I hope this is the last "Man brings loaded concealed handgun to DKR"

[Buzzetta]

In New York City, Mayor McCheese is right about one thing in my opinion- his handgun laws. I shrugged when Plaxico Burress blew off a piece of himself because he took a loaded handgun with him to a club "for protection" by putting it in his Addidas sweatpants waistband.

 

Oh Plaxico...

 

Just because you have a license to own a gun in NY does not mean that you are mentally and physically equipped to handle the situation in case an emergency arises.

 

I am going to add in one thing before thread lock. Your attitude on guns changes once you have kids in the home. Ever see a thirteen year old with half a face? An NYPD officer locks up his off-duty piece in one area and locks up his bullets in another. I hate to tell you this... your kids are smarter than you. When I was a kid we figured out where Christmas presents were being held, how to program the VCR, how to steal cable, how to do a lot of things our parents did not think we knew.

 

All it takes is one bad day for that kid with raging hormones to come home and think the world is against him and that Mary will never date little Johnny and his life is over. Next, you are picking up pieces of little Johnny's head all over the back of his bedroom wall.

 

I personally know of a guy who legally owned multiple weapons. Then he started doing drugs. One night he comes home, the wife complains about his state of mind shall we say and he becomes angry at his wife while on something. Then he reaches for a gun. The story ends on a happy note as she is alive and they are now divorced. How many times do we read about someone who in a fit of anger shot someone? There is a difference between being angry and punching a hole in a wall and throwing a plate in comparison to being arms length to a weapon.

 

I do think that this nation is a little too free with weapons. They are allowed and I am fine with that but make it more rigorous to obtain them.

 

Can you imagine if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater? As another member said, the whack job launched gas into the theater and some people did not know where the bullets were coming from. If everyone is armed then a few innocent people are getting killed. It reminds me of an event about eight months ago.

 

Apparently Shadroch lives on LI he would remember this from less than a year ago. There was an unfortunate event in Seaford, Long Island NY. A man was robbing a store and two separate people ran in to the store to respond. Except for the robber and the store owner, everyone who responded as well as the customers in the store were off duty Federal Agents or officers of the law in some capacity. Everyone drew weapons and the agent was killed by friendly fire because when people arrive on the scene and people are firing weapons, no one knows who is shooting at who.

 

http://wantagh.patch.com/articles/officers-cleared-in-fatal-seaford-pharmacy-shooting

 

These were trained professionals with many years of experience between all three of them. I can only imagine what would have happened if everyone in that theater were armed.

 

Tragedy happens - but add more guns or make them more available and you will get a lot more tragedy.

 

Oh yeah,

 

In before thread lock. this whole discussion is getting dangerously political.

[Stronguy]

 

Yup, most places allow CHL carry. Some places have the Ghostbusters sign or some BS like "No Weapons Allowed" but that is nothing but for show (not legal posting). The vast majority of places have absolutely nothing and, if you ask the owners, actually welcome CHL holders. One of the only places that I've seen with the proper posing is Chuck E Cheese's.

 

Do people still go to Chuck E Cheese?

 

Now the bold part is interesting. I don't know the particulars but is there an actual, specific type of sign a private owner must put up? We have one that's pretty detailed on our business so I assume it's up to code or whatever. But if you put one on that simply says "private property, no firearms allowed" people can still carry anyway if it's not a "legit" sign?

 

 

If so, I wonder if we need to buy a sign in Spanish and German and whatever else so nobody can claim a loophole around our sign.

 

Yes, Chuck E Cheeses is always busy.

 

Check you state laws to see what legal posting requirements because it's likely you are not legal. But I honestly can't think of a many good reason a business owner would want to let criminals know that law abiding citizens were unarmed in their business. Criminals like to hunt where there is the least resistance. If it were my business and I didn't want people with firearms there (and there might be a legit reason) I would deal with it on a case by case basis. If the proprietor or authorized agent (in Texas) gives notice to someone they must immediately leave and can not come back in armed (becomes illegal trespass).

 

Certain places are automatically off limits, like schools and certain sporting events. To be legally posted in Texas there must be a 30.06 sign at every entrance, 1" block letters (on contrasting background) in both English and Spanish. This is legal (notice that proceeding beyond this point is considered illegal trespass):

 

 

This is not a legal posting (outdated):

[Stronguy]

 

Yup, most places allow CHL carry. Some places have the Ghostbusters sign or some BS like "No Weapons Allowed" but that is nothing but for show (not legal posting). The vast majority of places have absolutely nothing and, if you ask the owners, actually welcome CHL holders. One of the only places that I've seen with the proper posing is Chuck E Cheese's.

