The G.I. Joe #1 Large Staple Variant Mystery

[RockMyAmadeus]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history),

 

If you have facts that contradict the current conventional wisdom, it's your obligation to "argue"...don't leave the community in the dark. (thumbs u

 

but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts.

 

Thems ain't the facts without documentation...

 

I'm very familiar with the American Comics Ads...and don't recall a #3-5 "second printing" listing. Point me to a book with that/those ad/s.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations.

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price.

 

Except this makes little sense. If we go just by cover price, here's the order of later printings (known):

 

60 cent covers, which MUST occur sometime after 5/84 (and before 4/85?) cover date:

 

#3 (?)

#7

#10

#17

#18

#19

#21 (2nd AND 3rd)

#25

#29

#30

 

65 cent covers, which apparently occur between 4/85 and 2/86?:

 

#14

#23

#29 (3rd)

 

75 cent covers, which apparently occur after 2/86?:

 

#2

#5 (?)

#6

#8

#11

#12

#26

#27

 

The second and third print #29s are the most interesting. The second has a 60 cent cover, but it was originally printed with a Dec 1984 cover date. That means, in the four months in between 60 and 65 cents (and Joes went up to 75 cents), this one book had a single second printing, then sometime after that, and before Feb 1986 cover date, had a 3rd.

 

 

Doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

I find evidence of a #3 with a 60 cent cover price, printed before May 1984, and a #5 75 cent cover price (not Canadian [?]), also printed before May, 1984. All the rest were printed AFTER that cover date, as they all have black costume Spidey heads.

 

But to state that the reprints coincide with the standard Marvel pricing at the time means they first reprinted 3, 7, 10, 17-19, 21, 25, 29-30....THEN, after cover prices changed to 65 cents (and the title went directly to 75 cents with #34), #14, 23, and 29 were reprinted, making those the only 65 cent Joes to exist, first, second, OR third, then, a minimum of 10 months later, 2/86, they reprint #2, 6, 8, 11, 12, 26, and 27?

 

We know #2, 26 and 27 were 3-packed together, and this is the most common still extant 3-pack.

 

But why the seemingly utterly random...and widely spaced...reprint schedule...? And how do the later 2nd printings fit into this?

 

 

The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out.

 

Nor, apparently, #7 either.

 

This #5 contradicts your theory:

 

 

Note 75 cent price (printed AFTER 2/86), but regular Spidey head (printed BEFORE 5/84.)

 

Which is it? It's not the Canadian newsstand, or the Spidey head wouldn't be there...or IS it the Canadian, and they made a mistake in Sparta...?

 

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but...

 

...what?

 

They're the same thing.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history), but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations.

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price. The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out.

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but...

 

hmmm - re-writing history you are! If this is true there are dozens (probably more than 100) of 2nd prints out there CGC graded as first prints.

 

Oddly enough (15 to 20 years ago) I was always under the impression that there was a difference between 1st print and 2nd print between the box and the diamond price price area... I know I heard that somewhere back in the mid-80's. Then when I got into CGC comics I noticed that they did not note any differences between the two so I naturally thought I was wrong.

 

I have multiple copies of each at home and can't wait to get home now and do a page by page ad comparison of each of them. Is there any chance that it could still be first print and contain different ads??? I believe I've seen comics with different rear cover ads that were both first print.

 

And I'm not saying I don't believe you but how could this information be confirmed? Because places like CGC and Overstreet sure think the 2 are the same...

 

Interesting stuff...

 

No, there aren't dozens or more than a 100 of 2nd prints that CGC grades as first prints. 2nd and later printing Joes are, for the most part, very easily differentiated.

 

Know this: if you have a standard Direct Market copy which bears the standard diamond (#2, 3) or Marvel "M" (#4-on), with the standard pricing for the month and year the comic was first released, they are 1st prints, whether Direct Market, newsstand, or Canadian newsstand. I'd say 100%, but there's always a little wiggle room, so I'll say 99.99999364% The only exception to that rule is #7.

 

First printing, Direct Market:

 

 

First printing, newsstand:

 

 

First printing, Canadian:

 

 

Second printing:

 

 

And know this: if you have a UPC code, it's a first printing, guaranteed (now watch someone post an exception )

 

[Silent Master]

That's the conventional wisdom alright!

(and I didn't say there WERE dozens of 2nd prints graded as first prints - I said IF this was true - in an attempt to show the impact of the claim)

 

And I would agree completely that all the "2nd" prints I'm aware of have no UPC code.

 

Like I said I wish I was home so I could pull out the actual comics and research this myself but that's not going to happen for a couple months!

 

So basically we are looking at several variant covers of 1st prints on some - The diamond price (newsstand and direct), the box price (newsstand and direct), and the canadian variant price (Did the canadian price version have both a newsstand AND direct version??) but all first print run books... which is how I've always understood it (in my adult life at least).

