Anyone using BCW's Comic Book Extenders?

[ComicDoc]

Hi,

 

Was wondering if anyone else was using the BCW Comic Extenders? Also if anyone had anything good or bad to say about them?

 

Here is some more information about them:

 

The BCW Comic Book Extenders will help prevent yellowing, retards the aging process, and absorbs and neutralizes the contaminants in comic book pages. These 10 mil sheets go inside the book, next to the paper and inkone fourth of the way in from the front and back covers, only two sheets per book are necessary!

 

Combined with our 2 or 4 mil BCW Comic Mylar Bags and our BCW Certified Acid Free Backing Boards for stiffness and proven acid- neutralizing quality, you can't do any better to preserve your valuable collection. BCW Comic Book Extenders will extend the life of your comic and are an inexpensive alternative without sacrificing quality protection.

 

- Helps prevent yellowing

- Slows the Aging Process

- Absorbs and Neutralizes Contaminants

- 10 mil thick sheets and Coated on 2 sides

- Only two sheets per book are necessary!

- Use with BCW Current Poly & Mylar Bags

 

 

[Stronguy]

Didn't we just talk about this?

 

[DiceX]

I use Extenze on my comics. In just a few months they turn into Treasury Editions.

 

 

[mschmidt]

We were - but it's an easy question with a simple answer: avoid like the plague.

 

 

[ComicDoc]

We were - but it's an easy question with a simple answer: avoid like the plague.

 

 

These are not the same thing as the acid free backer boards these go inside the book and are suppose to neutralize similar to the ones bill cole also sells (Life-X-Tenders Plus) or microchamber do you have any references about these products? I could not find them on the page that you posted reference the wood and was wondering if there was any information specific to these items?

 

 

[mschmidt]

We were - but it's an easy question with a simple answer: avoid like the plague.

 

 

These are not the same thing as the acid free backer boards these go inside the book and are suppose to neutralize similar to the ones bill cole also sells (Life-X-Tenders Plus) or microchamber do you have any references about these products? I could not find them on the page that you posted reference the wood and was wondering if there was any information specific to these items?

 

 

The BCW Extenders supposedly work like microchamber paper (the same paper CGC inserts in each slabbed book) which serves to neutralize the acids that are released as the paper in a comic book ages.

 

But where microchamber paper is a thin, almost-translucent sheet of paper, BCW Extenders are rigid boards almost as thick as a regular backing board. Inserting something with the heft of a regular backing board multiple places in a comic book is a recipe for disaster - over time, the BCW extenders are certain to cause undue strain on the staples which can lead to the staples popping through the paper. They're an absolutely awful product, and, quite honestly, it baffles my mind that BCW still continues to market them.

 

Life-X-Tenders Plus are 9mil thick (compared to the 10mil thickness of the BCW Extenders) which means that they're still too thick as well - no matter what Bill Cole says.

 

There's no reason to give either of these two products a second glance - just use regular, ol' microchamber paper and you'll do just fine.

 

Oh, and btw, BCW's "acid-free" backing boards aren't acid-free by any stretch of the imagination - the only true acid-free boards on the market are the half-backs/full-backs sold by E Gerber and the Thin-X-Tenders, Thick-X-Tenders & Life-X-Tenders sold by Bill Cole :thumbsup:

[ComicDoc]

Mschmidt,

 

Thank you once again for a very insightful and informative answer. I have used mylars and acid free boxes since the 80’s and I am always looking to improve the way I store and preserve my books.

 

I did have the same concerned and wonder about the board thickness and whether it could possibly strain the staples and cause a “pop” which would be a bigger issue than the aging process that I wanted to person_having_a_hard_time_understanding_my_point (slow down).

 

The boards are definitely thinner than backer boards but are much thicker than microchamber paper. I tried them originally because I have not been able to find at decent prices until I found that "Frame it again Sam" does sell them at a decent price (but a lot more than the extenders). Do you have any other suggestions for purchasing microchamber papers?

 

I did correspond with the person who was supposed to be the technical expert on the boards and this was his response:

 

Hi Buddy

 

Our product

 

. Prevents yellowing

. Prevents acids, mold, & mildew

. Reacts to corrosive gases

 

 

According to the Royal Art Salon

 

"Bienfang Acid Free Board

This specialty Board is totally acid-free. This product features facing

paper with a ph between 7.7 and 8.5. It's also made with a calcium carbonate

buffer that provides many years of protection against pollutants that cause

paper to become weak, brittle or yellow with age."

 

Our Extenders are coated with calcium carbonate on both sides. I have our

products tested when they arrive here from the mills. I run three test

"Elmendorf tear test", a hot extraction pH test, and an Alkaline Reserve

Test. At the lab the samples are conditioned to standard TAPPI temperature

of 73 F and 50% relative humidity. During the last test done in Aug, 2006

we tested Our Standard Board (Current and Silver), Extenders (Silver), and a

competitive board from the major distributor of current comic books boards.