 

Do people still go to Chuck E Cheese?

 

Now the bold part is interesting. I don't know the particulars but is there an actual, specific type of sign a private owner must put up? We have one that's pretty detailed on our business so I assume it's up to code or whatever. But if you put one on that simply says "private property, no firearms allowed" people can still carry anyway if it's not a "legit" sign?

 

 

If so, I wonder if we need to buy a sign in Spanish and German and whatever else so nobody can claim a loophole around our sign.

 

Yes, Chuck E Cheeses is always busy.

 

Check you state laws to see what legal posting requirements because it's likely you are not legal. But I honestly can't think of a many good reason a business owner would want to let criminals know that law abiding citizens were unarmed in their business. Criminals like to hunt where there is the least resistance. If it were my business and I didn't want people with firearms there (and there might be a legit reason) I would deal with it on a case by case basis. If the proprietor or authorized agent (in Texas) gives notice to someone they must immediately leave and can not come back in armed (becomes illegal trespass).

 

Certain places are automatically off limits, like schools and certain sporting events. To be legally posted in Texas there must be a 30.06 sign at every entrance, 1" block letters (on contrasting background) in both English and Spanish. This is legal (notice that proceeding beyond this point is considered illegal trespass):

 

 

This is not a legal posting (outdated):

 

EDIT: Apparently things in OH are a bit more lax than in Texas. Pretty much any sign is legal in OH just as long as it's readily visible and conspicuous. You're probably okay.

[Heresy]

For those giving this man grief, If another man with a firearm stormed into the theater and began shooting, you would rather this person have left their gun in the car because you would feel safer that way?

 

You bet your left and right nut I would feel safer. If somebody storms into a theater and starts spraying, in that utter chaos of darkness and screaming and insanity, the last thing I want is some weekend warrior who thinks he's Charles Bronson whipping out his gun and firing off more projectiles for me to have to dodge. Thanks but no thanks.

 

People have a real goofy, hollywood-tastic idea that your everyday gun owner is equipped and trained to handle a chaotic situation like a movie theater shooting when in reality he's just a plumber with a CC permit. Owning a gun doesn't make you a member of Seal Team 6.

 

Exactly. +1,000,000.

 

Owning a gun, having a permit to carry a gun does not qualify you as a gun expert, or police trained, or anything else. From what I can see, the only qualifications you need to get a permit is the ability to sign your name and come up with some lame excuse to carry one, like "my town sure is dangerous!" or "I make night deposits at the bank!"

Carry laws vary from state to state, and county by county, so you're really speaking about something you don't have a clue about. In my state, you have to pay money to take a fairly extensive course, and tests, including safety and firing on the shooting range. Other states vary.

 

It is ridiculously easy to get a permit to carry in Oregon (as it is in most states) and the "fairly extensive course" can be satisfied by so many different types of classes as to make the 'demonstrates competence with a handgun' requirement laughable.

[jools&jim]

 

I wonder if the guy who got arrested can ask for a refund from the state for the cost of his carry permit? Or maybe they can waive his bail charges and other fees up to the cost of the permit?

 

I mean, I'm no expert when it comes to these things, and of course we're all operating from news reports rather than from first-hand knowledge of this particular event. But I'm still left to wonder what the benefit of having a carry permit is if the police can hassle you for carrying a gun which the permit...er, permits you to carry?

 

If all weapons incidents are treated by the police with the utmost gravity, and if claiming possession of a valid carry permit wouldn't have done this guy any good (though I'm still not sure if doing that would have made him "uncooperative"), then it seems to me that a carry permit is of limited utility at best...

[Stronguy]

For those giving this man grief, If another man with a firearm stormed into the theater and began shooting, you would rather this person have left their gun in the car because you would feel safer that way?

 

You bet your left and right nut I would feel safer. If somebody storms into a theater and starts spraying, in that utter chaos of darkness and screaming and insanity, the last thing I want is some weekend warrior who thinks he's Charles Bronson whipping out his gun and firing off more projectiles for me to have to dodge. Thanks but no thanks.