 

So the question is WHY did they print the different diamond and box price books anyway??? There had to be a purpose...

 

[JediTrix]

Perhaps this is the wrong place to ask, but I've long been curious on how to tell the difference between 1st, 2nd and 3rd prints of the Transformers series. And by tell the differences, I mean exactly what ads were in what version. I know they're different between the printings, but I don't know which ads are for which print.

[JediTrix]

I've always relied on this chart for Joe reprint.

 

http://www.yojoe.com/comics/joe/GI%20Joe%20Marvel%20Variants(2).pdf

[RockMyAmadeus]

That's the conventional wisdom alright!

(and I didn't say there WERE dozens of 2nd prints graded as first prints - I said IF this was true - in an attempt to show the impact of the claim)

 

And I would agree completely that all the "2nd" prints I'm aware of have no UPC code.

 

Like I said I wish I was home so I could pull out the actual comics and research this myself but that's not going to happen for a couple months!

 

So basically we are looking at several variant covers of 1st prints on some - The diamond price (newsstand and direct), the box price (newsstand and direct), and the canadian variant price (Did the canadian price version have both a newsstand AND direct version??)

 

No. The DM version for all Marvels contained both the Canadian and UK prices, so there was no need to print a special cover for the Canadian DM.

 

The diamond only exists for issues #1-3, coinciding with the change in 10/82 companywide to the "M" format. Diamonds are Direct Market. Conversely, the "box" prices, at least for first prints, are all newsstand copies, whether US or Canadian.

 

but all first print run books... which is how I've always understood it (in my adult life at least).

 

So the question is WHY did they print the different diamond and box price books anyway??? There had to be a purpose...

 

I thought that was already answered...DM, newsstand, Canadian newsstand.

[joecgcmaniac]

 

#3-5 were never reprinted. #2 and #6 are the earliest Joe 2nd prints

 

Actually they were the earliest of the reprints but "2nd printing" was never listed anywhere on them. The reprints came out around the same time issue #11 hit the stands

 

Please document this. (And no, this isn't sarcasm or an attempt to be snide, I really would like to know where this information is found.)

 

I question your timing, because #11 was long before these became "hot", and thus, no need for reprints.

 

and they have different back covers and ads because of it.

 

That is correct...but if they came out around 11, they should have the same ads as those boks cover dated May 1983,.

 

The easy way to tell a first printing direct edition of #3 is to look for the diamond in the price box like this:

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/GI-G-I-JOE-MARVEL-COMIC-3-FIRST-PRINT-MDV-/370144903078?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

 

The 2nd printing had an "M" in the price box like in this lot:

http://cgi.ebay.com/G-JOE-3-5-30-2nd-Printing-2-Lot-4-Fine-VF-/320484289623?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0

 

That's the only picture I've ever seen on an "M" #3. Mile High doesn't show one, and neither does Lonestar. A cursory glance through eBay doesn't show it either.

 

Please provide a better picture of a "2nd printing #3" (because, as joe pointed out, there didn't seem to be a 2nd printing of #3-5...though, oddly enough, Mile High has a picture of a 75 cent #5 but with a Direct UPC box....

 

minutiae

 

The other easy way to tell 2md printings of those issues is that all the issues did not have the color coding at the top of the inside pages like Marvel books did at the time.

 

Yes, because the books were printed specifically for 3-packs.

 

Silent Master's CGC 9.8 #3 is the "M" version of the cover (thumbs u

[RockMyAmadeus]

Pics, pics! If I had seen that, I would have gone buzzonkers!

 

Post a pic!

[joecgcmaniac]

Pics, pics! If I had seen that, I would have gone buzzonkers!

 

Post a pic!

 

check his registry!

 

 

I'm too lazy to link it!

[RockMyAmadeus]

I don't know how to do the registry stuff.

[joecgcmaniac]

Silent Master's #3 CGC 9.8

 

[/img]

[Silent Master]

Sure enough - I have a #3 first print Direct Edition with an M price box and don't quote me on this but I'm fairly sure I have the same thing with issue #1 as well as a direct diamond price box.

 

Again I wish I was going to be home sometime in the next 6 weeks so I could double check!

[joecgcmaniac]

Sure enough - I have a #3 first print Direct Edition with an M price box and don't quote me on this but I'm fairly sure I have the same thing with issue #1 as well as a direct diamond price box.

 

Again I wish I was going to be home sometime in the next 6 weeks so I could double check!

 

We won't quote ya, since there are NO #1's with the "M" price box (thumbs u

[joecgcmaniac]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history), but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts. Your first mistake was using American Comics ads as gospel. You'd be better off believing Chuck and Mile High Issue #3 is the only issue with both diamond and M price boxes. 4 & 5 only have the M direct box. Most likely #3 was printing as Marvel was making the price box changes, so both versions exist.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations. You cannot compare Albedo with G.I. Joe. CGC may have missed a few Albedos but to say they screwed up over 127 Joe #3s?