 

Acidity Alkalinity, Hot Extraction, TAPPI T-435 (pH)

BCW Silver Extender 8.35 pH

BCW Current Board 8.01 pH

Competitive Board 7.75 pH

 

Alkaline Reserve, ASTM D-4988-96 (%)

BCW Silver Extender 10.04 %

BCW Current Board 4.36 %

Competitive Board 3.69 %

 

Alkaline reserve. Nearly all alkaline paper contains calcium carbonate as a

filler. The average paper contains at least 2% and occasionally as much as

30% filler by weight. The standard requires only 2%. This calcium carbonate,

an alkaline reserve, keeps the pH of paper and board from declining as time

goes on. Even alkaline papers will eventually become acidic, without an

alkaline reserve.

 

Ours cost $3.40 for 200 theirs $186.00 for 200...Gee maybe I should raise my

price. I would test some else board but they are to expensive.

 

Thanks

 

Dana Kellum

Manager Internet Sales

 

I would be very interested in your thoughts on his explanation as you have a much greater depth of knowledge in this area than I do.

 

Bernard

[CKB]

What boards are $186 for 200?

[mschmidt]

What boards are $186 for 200?

 

I'm assuming that Dana is referring to the Life-X-Tenders Plus manufactured by Bill Cole - they're $132 for 200 on the BCEMylar website ... which is insane.

[mschmidt]

My problem is solely with the thickness of the BCW extender itself - if they were selling it as a backing board, fair enough. But they're selling it as an insert, telling people that "these 10 mil sheets go inside the book, next to the paper and one fourth of the way in from the front and back covers" which, due to the weight of the board, is just a terrible idea.

 

In regards to their "current boards", however, they're being just as misleading as all the other standard backing board manufacturers - what they failed to mention is that the "8.01 pH" they measured on their current board is from testing the shiny (eg. coated) side. If they'd tested the other side of the board, the results would be very different.

 

Anyway ... if you're looking for other supplies of microchamber paper, I can recommend either PM'ing board member grinin or buying straight from http://www.conservationresources.com/ - both of those should be cheaper than Frame it Again, Sam.

[ComicDoc]

Thank you very much for your response and sage advice. I will PM grinin reference the Microchamber papers and look at conservation resources as well although if I remember correctly the latter only sells in very large sheets which have to be cut. I am not averse to cutting my own it is just a matter of space.

 

You have been very helpful and you advice comes at a perfect time as I am going to be inventorying, grading and re-bagging all my 20 K + books as my goal for 2011. I will definitely be using the MC papers in front and back.

 

I wonder if one extender in the center would be safe and add the added protection from creasing/bending and the neutralization without causing the staple stress? But being the worrier that I am I will probably just go with MC papers!

 

 

 

[Jeffro.]

I use Extenze on my comics. In just a few months they turn into Treasury Editions.

 

[InvstmntComcSuply]

The BCW extenders are NOTHING like microchamber paper or Bill Coles "life X-Tenders plus" anti-aging sheets.

 

My understanding from conversations with BCW is that their extenders are simply thinner solid bleached sulfate boards with Calcium Carbonate spray coated on both sides. There is nothing else to them. No proprietary or patented technologies to absorb pollutants or byproducts of deterioration, nothing.

 

All of the inherent drawbacks associated with BCW's standard boards are still present in their extenders. They do NOT have a 3% calcium carbonate buffer throughout and do NOT maintain a minimum pH of 8.5 throughout the board. They do NOT absorb and neutralize contaminants like microchamber paper. At best the CACO3 sprayed on the board might absorb some acid shortly after the board arrives from the mill, however, since it is sprayed on a standard SBS board it will soon lose its effectiveness as the SBS board itself becomes acidic over time.

 

Additionally the effectiveness of microchamber paper is not limited to absorbing acid that is already present in a book or even acid that forms in a book as it ages. Microchamber paper also absorbs pre-acidic by-products of deterioration and provides protection against oxidative and acid gaseous pollutants such as ozone (O3), oxides of nitrogen (NOx, NO, NO2), sulfur dioxide (SO2) as well as a great many other molecules which can harm collections. Such molecules pass unaffected through even the thickest buffered boards.

 

If you have a need for microchamber paper or any other questions regarding archival supplies, feel free to contact me via PM.

[mschmidt]

The BCW extenders are NOTHING like microchamber paper or Bill Coles "life X-Tenders plus" anti-aging sheets.

 

My understanding from conversations with BCW is that their extenders are simply thinner solid bleached sulfate boards with Calcium Carbonate spray coated on both sides. There is nothing else to them. No proprietary or patented technologies to absorb pollutants or byproducts of deterioration, nothing.