 

People have a real goofy, hollywood-tastic idea that your everyday gun owner is equipped and trained to handle a chaotic situation like a movie theater shooting when in reality he's just a plumber with a CC permit. Owning a gun doesn't make you a member of Seal Team 6.

 

Exactly. +1,000,000.

 

Owning a gun, having a permit to carry a gun does not qualify you as a gun expert, or police trained, or anything else. From what I can see, the only qualifications you need to get a permit is the ability to sign your name and come up with some lame excuse to carry one, like "my town sure is dangerous!" or "I make night deposits at the bank!"

Carry laws vary from state to state, and county by county, so you're really speaking about something you don't have a clue about. In my state, you have to pay money to take a fairly extensive course, and tests, including safety and firing on the shooting range. Other states vary.

 

It is ridiculously easy to get a permit to carry in Oregon (as it is in most states) and the "fairly extensive course" can be satisfied by so many different types of classes as to make the 'demonstrates competence with a handgun' requirement laughable.

 

Yup. People assume that Texas is nothing more than the wild west (and I'm okay with them thinking that) but we have some of the most restrictive handgun and knife laws of any Carry state.

[Buzzetta]

I wonder if the guy who got arrested can ask for a refund from the state for the cost of his carry permit? Or maybe they can waive his bail charges and other fees up to the cost of the permit?

 

I mean, I'm no expert when it comes to these things, and of course we're all operating from news reports rather than from first-hand knowledge of this particular event. But I'm still left to wonder what the benefit of having a carry permit is if the police can hassle you for carrying a gun which the permit...er, permits you to carry?

 

If all weapons incidents are treated by the police with the utmost gravity, and if claiming possession of a valid carry permit wouldn't have done this guy any good (though I'm still not sure if doing that would have made him "uncooperative"), then it seems to me that a carry permit is of limited utility at best...

 

He was not arrested for carrying. He was arrested for the equivalent of obstruction.

 

If you are licensed to carry a firearm and the police know that you have a firearm the burden falls upon you to identify and produce your permit to carry otherwise you are believed to be doing so illegally. If you ignore the requests to provide such information you are treated as if you do not have the proper permits or credentials to do so in the interest of public safety. No, your word is not good enough which is a good thing.

 

 

[InvstmntComcSuply]

I wonder if the guy who got arrested can ask for a refund from the state for the cost of his carry permit? Or maybe they can waive his bail charges and other fees up to the cost of the permit?

 

I mean, I'm no expert when it comes to these things, and of course we're all operating from news reports rather than from first-hand knowledge of this particular event. But I'm still left to wonder what the benefit of having a carry permit is if the police can hassle you for carrying a gun which the permit...er, permits you to carry?

 

If all weapons incidents are treated by the police with the utmost gravity, and if claiming possession of a valid carry permit wouldn't have done this guy any good (though I'm still not sure if doing that would have made him "uncooperative"), then it seems to me that a carry permit is of limited utility at best...

 

He was arrested for interference and breach of peace, not for anything to do with the gun. Media reports make it sound like he was ignoring the officers while "using" his cell phone.

 

I seriously doubt he would have been arrested at all, if he simply responded to the officers requests, informed them of his identity and that he was legally carrying. As is, it sounds like he was deliberately attempting to escalate the situation. He could have been using his cell to record the incident (media reports don't say that he was speaking on his cell phone, just that he was "using" it) for some sort of stunt.

[jools&jim]

 

I seriously doubt he would have been arrested at all, if he simply responded to the officers requests, informed them of his identity and that he was legally carrying. As is, it sounds like he was deliberately attempting to escalate the situation. He could have been using his cell to record the incident (media reports don't say that he was speaking on his cell phone, just that he was "using" it) for some sort of stunt.

 

Agreed...it sounds like he was trying to make a point, though it's not clear about what, exactly. Sounds like there are lots of missing details, too.

 

 

[dupont2005]

I wonder if the guy who got arrested can ask for a refund from the state for the cost of his carry permit? Or maybe they can waive his bail charges and other fees up to the cost of the permit?

 

I mean, I'm no expert when it comes to these things, and of course we're all operating from news reports rather than from first-hand knowledge of this particular event. But I'm still left to wonder what the benefit of having a carry permit is if the police can hassle you for carrying a gun which the permit...er, permits you to carry?

