Heritage Auction Features Cool Resubbed Green River Daredevil #18 9.6

[Red Hook]

Presented for your entertainment without comment. The large scans are on purpose.

 

On your left:

 

CGC 9.4 #0028245006 graded on March 19, 2001 removed from the census as some unknown date. Sold on Heritage in March 2003 for $287.50

 

On your right:

 

CGC 9.6 #0072796012 graded on January 23, 2004. Currently on Heritage. Current price with BP added is $661.25. Price should jump more over the weekend at the floor auction in NYC.

 

Same book.

 

[supapimp]

that declares it! old label books have the possiblity for resub to a higher grade.

[namisgr]

Heritage strikes again.... It is impossible to be certain from the scans alone, but I wonder if the front cover was cleaned. The lack of transparency with Heritage auctions is disturbing in this regard, because there is no public disclosure of who won last year's auction on the 9.4 version of the book.

 

Cleaned, cleaned and pressed, or simply upgraded upon resubmission?

[sterlingcomics]

All of the above.

[Rip]

[Red Hook]

Open question to the CGC staff........if a book has been deemed to have been professionally pressed, even though there is no indication of that on the label because it is considered not restoration, would that information be in the graders notes? And would that info ever be made available to anyone other than the original submitter? ( I think I know the answer to that one.)

 

Thanks.

[FFB]

Hi Redhook,

 

From these pictures, I can't see that anything was done to the book. Maybe it was a borderline 9.4/9.6 on the original submission and just got luckier on the second submission?

[Red Hook]

I can go with that. I'd consider it an example of a successful and until-proven-otherwise legitimate resub. Just goes to show once again how subjective the grading process can be and how one step in grade can really effect the profit margins. And this isn't even a super expensive book.

[FFB]

And for what it's worth, this is why I am typically unwilling to pay huge multiples of guide for a 9.6 of a book that I intend to keep. I have done so in the past, but after seeing those Daredevil 9.8s that I bought recently, I am done with the mega-multiple bug. 9.0 or 9.4 is plenty for me as far as silver age goes.

 

I can go with that. I'd consider it an example of a successful and until-proven-otherwise legitimate resub. Just goes to show once again how subjective the grading process can be and how one step in grade can really effect the profit margins. And this isn't even a super expensive book.

[Red Hook]

Definitely in your camp FFB. You get more bang for your buck with an 8.0 to a 9.4, and 9.4 is stretching it. But again, it's personal preference. I'd rather buy two or three nice 9.2s then empty my wallet for a 9.6......which might have been a 9.4 in a previous incarnation anyway.

[jimm94]

Agreed, Redhook and Fantasy.

 

In many cases it's not just multiples of guide, it's multiples between grades!

 

In general, that's why I don't see the value of paying multiples more for only a .2 variance in grade on a book. Even on this pedigree book, I don't really think it's worth 3x more for the slightly higher grade.

 

Comic book grading is equal parts art and science - On any given day, a 9.4 could very well be graded a 9.6, etc... Or, vice-versa. Especially with CGC, we don't know exactly what criteria differentiates each grade. Collectors in our hobby sure spend a lot of money buying numbers that could easily equate to human error or subjective opinions!

[jbud73]

Yep after a few forays into the uber HG market, only on BA mind you. I have stopped my complaining over the insane prices brought on by the 9.6s. If theres a slabbed BA / SA book I want in HG I simply go and get a 9.0 or a 9.2. In most cases I challange anyone to see any drastic differences between these books and 9.4 / 9.6s. There are two differences in the tangeble world. the .2 numerical marking on a Label that costs about $2 to produce or less and alot of $$$$ that stay in my pocket. You can usually get a 9.0, or 9.2 slabbed for NM guide and I have zero problem paying that. If nothing else all of the examples that Red Hook, old guy and everyone else has thrown out there will tell you that the differences in the 9.2 to 9.6 range are so arbitrary that they are truly subjective in nature and have never shown and may never be consistently identified from book to book.

[sfilosa]

Definitely in your camp FFB. You get more bang for your buck with an 8.0 to a 9.4, and 9.4 is stretching it. But again, it's personal preference. I'd rather buy two or three nice 9.2s then empty my wallet for a 9.6......which might have been a 9.4 in a previous incarnation anyway.

 

 

Hey we argree on something!!!!

 

I do a trend analysis on most Silver-Age Marvel titles for all CGC sales between VF and NM. The grade that is increasing the fastest over the past 6 months has been NM- (9.2) books. I think collectors are starting to realize that a very nice 9.2 is probably a better deal than an average 9.4, especially since the 9.2 cost HALF the price.

 

As I stated before, it only takes one extra light spine stress line to make a book a 9.2 instead of a 9.4, yet that one stress line drops the value in HALF. Doesn't really make sense to me.

[drbanner]

...I simply go and get a 9.0 or a 9.2. In most cases I challange anyone to see any drastic differences between these books and 9.4 / 9.6s.

 

I disagree - there are drastic differences between a VF/NM and a NM+, I can assure you of that. On the whole, there isn't much difference between a jump of 0.2, but there is a big difference when you jump 3 grade steps! Sight unseen it's a risky venture to pay more for a 9.2 over a 9.4, but if you can examine the books in person, there could be a significant difference even at one grade step (an overgraded 9.2 compared to an undergraded 9.4 for example).

[Ze-man]

Is that just from using a different scanner as to why the date stamp looks darker more visible then the one to its left?

 

I dont scan that often to know varying results from using different models.

 

Thnx

Z

[jimm94]

Yep, different scanner or even just different exposure.

[Red Hook]

...I simply go and get a 9.0 or a 9.2. In most cases I challange anyone to see any drastic differences between these books and 9.4 / 9.6s.

 

I disagree - there are drastic differences between a VF/NM and a NM+, I can assure you of that. On the whole, there isn't much difference between a jump of 0.2, but there is a big difference when you jump 3 grade steps! Sight unseen it's a risky venture to pay more for a 9.2 over a 9.4, but if you can examine the books in person, there could be a significant difference even at one grade step (an overgraded 9.2 compared to an undergraded 9.4 for example).

 

I agree. And there can be drastic differences in eye appeal to books that carry the same exact grade and general description on the label, too. That's why I am looking forward to hitting Big Apple tomorrow. I get tired of trying to analyze books from web images and scans alone.

 

I mentioned this before but, after all the hoopla about sckao's resubbed Green River Daredevil #11 that went from a 9.4 to a 9.6, I ended up, luckily, finding a 9.2 Green River, which is just the purdiest little thang, for $199. I would not have been any happier owning a 9.6 resub and paying $1,000 for it. Figure I've got $800 to spend on other really great looking books.

 

Of course I could always break the 9.2 out of it's.................naw!

[Ze-man]

Reason I asked was the colors between the 2 photos dot not seem that different, the reds all look pretty close, yellows, etc.. but that date stamp just seems to be totally different in its darkness, and color.

I blew up the photo to look the the bottom edge, and you can really see how the scan on the left did not pick up the same lines as the scan on right.

 

So I assume it did the same thing with the date stamp?

 

Just curious as to this phenonemon,as it makes me look differently now at scans I might see on Ebay.

thnx

 

Z

[jimm94]

The top and bottom edges of the first scan are overexposed - probably by the reflection of the scanners bulb through the plastic that frames the book. It makes the scan contrast too high in those areas.

 

A scan is just a scan. That's one of many reasons why it's so difficult to grade a book without seeing it in person, especially through a slab.

[Ze-man]

ty jimbo