File Copies

[WEBHEAD]

How often do they come up for sale. Stumbled on one in a year end sale and when talking to one of the guys at the store they were not sure what to do with it and graded it down rather then up.

 

Are they always only one file copy? This one is for ASM 42 which I posted in the PGM section and it got good grades... I just sent it out today for grading and will be waiting for a long time before it comes back.

 

It appears to be an Eastern Color Press from Waterbuy CT. It ended up in Newtown and I dn't know how long the original owner had it.

 

So any ideas?

 

[DanCooper]

This should explain it (from the infamous CBG "Undercover" article!)

 

"In one series of advertisements in the early 1990s, Dupcak’s store announced the discovery of “Eastern Color Uncirculated Books,” which he said originated from Eastern’s Waterbury, Conn., printing facilities and warehouse. The ad represented that “Eastern did the printing for over 50 comic companies (Atlas, Marvel, DC, Archie, Harvey, Fiction House, etc.) at these facilities between 1951 and approximately 1970.” Eastern stamped in-house copies with date stamps identifying these comics as “Eastern Specimens,” the ad stated.

 

 

“The books are, in 99% of the cases the absolute finest available specimen. … Most are unimprovable, and like Mile Highs, are infectious to the condition-conscious ‘Mint Freak.’ ” In his final ad in CBG, Dupcak offered such copies of Fantastic Four #1 for $10,000 and $8,000 each. But some questioned the authenticity of the pedigree and continue to do so. Steve Borock, who keeps track of pedigrees for Comics Guaranty Corp., today says that no such Eastern Color file copies ever existed."

[WEBHEAD]

This should explain it (from the infamous CBG "Undercover" article!)

 

"In one series of advertisements in the early 1990s, Dupcak’s store announced the discovery of “Eastern Color Uncirculated Books,” which he said originated from Eastern’s Waterbury, Conn., printing facilities and warehouse. The ad represented that “Eastern did the printing for over 50 comic companies (Atlas, Marvel, DC, Archie, Harvey, Fiction House, etc.) at these facilities between 1951 and approximately 1970.” Eastern stamped in-house copies with date stamps identifying these comics as “Eastern Specimens,” the ad stated.

 

 

“The books are, in 99% of the cases the absolute finest available specimen. … Most are unimprovable, and like Mile Highs, are infectious to the condition-conscious ‘Mint Freak.’ ” In his final ad in CBG, Dupcak offered such copies of Fantastic Four #1 for $10,000 and $8,000 each. But some questioned the authenticity of the pedigree and continue to do so. Steve Borock, who keeps track of pedigrees for Comics Guaranty Corp., today says that no such Eastern Color file copies ever existed."

 

 

Before you put me in the same company of Dupcak, Robojo el la you should also do some more research

 

 

"1972

Eastern Color Printing closes its Waterbury plant and moves to Avon. Around the same time, Eastern sells many of its comic book file copies and cover proofs"

 

Eastern Color Wiki link

 

I don't really care how oily he is.. there WERE file copies.

 

Also note this one does not show a date stamp just a "DO NOT Sell"

 

I think it is a file copy at least it looks that way.

[WEBHEAD]

Check out these auctions as well...

 

I'm sure that Dupwad was just cashing in on the hype of the books

 

Esquirecomics auctions

[CKB]

Others are more knowledgable on this than I so I'm sure they will chime in.

 

I have owned a few "Phantasia" file copies in the past, and they were not stamped like that one. That's not to say Danny didn't have a stamp collection...

[WEBHEAD]

This stamp identifies it as property of Eastern Color. I would also say that there could not have been piles of the same book just sitting around.

 

 

 

One more think Dupwad's Eastern Specimins had "Date Stamps.

[shadroch]

In the mid 1980s, there were thousands of covers of SA Marvels discovered up at Eastern, and those covers were quickly bought up by dealers and collectors. I'm sure a great many got married to ordinary copies. A well known and semi-respected dealer attached a mint looking FF #1 cover to a very ordinary reading copy and was asking an astronomical amount at the time.

I may be mistaken, but I think Eastern only did the covers for SA Marvels, not the entire book. SA Marvels were distributed by DC prior to 1968 and most likely were printed at World Press in Sparta. I seem to recall reading this here, but could be mistaken.

[lou_fine]

."In one series of advertisements in the early 1990s, Dupcak’s store announced the discovery of “Eastern Color Uncirculated Books,” which he said originated from Eastern’s Waterbury, Conn., printing facilities and warehouse. The ad represented that “Eastern did the printing for over 50 comic companies (Atlas, Marvel, DC, Archie, Harvey, Fiction House, etc.) at these facilities between 1951 and approximately 1970.” Eastern stamped in-house copies with date stamps identifying these comics as “Eastern Specimens,” the ad stated.

 

 

“The books are, in 99% of the cases the absolute finest available specimen. … Most are unimprovable, and like Mile Highs, are infectious to the condition-conscious ‘Mint Freak.’ ” In his final ad in CBG, Dupcak offered such copies of Fantastic Four #1 for $10,000 and $8,000 each.