 

If all weapons incidents are treated by the police with the utmost gravity, and if claiming possession of a valid carry permit wouldn't have done this guy any good (though I'm still not sure if doing that would have made him "uncooperative"), then it seems to me that a carry permit is of limited utility at best...

I have a permit to drive but if I drive like an individual_without_enough_empathy the police will hassle me. Same goes with people who have CCW permits

[Designer Toast]

So the guy ignore the cops keeps talking on his cell phone does not tell people he has a permit then wonders why people are upset?

 

Exactly... had he answered the questions he would have been probably asked to leave and nothing more. Instead he has to stay on the cell phone.

 

To the boardies that may say, he does not have to answer the police:

He was already identified as the man with the gun. Until the police are able to determine the intent behind his carrying the weapon they are to assume and treat the incident as if a crime is going on. Man carrying a gun into the firing range is a lot different than a man carrying a gun into a theater.

 

(thumbs u

[Designer Toast]

Let's make this clear.

 

He was allowed to bring the gun with him to the theatre if he had a permit. It seems he had a permit. Good.

 

He didn't conceal it but rather had it sticking out of his back belt waistband. A very brazen and idiotic move considering what has happened recently.

 

He is confronted by authorities and he ignores their instructions. Another brazen and idiotic decision.

 

He was arrested. A very smart decision by the authorities.

 

This isn't about his right to carry his gun. This is about his ability to act like a level headed human being such as hiding his gun properly, not causing panic among other movie goers by showing his gun in his waistband like this is the old west and listening/complying with police when he was confronted.

 

If he had done those things, he wouldn't be on the news.

 

 

An irresponsible gun owner with a CHL is just as much of an azzhole as the guy illegally carrying. In that situation if I saw a firearm on a guy and he was refusing to comply with me, he'd be at gunpoint and on the ground without me batting an eye.

 

If he did engage in the behavior reported, he deserves to lose his permit. And why would he ever endanger his legal standing with the state bar over something as trivial as answering some questions?

[lizards2]

In New York City, Mayor McCheese is right about one thing in my opinion- his handgun laws. I shrugged when Plaxico Burress blew off a piece of himself because he took a loaded handgun with him to a club "for protection" by putting it in his Addidas sweatpants waistband.

 

Oh Plaxico...

 

Just because you have a license to own a gun in NY does not mean that you are mentally and physically equipped to handle the situation in case an emergency arises.

 

I am going to add in one thing before thread lock. Your attitude on guns changes once you have kids in the home. Ever see a thirteen year old with half a face? An NYPD officer locks up his off-duty piece in one area and locks up his bullets in another. I hate to tell you this... your kids are smarter than you. When I was a kid we figured out where Christmas presents were being held, how to program the VCR, how to steal cable, how to do a lot of things our parents did not think we knew.

 

All it takes is one bad day for that kid with raging hormones to come home and think the world is against him and that Mary will never date little Johnny and his life is over. Next, you are picking up pieces of little Johnny's head all over the back of his bedroom wall.

 

I personally know of a guy who legally owned multiple weapons. Then he started doing drugs. One night he comes home, the wife complains about his state of mind shall we say and he becomes angry at his wife while on something. Then he reaches for a gun. The story ends on a happy note as she is alive and they are now divorced. How many times do we read about someone who in a fit of anger shot someone? There is a difference between being angry and punching a hole in a wall and throwing a plate in comparison to being arms length to a weapon.

 

I do think that this nation is a little too free with weapons. They are allowed and I am fine with that but make it more rigorous to obtain them.

 

Can you imagine if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater? As another member said, the whack job launched gas into the theater and some people did not know where the bullets were coming from. If everyone is armed then a few innocent people are getting killed. It reminds me of an event about eight months ago.

 

Apparently Shadroch lives on LI he would remember this from less than a year ago. There was an unfortunate event in Seaford, Long Island NY. A man was robbing a store and two separate people ran in to the store to respond. Except for the robber and the store owner, everyone who responded as well as the customers in the store were off duty Federal Agents or officers of the law in some capacity. Everyone drew weapons and the agent was killed by friendly fire because when people arrive on the scene and people are firing weapons, no one knows who is shooting at who.

 

http://wantagh.patch.com/articles/officers-cleared-in-fatal-seaford-pharmacy-shooting

 

These were trained professionals with many years of experience between all three of them. I can only imagine what would have happened if everyone in that theater were armed.

