of the people. The banks have been protected all along; not the people. The banks were simply selling the line of the elected; buy a house regardless of ability or income. The story, as usual starts with the Collective good will and ends with the lawful and able paying the bill both into and out of the malaise.

 

The people should be protected by laws such that when a business does wrong, the business is fined, jailed or prosecuted. The consumer, armed and educated, should be the fear of the seller instead they have no fear because of their Uncle Sam. If the banks feared for their wrong doings, they would not have done it. They did not because they bed with the very people assigned to protect our rights.

 

True, at times even the best intentioned business goes astray. Nothing is perfect, only the continued pursuit of Liberty and freedom will keep us from the servitude better left to serfdom. We can only hope that there is some form of penalty not yet doled out.

 

 

You fear the open exchange of product for property. I fear the hidden agenda of the good will of the Collective intended to protect me from the very nature of the beast.

 

If men were angels......

 

 

[cheetah]

 

The people should be protected by laws such that when a business does wrong, the business is fined, jailed or prosecuted. The consumer, armed and educated, should be the fear of the seller instead they have no fear because of their Uncle Sam. If the banks feared for their wrong doings, they would not have done it. They did not because they bed with the very people assigned to protect our rights.

 

True, at times even the best intentioned business goes astray. Nothing is perfect, only the continued pursuit of Liberty and freedom will keep us from the servitude better left to serfdom. We can only hope that there is some form of penalty not yet doled out.

 

 

You fear the open exchange of product for property. I fear the hidden agenda of the good will of the Collective intended to protect me from the very nature of the beast.

 

If men were angels......

 

 

I do not disagree with this. Citizens United seal the fate of future elections being won by the people with the most money and support of the financial elite. Unfortunately, these 'people' do not share the same moral code with most average Americans and will do anything and everything necessary to line their own pockets with other people's money. This includes greed, graft, larceny, and purchasing of politicians. Now they get to purchase politicians legally and anonymously. Whether you think this is a failing of government or the selection of an elite ruling class by an unelected and partisanly-chosen jurdiciary doesn't eliminate the fact that our system of government has been irrevocably changed to favor the immoral, wealthy and powerful. There is no 'free market.' You only have the market chosen for you. From my view, this is the ultimate end result of all free markets that do not include adequate protection for the consumer.

[TupennyConan]

Can't believe I read the last two pages. Y'all knew everything written & had made your choices decades ago but you continue here & now with the repetition.

 

Nieil.

 

[dover]

Can't believe I read the last two pages. Y'all knew everything written & had made your choices decades ago but you continue here & now with the repetition.

 

Nieil.

 

You should have been at the convention.

 

 

 

 

There are only lesser degrees of freedom; nothing else.

 

[TupennyConan]

The US K = quaint, antiquated, shortsighted, & inadequate. This would include its fundamentals.

[TupennyConan]

Also, racism. Always racism.

[TupennyConan]

I don't bother to elocute on the merits because I can't stand in the company of today's learned gents. Instead I show-up & high-hat the subject matter in a showy display of intellectual snobbery.

 

Please, don't let my bs chill the debate.

 

 

[dover]

Being part of the 51%, I had to stop and work for awhile.

 

 

 

 

Often reminded of thoughts from the collective:

 

"Come inside this cell and be safe. We will feed you, cloth you, care for you and protect you. We are all in here together."

 

 

[dover]

Also, racism. Always racism.

 

That word has been warped beyond recognition. It is no longer a definition but rather a slogan, fully owned by those that it was meant to protect and lift.

 

Sad.

 

Now, if you want to speak of prejudice.....

 

 

[dover]

 

The people should be protected by laws such that when a business does wrong, the business is fined, jailed or prosecuted. The consumer, armed and educated, should be the fear of the seller instead they have no fear because of their Uncle Sam. If the banks feared for their wrong doings, they would not have done it. They did not because they bed with the very people assigned to protect our rights.

 

True, at times even the best intentioned business goes astray. Nothing is perfect, only the continued pursuit of Liberty and freedom will keep us from the servitude better left to serfdom. We can only hope that there is some form of penalty not yet doled out.

 

 

You fear the open exchange of product for property. I fear the hidden agenda of the good will of the Collective intended to protect me from the very nature of the beast.

 

If men were angels......

 

 

I do not disagree with this. Citizens United seal the fate of future elections being won by the people with the most money and support of the financial elite. Unfortunately, these 'people' do not share the same moral code with most average Americans and will do anything and everything necessary to line their own pockets with other people's money. This includes greed, graft, larceny, and purchasing of politicians. Now they get to purchase politicians legally and anonymously. Whether you think this is a failing of government or the selection of an elite ruling class by an unelected and partisanly-chosen jurdiciary doesn't eliminate the fact that our system of government has been irrevocably changed to favor the immoral, wealthy and powerful. There is no 'free market.' You only have the market chosen for you. From my view, this is the ultimate end result of all free markets that do not include adequate protection for the consumer.

 

 

 

 

Great point, which is why I so vehemently want to reign it in; not feed it more, starve its power, limit its reach and ability to be bought.

 

States rights, limited federal government, individual liberty, life and happiness. There is a document some where I am sure, on this exact subject and form of governing.

 

I blame Lincoln.

 

 

[TupennyConan]

I blame Lincoln.

 

 

[TupennyConan]

Nieaeil.