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price. The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out. Find me 4 & 5 with the diamond price box. Wait, you can't they don't exist.

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but... Sorry, I was also actively collecting the Joe books in the 80's and have a ton of them still. To say they are 2nd prints with no evidence but old American Comics ads as evidence, when CGC, collectors and everyone else thinks of them as 1st prints is frankly

[Silent Master]

Sure enough - I have a #3 first print Direct Edition with an M price box and don't quote me on this but I'm fairly sure I have the same thing with issue #1 as well as a direct diamond price box.

 

Again I wish I was going to be home sometime in the next 6 weeks so I could double check!

 

We won't quote ya, since there are NO #1's with the "M" price box (thumbs u

 

 

Okie dokey!!!

[RockMyAmadeus]

Silent Master's #3 CGC 9.8

 

[/img]

 

 

Scan me the back cover.

 

I don't know what to make of this book. It's the only 9/82 Marvel M I've ever seen....and the diamond already exists. I know it *could* be a transition book, but there are no other Marvel books like this at all, so that leans against that theory.

 

If I was a betting man, I'd say this is a later printing, a la #7.

 

Just a hunch. Could be totally wrong. But I imagine it's not a first print.

 

Regardless, seeing a book I didn't know existed from the 80's is an uber thrill.

[RockMyAmadeus]

I hope Comiconxion posts with info...

[RockMyAmadeus]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history), but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts. Your first mistake was using American Comics ads as gospel. You'd be better off believing Chuck and Mile High Issue #3 is the only issue with both diamond and M price boxes. 4 & 5 only have the M direct box. Most likely #3 was printing as Marvel was making the price box changes, so both versions exist.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations. You cannot compare Albedo with G.I. Joe. CGC may have missed a few Albedos but to say they screwed up over 127 Joe #3s?

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price. The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out. Find me 4 & 5 with the diamond price box. Wait, you can't they don't exist.

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but... Sorry, I was also actively collecting the Joe books in the 80's and have a ton of them still. To say they are 2nd prints with no evidence but old American Comics ads as evidence, when CGC, collectors and everyone else thinks of them as 1st prints is frankly

Learn how to quote, newb!

 

[joecgcmaniac]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history), but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts. Your first mistake was using American Comics ads as gospel. You'd be better off believing Chuck and Mile High Issue #3 is the only issue with both diamond and M price boxes. 4 & 5 only have the M direct box. Most likely #3 was printing as Marvel was making the price box changes, so both versions exist.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations. You cannot compare Albedo with G.I. Joe. CGC may have missed a few Albedos but to say they screwed up over 127 Joe #3s?

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price. The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out. Find me 4 & 5 with the diamond price box. Wait, you can't they don't exist.

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but... Sorry, I was also actively collecting the Joe books in the 80's and have a ton of them still. To say they are 2nd prints with no evidence but old American Comics ads as evidence, when CGC, collectors and everyone else thinks of them as 1st prints is frankly

Learn how to quote, newb!

 

 

learn how to work the registry

[RockMyAmadeus]

Don't want to argue here (or re-write history), but if you look back at old American Comics ads from the 80's and price guides, you'll find that the versions of 3-5 I describe have long been documented as 2nd printings. They came from 3 packs, and have ads that didn't come out until months later. Thems the facts. Your first mistake was using American Comics ads as gospel. You'd be better off believing Chuck and Mile High Issue #3 is the only issue with both diamond and M price boxes. 4 & 5 only have the M direct box. Most likely #3 was printing as Marvel was making the price box changes, so both versions exist.

 

CGC can be wrong. Check out other posts on Albedo #0! They've marked 2nd and 3rd printings as 1st printings without any notations. You cannot compare Albedo with G.I. Joe. CGC may have missed a few Albedos but to say they screwed up over 127 Joe #3s?

 

The reason that the 3-5 reprints had 60 cent cover prices is because they came out when other books still had a 60 cent cover price. The reason the later ones had a higher cover price is becuase Marvel raised the cover price of books and it reflected the cover price at the time. And, the black Spidey wasn't being used when the 3-5 reprints came out. Find me 4 & 5 with the diamond price box. Wait, you can't they don't exist.

 

Now, the Transformers #3 with a different back cover that came from 3 packs is a different story. That has the same back cover as issue #2. So, you could argue that was a first printing - printed before the newsstand editions.

 

Sorry - I was there in the 80's and actively collected the Joe books back then. Call them 3 pack editions that came out months after the newsstand editions, or later printings if you like, but... Sorry, I was also actively collecting the Joe books in the 80's and have a ton of them still. To say they are 2nd prints with no evidence but old American Comics ads as evidence, when CGC, collectors and everyone else thinks of them as 1st prints is frankly

Learn how to quote, newb!

 

 

learn how to work the registry

 

Who posts in the registry...?

 

(thumbs u