 

Tragedy happens - but add more guns or make them more available and you will get a lot more tragedy.

 

Oh yeah,

 

In before thread lock. this whole discussion is getting dangerously political.

 

We've successfully raised three kids with loaded weapons in the house :shrug: My parents successfully raised four kids with loaded weapons in the house. :shrug:

 

It's all about education. We were all raised to shoot and hunt. My kids have all shot, and they've all been to hunting camp. They know where the guns are, and that they are not be trifled with.

 

Part of what is killing our society is that there is no personal responsibility any more, we just rely on the nanny-state to take care of everything, including all personal safety.

 

If everyone was armed at the Colorado theater, then incident would never have happened.

 

All gun control laws have their roots in racism or some other sort of repression. Our 1968 gun control laws were modeled after those established in Nazi Germany. Facts, folks - look them up.

[Aces]

How is this guy a nut job? He had a permit to carry and it was not like he was armed to the teeth and ready for WWIII. Even if the theater had an internal policy of no guns on the premises, it's not (at least in most states) a state mandated, gun free zone like a school or federal building. The worst that can happen is that he is asked to leave and is banned from the theater by the owner.

 

He's a nut job because he is not smart enough to figure out that carrying a gun to TDKR after everything that has happened is probably not wise, nor considerate. What is really frightening, is that you don't have to pass any sort of competency screening to get a conceal/carry.

 

And trust me - I live in Montana, and I know people who not only have conceal/carry, but they take their guns with them while they get drunk, go to church, etc. You know, for "protection". It's a Tough Guy License for men who think guns are toys, nothing more.

 

Gun ownership is about being responsible, being aware of the people around you and safety. The fact that this guy ignores all those standard gun owner responsibilities makes him a gigantic D-bag, and a HUGE reason to why people want to take guns away in this country.

 

I don't carry or own a gun, but if I did, I'd likely consider the Rises massacre as a renewed reason to carry them out in public--especially to that same film. I don't understand your apparent acceptance of gun rights yet your opposition to this guy actually exercising those rights.

 

How did other people even know he had a gun? Sounds like he had it fairly concealed.

 

Man oh man.... was any of us there?

Do we know what happened?

Was he menacing anybody?

Was he sitting there minding his own business?

What does it mean he didn't cooperate with the cops?

Did they say: "Hey you, drop to the floor..." And he was a little confused as to who "you" was for a few seconds? Dark theater lots of other people around that could have been "you".

Or did he know for sure as they called him by name and he was being a jerk-off?

 

Just like the Florida shooting... I wasn't there. I don't know for sure what happened.

So quick to judge.

Burn the witch...

 

 

[UnboxingTreasures]

For those giving this man grief, If another man with a firearm stormed into the theater and began shooting, you would rather this person have left their gun in the car because you would feel safer that way?

 

You bet your left and right nut I would feel safer. If somebody storms into a theater and starts spraying, in that utter chaos of darkness and screaming and insanity, the last thing I want is some weekend warrior who thinks he's Charles Bronson whipping out his gun and firing off more projectiles for me to have to dodge. Thanks but no thanks.

 

People have a real goofy, hollywood-tastic idea that your everyday gun owner is equipped and trained to handle a chaotic situation like a movie theater shooting when in reality he's just a plumber with a CC permit. Owning a gun doesn't make you a member of Seal Team 6.

 

I think it's obvious, that if you are in a situation where you don't feel confident using your firearm to defend others, then you shouldn't use it because chances are you are going to get innocents hurt.

 

I thought that went without saying. As for myself, I spent time in the military and I am comfortable with firearms. I go to the range on a regular basis to make sure I am comfortable with my firearm and it's working properly, etc., etc.

 

And you're trying to say a citizen who tries defending an audience is a "weekend warrior" like only professionals should be able to carry firearms. That is absurd - with a little bit of common sense and intelligence anyone can adequately and safely use a firearm in a responsible manner.

 

I apologize if I'm wrong, but your tone leads me to believe think that your regular Joe is a "wanna be Charles Bronson." This is insulting to the thousands of people who correctly and thougtfully carry concealed weapons.

[Buzzetta]

In New York City, Mayor McCheese is right about one thing in my opinion- his handgun laws. I shrugged when Plaxico Burress blew off a piece of himself because he took a loaded handgun with him to a club "for protection" by putting it in his Addidas sweatpants waistband.