 

I just love those old ads from Fantasia as they were absolutely classic. I still remember the one with the picture of them burning a copy of the Overstreet price guide.

 

I remember how devastated poor little Danny Boy was after he had lost his advertising privileges with CBG. Boy......what a little crybaby he turned out to be in the end.

 

[DanCooper]

"but I think Eastern only did the covers for SA Marvels, not the entire book"

 

I believe that's key here.

 

The file copies from the Esquire site are all Eastern Color publisher books.

[shadroch]

Eastern Comics certainly had file copies, the question is did Eastern Press have file copies of Marvel SA books. CGC says no, and I know of nothing that disproves their stance.

[zzutak]

Many/most of the Blue Label books certified by CGC as “File Copies” are actually warehouse copies. The encapsulated Famous Funnies and Heroic issues listed by Zaid fall into this category. In 1976, I assembled nearly complete runs of Famous Funnies and Heroic from the Eastern Color Warehouse find. In many cases, there were a dozen or more copies of a specific issue to choose from. I probably examined close to one-thousand books, and I can state, unequivocally, that none of them were stamped. At the same time, I also purchased several hundred Atlas/Marvel comics. These were true one-of-a-kind file copies (or reference copies). Every one of the Atlas/Marvel books was three-hole punched and none were stamped:

 

 

The following is excerpted from an article published in CBG #1577 (copyright Krause Publications and dated Feb 6, 2004; link). It deals specifically with the legitimacy of "stamped" copies.

 

CGC: No such thing as Eastern Color File copies

 

The Eastern Color Printing Company worked as both a publisher of comics and a printer of comics in the Golden Age and after. Its own titles included Famous Funnies, the first regularly published comic book, with editorial offices in New York City. Ron Goulart, in Comic Book Culture, wrote that Stephen A. Douglas was Eastern's working editor and production manager, editing nearly three dozen other titles for the company over the years. But it's the titles that Eastern Color distributed that gained public attention years ago, when Daniel Dupcak, operating as Fantazia in Hartsdale, NY, advertised the discovery of “Eastern File Copies.”

 

CGC Primary Grader Steve Borock told CBG in no uncertain terms: There's no such thing as an Eastern file copy. “We learned this from research years before CGC," he said, "Publishers said that Eastern didn't keep file copies but, even if they did, they didn't stamp them. That stamp is not legitimate.”

 

Borock said that CGC has seen a few hundred of the copies in the last four years. “Somebody would take these books, trim them, color-touch them, and then stamp, usually on the first page, “Eastern Color File Copy,” with a fake signature on it. They were touted as file copies to people who had no knowledge. Basically, whoever was doing this was just a thief.”

 

Borock said that most of the fake Eastern file copies are Marvel comics, with some DCs. “All are trimmed or color touched, mostly with stamps with a fake signature and a fake date. It is not where the comic book was printed. Whoever was stamping these just made up a fake stamp that said Eastern.”

 

Borock said CGC has not seen a Golden Age comic book stamped as an Eastern File copy. “We have seen Amazing Spider-Man, Journey into Mystery, Metal Men, etc. Whoever was doing this was just greedy and they were able to trim the comic books really easily. They trimmed them to make them look as if they were in maximum condition when owned by the printer.”

 

When CGC sees a comic book stamped as an Eastern File Copy now, the issue gets a Restored grade. “The bottom line is that they are trimmed and color-touched, which would get a Restored label,” Borock said.

 

“There was also a find from an Eastern warehouse of just covers, and people for years have been taking the covers off really beat books and putting these beautiful covers onto these really horrible interiors. It is usually fairly obvious, especially if it wasn't done well. It didn't behoove anybody to take the cover off a Mint comic book and put another Mint cover back on; it was usually old beaters.”

 

Borock was unequivocal about claims to non-existent pedigrees: “This is a scam. The story goes along with the book. They can say, “Hey, you wouldn't believe who owned this. It might have been Kirby's copy.” People love a story.”

I hope this helps.

[lou_fine]

Many/most of the Blue Label books certified by CGC as “File Copies” are actually warehouse copies. The encapsulated Famous Funnies and Heroic issues listed by Zaid fall into this category. In 1976, I assembled nearly complete runs of Famous Funnies and Heroic from the Eastern Color Warehouse find. In many cases, there were a dozen or more copies of a specific issue to choose from. I probably examined close to one-thousand books, and I can state, unequivocally, that none of them were stamped. At the same time, I also purchased several hundred Atlas/Marvel comics from that same find. These were true one-of-a-kind file copies (or reference copies). Every one was three-hole punched and none were stamped:

.

 

Interesting comments and good to know! (thumbs u

 

With respect ot the Famous Funnies run, did the warehouse find also include any of the early issues all the way back to Famous Funnies #1 from 1934? If not, what was the earliest warehouse copy of FF that you can remember?