 

All of the inherent drawbacks associated with BCW's standard boards are still present in their extenders. They do NOT have a 3% calcium carbonate buffer throughout and do NOT maintain a minimum pH of 8.5 throughout the board. They do NOT absorb and neutralize contaminants like microchamber paper. At best the CACO3 sprayed on the board might absorb some acid shortly after the board arrives from the mill, however, since it is sprayed on a standard SBS board it will soon lose its effectiveness as the SBS board itself becomes acidic over time.

 

Additionally the effectiveness of microchamber paper is not limited to absorbing acid that is already present in a book or even acid that forms in a book as it ages. Microchamber paper also absorbs pre-acidic by-products of deterioration and provides protection against oxidative and acid gaseous pollutants such as ozone (O3), oxides of nitrogen (NOx, NO, NO2), sulfur dioxide (SO2) as well as a great many other molecules which can harm collections. Such molecules pass unaffected through even the thickest buffered boards.

 

If you have a need for microchamber paper or any other questions regarding archival supplies, feel free to contact me via PM.

 

That's what I thought as well, but ComicDoc's post makes it seem like the board BCW uses as the base for the Extenders is the Bienfang Acid Free Board. I use that exact board for framing - and it's a buffered-throughout, true acid-free board :shrug:

[InvstmntComcSuply]

If you note, the email does not actually state that any of BCW's products are made with Bienfang's acid free board. I think it is implied, just like a lot of their information is implied. And the bienfang information can be copy/pasted from all over the web.

 

Additionally, the paragraph starting with "Alkaline reserve..." was taken directly from the cool conservation website.

[InvstmntComcSuply]

In summary: I think the internet sales manager is more savy with copy/paste than pH, alkaline reserve and titrations.

[mschmidt]

Very true - guess I should have paid more attention before posting :doh:

[BCW Supplies]

The BCW Extenders supposedly work like microchamber paper (the same paper CGC inserts in each slabbed book) which serves to neutralize the acids that are released as the paper in a comic book ages. But where microchamber paper is a thin, almost-translucent sheet of paper, BCW Extenders are rigid boards almost as thick as a regular backing board. Inserting something with the heft of a regular backing board multiple places in a comic book is a recipe for disaster - over time, the BCW extenders are certain to cause undue strain on the staples which can lead to the staples popping through the paper. They're an absolutely awful product, and, quite honestly, it baffles my mind that BCW still continues to market them.

My problem is solely with the thickness of the BCW extender itself - if they were selling it as a backing board, fair enough. But they're selling it as an insert, telling people that "these 10 mil sheets go inside the book, next to the paper and one fourth of the way in from the front and back covers" which, due to the weight of the board, is just a terrible idea.

BCW Comic Extenders are a cost effective alternative to more expensive products. And, as Mike's independent study aptly demonstrates, they do absorb the residual acid that migrates from the pages of a comic book. BCW Comic Extenders are not "almost as thick as a regular backing board." BCW Comic Extenders are 10 mil in thickness and BCW Comic Backing Boards are 24 mil in thickness. That is not even half the thickness of regular comic backing boards. It should be noted that, to date, we have not received a complaint about staples popping through the paper. If anyone has evidence to the contrary we would like to hear from you.

 

In regards to their "current boards", however, they're being just as misleading as all the other standard backing board manufacturers - what they failed to mention is that the "8.01 pH" they measured on their current board is from testing the shiny (eg. coated) side. If they'd tested the other side of the board, the results would be very different.

The 8.01 pH measured using TAPPI T 435 was performed on the entire board and not the shiny side as Mike states. For a better understanding of the hot extraction method, here are the specifications for the test;

 

Standard: TAPPI

 

Method: T 435

 

Title: Hydrogen ion concentration (pH) of paper extracts (hot extraction method)

 

Overview

 

This method measures the hydrogen ion concentration, expressed in terms of pH, of an aqueous extract of paper obtained by hot extraction (unfiltered and extracted by boiling water for one hour). It may be applied to writing, printing and sized industrial paper, but it is not intended for unbuffered types such as electrical insulating and condenser papers. Values determined by this method will reflect changes resulting from heat-induced hydrolysis. Additives, such as those used in filled and coated papers can have an effect on the extract pH. The cold extraction method is described in TAPPI T 509, “Hydrogen Ion Concentration (pH) of Paper Extracts (Cold Extraction Method).” Surface pH measurement of paper is described in TAPPI T 529, “Surface pH Measurement of Paper.” pH determinations by the different methods are not comparable.

 

The pH determination measures the extent to which the paper alters the hydrogen-hydroxyl equilibrium of pure water. The pH (acidity) is important because of its effect on the permanence of the paper. Although the acidity may be determined as the amount of water soluble acidity by titration with alkali, the hydrogen ion concentration (pH) is more indicative of the stability of paper than is the total acidity.

 

Samples

 

This test is performed in duplicate. At least 5 sheets of paper should be submitted for each sample. Gloves should be worn when handling the papers. Do not include any papers touched with the fingers.

If anyone is interested in information about our products or testing methods please feel free to contact us directly. We will be happy to answer any questions you might have.