 

Oh Plaxico...

 

Just because you have a license to own a gun in NY does not mean that you are mentally and physically equipped to handle the situation in case an emergency arises.

 

I am going to add in one thing before thread lock. Your attitude on guns changes once you have kids in the home. Ever see a thirteen year old with half a face? An NYPD officer locks up his off-duty piece in one area and locks up his bullets in another. I hate to tell you this... your kids are smarter than you. When I was a kid we figured out where Christmas presents were being held, how to program the VCR, how to steal cable, how to do a lot of things our parents did not think we knew.

 

All it takes is one bad day for that kid with raging hormones to come home and think the world is against him and that Mary will never date little Johnny and his life is over. Next, you are picking up pieces of little Johnny's head all over the back of his bedroom wall.

 

I personally know of a guy who legally owned multiple weapons. Then he started doing drugs. One night he comes home, the wife complains about his state of mind shall we say and he becomes angry at his wife while on something. Then he reaches for a gun. The story ends on a happy note as she is alive and they are now divorced. How many times do we read about someone who in a fit of anger shot someone? There is a difference between being angry and punching a hole in a wall and throwing a plate in comparison to being arms length to a weapon.

 

I do think that this nation is a little too free with weapons. They are allowed and I am fine with that but make it more rigorous to obtain them.

 

Can you imagine if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater? As another member said, the whack job launched gas into the theater and some people did not know where the bullets were coming from. If everyone is armed then a few innocent people are getting killed. It reminds me of an event about eight months ago.

 

Apparently Shadroch lives on LI he would remember this from less than a year ago. There was an unfortunate event in Seaford, Long Island NY. A man was robbing a store and two separate people ran in to the store to respond. Except for the robber and the store owner, everyone who responded as well as the customers in the store were off duty Federal Agents or officers of the law in some capacity. Everyone drew weapons and the agent was killed by friendly fire because when people arrive on the scene and people are firing weapons, no one knows who is shooting at who.

 

http://wantagh.patch.com/articles/officers-cleared-in-fatal-seaford-pharmacy-shooting

 

These were trained professionals with many years of experience between all three of them. I can only imagine what would have happened if everyone in that theater were armed.

 

Tragedy happens - but add more guns or make them more available and you will get a lot more tragedy.

 

Oh yeah,

 

In before thread lock. this whole discussion is getting dangerously political.

 

We've successfully raised three kids with loaded weapons in the house :shrug: My parents successfully raised four kids with loaded weapons in the house. :shrug:

 

It's all about education. We were all raised to shoot and hunt. My kids have all shot, and they've all been to hunting camp. They know where the guns are, and that they are not be trifled with.

 

Part of what is killing our society is that there is no personal responsibility any more, we just rely on the nanny-state to take care of everything, including all personal safety.

 

If everyone was armed at the Colorado theater, then incident would never have happened.

 

All gun control laws have their roots in racism or some other sort of repression. Our 1968 gun control laws were modeled after those established in Nazi Germany. Facts, folks - look them up.

 

Having attended a child's funeral who shot himself it was painful to watch his parents knowing that years before they had said the same exact thing. (Concerning education and guns.) In my line of work I know plenty of police, I know plenty of ex-servicemen and while the majority who have children are successfully able to raise children without incident alongside weapons in a home, there is always that one bad day.

 

You can say that about a kid who hangs himself in the closet such as the myspace case from a few years ago or a kid who dies in a car crash after a night of drunk driving. However, the death of a child usually leads to a family torn apart. No parent should ever bury their child. However there is a difference between a closet, alcohol and a gun. A gun is designed to kill something. I do not know how a parent could live with themselves if their child had a bad day and killed themselves with a weapon that the parent themselves introduced into the home.

 

I don't know what else to tell you. You will disagree with me. I understand that. I would hope you never see some of the things I have seen. It's funny. It takes an incident to change your perspective on things. I used to think the same way.

 

I disagree with you on the idea that if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater that the incident would not have happened. It would have resulted in an instance such as the events that unfolded in the link that I provided concerning off duty agents and PO responding to an emergency where the agent in Seaford LI was a victim of friendly fire since no one was clear on who was who. When people are all brandishing guns, no one wants to take that chance to find out who truly is the criminal. If they are wrong then they themselves suffer the consequences as the court later determined that they shooter of the agents were clear of all charges.