 

I believe that the Mark Zaid copies would not be from this warehouse find as you clearly stated that every single book would have been 3-holed punch. If this was true for Mark's books, they never would have been blue slabbed in the 9.0 to 9.6 range by CGC, and instead would most probably be residing in green slabs

[zzutak]

I purchased an FF #4 and #8 from this find. Both were pretty dirty, and the #4 was quite brittle. Only the Atlas/Marvel books were punched. Sorry for the lack of clarity. And you're correct with your "green label" observation. The Qualified 9.2 TOS #1 listed in the CGC Census is from this find and is punched in the same manner as the TTA #1 shown above.

[the blob]

This should explain it (from the infamous CBG "Undercover" article!)

 

"In one series of advertisements in the early 1990s, Dupcak’s store announced the discovery of “Eastern Color Uncirculated Books,” which he said originated from Eastern’s Waterbury, Conn., printing facilities and warehouse. The ad represented that “Eastern did the printing for over 50 comic companies (Atlas, Marvel, DC, Archie, Harvey, Fiction House, etc.) at these facilities between 1951 and approximately 1970.” Eastern stamped in-house copies with date stamps identifying these comics as “Eastern Specimens,” the ad stated.

 

 

“The books are, in 99% of the cases the absolute finest available specimen. … Most are unimprovable, and like Mile Highs, are infectious to the condition-conscious ‘Mint Freak.’ ” In his final ad in CBG, Dupcak offered such copies of Fantastic Four #1 for $10,000 and $8,000 each. But some questioned the authenticity of the pedigree and continue to do so. Steve Borock, who keeps track of pedigrees for Comics Guaranty Corp., today says that no such Eastern Color file copies ever existed."

 

 

Before you put me in the same company of Dupcak, Robojo el la you should also do some more research

 

 

"1972

Eastern Color Printing closes its Waterbury plant and moves to Avon. Around the same time, Eastern sells many of its comic book file copies and cover proofs"

 

Eastern Color Wiki link

 

I don't really care how oily he is.. there WERE file copies.

 

Also note this one does not show a date stamp just a "DO NOT Sell"

 

I think it is a file copy at least it looks that way.

 

Wiki is a source? Dupcack could have put that in there, I could have put that in there. Colbert has made a mockery of Wicki on his show F-ing with various things on it. Don't get me wrong, I look things up on Wiki all the time, but I wouldn't really rely on it.

[WEBHEAD]

This should explain it (from the infamous CBG "Undercover" article!)

 

"In one series of advertisements in the early 1990s, Dupcak’s store announced the discovery of “Eastern Color Uncirculated Books,” which he said originated from Eastern’s Waterbury, Conn., printing facilities and warehouse. The ad represented that “Eastern did the printing for over 50 comic companies (Atlas, Marvel, DC, Archie, Harvey, Fiction House, etc.) at these facilities between 1951 and approximately 1970.” Eastern stamped in-house copies with date stamps identifying these comics as “Eastern Specimens,” the ad stated.

 

 

“The books are, in 99% of the cases the absolute finest available specimen. … Most are unimprovable, and like Mile Highs, are infectious to the condition-conscious ‘Mint Freak.’ ” In his final ad in CBG, Dupcak offered such copies of Fantastic Four #1 for $10,000 and $8,000 each. But some questioned the authenticity of the pedigree and continue to do so. Steve Borock, who keeps track of pedigrees for Comics Guaranty Corp., today says that no such Eastern Color file copies ever existed."

 

 

Before you put me in the same company of Dupcak, Robojo el la you should also do some more research

 

 

"1972

Eastern Color Printing closes its Waterbury plant and moves to Avon. Around the same time, Eastern sells many of its comic book file copies and cover proofs"

 

Eastern Color Wiki link

 

I don't really care how oily he is.. there WERE file copies.

 

Also note this one does not show a date stamp just a "DO NOT Sell"

 

I think it is a file copy at least it looks that way.

 

Wiki is a source? Dupcack could have put that in there, I could have put that in there. Colbert has made a mockery of Wicki on his show F-ing with various things on it. Don't get me wrong, I look things up on Wiki all the time, but I wouldn't really rely on it.

 

 

 

 

 

Just as realistic as the one CGC article.

 

I'm sure Dupcack didn't drive up to Waterbury and pick up any pallets.

 

More then likely he just went to his back room.

 

 

The interesting thing is many of the Wiki info is backed up by sources and documented as such.

 

 

[etanick]

are you slabbing this book? because it is a moot point if that is case right because the label won't say anything about the stamp inside

[WEBHEAD]

Book is on it's way...the stamp is a memory which I at least have a nice photo of.

 

And since there is no way to know why the stamp was there it's will remain a mystery

[sborock]

The book will probably come back from CGC "Married Cover" and, possibly, "Cover Trimmed".

[The Troll King]

The book will probably come back from CGC "Married Cover" and, possibly, "Cover Trimmed".

 

[WEBHEAD]

The book will probably come back from CGC "Married Cover" and, possibly, "Cover Trimmed".

 

Oh of ye of little faith...I'm sure this book was not within spitting distance of Danny boy...... hopefully they will truely check the book carefully rather then just eyeballing it and slam it

 

If it matches to the centimeter to a regular 42 how can you prove that it is trimmed???