[dupont2005]

In New York City, Mayor McCheese is right about one thing in my opinion- his handgun laws. I shrugged when Plaxico Burress blew off a piece of himself because he took a loaded handgun with him to a club "for protection" by putting it in his Addidas sweatpants waistband.

 

Oh Plaxico...

 

Just because you have a license to own a gun in NY does not mean that you are mentally and physically equipped to handle the situation in case an emergency arises.

 

I am going to add in one thing before thread lock. Your attitude on guns changes once you have kids in the home. Ever see a thirteen year old with half a face? An NYPD officer locks up his off-duty piece in one area and locks up his bullets in another. I hate to tell you this... your kids are smarter than you. When I was a kid we figured out where Christmas presents were being held, how to program the VCR, how to steal cable, how to do a lot of things our parents did not think we knew.

 

All it takes is one bad day for that kid with raging hormones to come home and think the world is against him and that Mary will never date little Johnny and his life is over. Next, you are picking up pieces of little Johnny's head all over the back of his bedroom wall.

 

I personally know of a guy who legally owned multiple weapons. Then he started doing drugs. One night he comes home, the wife complains about his state of mind shall we say and he becomes angry at his wife while on something. Then he reaches for a gun. The story ends on a happy note as she is alive and they are now divorced. How many times do we read about someone who in a fit of anger shot someone? There is a difference between being angry and punching a hole in a wall and throwing a plate in comparison to being arms length to a weapon.

 

I do think that this nation is a little too free with weapons. They are allowed and I am fine with that but make it more rigorous to obtain them.

 

Can you imagine if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater? As another member said, the whack job launched gas into the theater and some people did not know where the bullets were coming from. If everyone is armed then a few innocent people are getting killed. It reminds me of an event about eight months ago.

 

Apparently Shadroch lives on LI he would remember this from less than a year ago. There was an unfortunate event in Seaford, Long Island NY. A man was robbing a store and two separate people ran in to the store to respond. Except for the robber and the store owner, everyone who responded as well as the customers in the store were off duty Federal Agents or officers of the law in some capacity. Everyone drew weapons and the agent was killed by friendly fire because when people arrive on the scene and people are firing weapons, no one knows who is shooting at who.

 

http://wantagh.patch.com/articles/officers-cleared-in-fatal-seaford-pharmacy-shooting

 

These were trained professionals with many years of experience between all three of them. I can only imagine what would have happened if everyone in that theater were armed.

 

Tragedy happens - but add more guns or make them more available and you will get a lot more tragedy.

 

Oh yeah,

 

In before thread lock. this whole discussion is getting dangerously political.

 

We've successfully raised three kids with loaded weapons in the house :shrug: My parents successfully raised four kids with loaded weapons in the house. :shrug:

 

It's all about education. We were all raised to shoot and hunt. My kids have all shot, and they've all been to hunting camp. They know where the guns are, and that they are not be trifled with.

 

Part of what is killing our society is that there is no personal responsibility any more, we just rely on the nanny-state to take care of everything, including all personal safety.

 

If everyone was armed at the Colorado theater, then incident would never have happened.

 

All gun control laws have their roots in racism or some other sort of repression. Our 1968 gun control laws were modeled after those established in Nazi Germany. Facts, folks - look them up.

[lizards2]

In New York City, Mayor McCheese is right about one thing in my opinion- his handgun laws. I shrugged when Plaxico Burress blew off a piece of himself because he took a loaded handgun with him to a club "for protection" by putting it in his Addidas sweatpants waistband.

 

Oh Plaxico...

 

Just because you have a license to own a gun in NY does not mean that you are mentally and physically equipped to handle the situation in case an emergency arises.

 

I am going to add in one thing before thread lock. Your attitude on guns changes once you have kids in the home. Ever see a thirteen year old with half a face? An NYPD officer locks up his off-duty piece in one area and locks up his bullets in another. I hate to tell you this... your kids are smarter than you. When I was a kid we figured out where Christmas presents were being held, how to program the VCR, how to steal cable, how to do a lot of things our parents did not think we knew.

 

All it takes is one bad day for that kid with raging hormones to come home and think the world is against him and that Mary will never date little Johnny and his life is over. Next, you are picking up pieces of little Johnny's head all over the back of his bedroom wall.

 

I personally know of a guy who legally owned multiple weapons. Then he started doing drugs. One night he comes home, the wife complains about his state of mind shall we say and he becomes angry at his wife while on something. Then he reaches for a gun. The story ends on a happy note as she is alive and they are now divorced. How many times do we read about someone who in a fit of anger shot someone? There is a difference between being angry and punching a hole in a wall and throwing a plate in comparison to being arms length to a weapon.

 

I do think that this nation is a little too free with weapons. They are allowed and I am fine with that but make it more rigorous to obtain them.

 

Can you imagine if everyone was armed in the Colorado theater? As another member said, the whack job launched gas into the theater and some people did not know where the bullets were coming from. If everyone is armed then a few innocent people are getting killed. It reminds me of an event about eight months ago.

 

Apparently Shadroch lives on LI he would remember this from less than a year ago. There was an unfortunate event in Seaford, Long Island NY. A man was robbing a store and two separate people ran in to the store to respond. Except for the robber and the store owner, everyone who responded as well as the customers in the store were off duty Federal Agents or officers of the law in some capacity. Everyone drew weapons and the agent was killed by friendly fire because when people arrive on the scene and people are firing weapons, no one knows who is shooting at who.

 

http://wantagh.patch.com/articles/officers-cleared-in-fatal-seaford-pharmacy-shooting

 

These were trained professionals with many years of experience between all three of them. I can only imagine what would have happened if everyone in that theater were armed.

 

Tragedy happens - but add more guns or make them more available and you will get a lot more tragedy.

 

Oh yeah,

 

In before thread lock. this whole discussion is getting dangerously political.

 

We've successfully raised three kids with loaded weapons in the house :shrug: My parents successfully raised four kids with loaded weapons in the house. :shrug:

 

It's all about education. We were all raised to shoot and hunt. My kids have all shot, and they've all been to hunting camp. They know where the guns are, and that they are not be trifled with.

 

Part of what is killing our society is that there is no personal responsibility any more, we just rely on the nanny-state to take care of everything, including all personal safety.

 

If everyone was armed at the Colorado theater, then incident would never have happened.

 

All gun control laws have their roots in racism or some other sort of repression. Our 1968 gun control laws were modeled after those established in Nazi Germany. Facts, folks - look them up.

It is a fact :shrug:

[WEBHEAD]

The Constitution gave us the right to bear arms for a reason. Back then you had to have a rifle to bring in food and to defend yourself from hostile Indians.

 

 

 

Let's all get real. This is not the wild west where everyone was armed and gun fights were plenty. This is the 21 century we don't need to be armed in a city environment any longer. There are no longer hostiles trying to take you life.

 

 

To think that if someone in the theatre could have responded and ended "Holmes" rampage is would only be putting others in danger by having him fire back at you........

[dupont2005]

No, it isn't.

 

First of all, is a "nanny state" one that enforces a small groups religious ethics on an entire nation? Or is it one that gives health care to children? I like to think it's the former, the latter just being a civilized developed nation.

 

Most people who complain about how greedy this generation are happen to be collecting SSI and Medicare, while at the same time trying to push our retirement age back to 80 (Not theirs, they'll be grandfathered in and their benefits will be untouched). All for a tax break despite taxes being lower than they have been in sixty years.

 

Our gun legislation started much earlier than 1968, and while some of it has been due to racism, so has a lot of our other laws, like the one outlawing cocaine. Other gun legislature was introduced for other reasons, like the one outlawing sawed off shotguns, long before WW2. Also, the Reich was also pioneers in interstate travel and animal rights, two other things we've since adopted. Look it up, it's a fact. Using the freeway and not beating your dog with a bullwhip, just like the Nazis!

 

As far as what would have happened if everyone in the theater were armed, Colorado is pretty lax on gun control and this wasn't their first massacre. You could look up gun violence rates and see the most gun friendly states are disproportionately more prone to gun death. Nobody can say what would have happened in there, and nobody can say how many people in that theater may have been packing a CCW.

http://www.statemaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir-death-rate-per-100-000/

 

I absolutely hate when people blame all the woes in society on this so-called "greedy generation" and "nanny state." This generation is no more greedy than yours, this generation has no more social programs than yours did. The only real difference is we don't string up black guys for dating white women anymore. Well, that and tuition is up and blue collar wages are non existent.