The BIGGEST problems in the hobby right now

[Designer Toast]

Second biggest problem: This guy

 

 

I must vehemently disagree. I vote Tup as best thing in the hobby in a long time.

 

I agree that if you're going to give consideration to one form of tape restoration then the rest should be counted as such. I like the idea of the neutral Q labeling.

 

Like it or not, this hobby (like all others) is centered around money. Whether that means pressing books or adding tape to increase the value, people will try to do what they can within the parameters set to maximize their return.

 

This comes down to choice - add tape or don't, buy books with tape or don't. Until the parameters are changed, that's the game.

 

When does the pressing discussion ensue?

[Davenport]

Yet there is a loophole in CGC's grading that allows for this procedure to happen, and its happening on some of the biggest books in the hobby, all for the sake of money.

Team Derail®, clean up on isle 3.

Almost fell over.. Butthurt over tape... Yet the "biggest books" in the hobby are being pressed and dry cleaned all the time. Staples removed? Fine.. Pressed? Fine.. Take the book apart and put it back together? Fine.. But TAPE!!!! RRRAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Yep, seems a little late in the day to start worrying about harm done producing Blue labels with bigger numbers. That debate ended. Vintage comics became a cog in a Label Delivery System, a means to an end, whatever it takes.

[comicwiz]

Yet there is a loophole in CGC's grading that allows for this procedure to happen, and its happening on some of the biggest books in the hobby, all for the sake of money.

Team Derail®, clean up on isle 3.

Almost fell over.. Butthurt over tape... Yet the "biggest books" in the hobby are being pressed and dry cleaned all the time. Staples removed? Fine.. Pressed? Fine.. Take the book apart and put it back together? Fine.. But TAPE!!!! RRRAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

No offense Pat, but the things you listed aren't damaging the book. Even if you think they are, it's nothing compared to what tape does to a book. Rewarding the application of damaging tape and considering a previous defect fixed, while keeping it in a blue label, is waaaaaayy bigger of problem. AINEC.

I know. But I cant help but feel that it is more than just that. I think anything destructive to a book is bad.

 

You mean like leaving spine roll in a book??

 

He says if you pull the tape quickly, it will hurt less

 

[dupont2005]

Huh, that does seem like a glaring flaw. I doubt it will get fixed though because then all those people that paid for 4.0 GA keys will have 1.0 GA keys, tons of money to be lost. It seems encouraging the purchase, crack, and loophole restoration (like tape, dry cleaning, pressing, ect.) for a bump in grade is the name of the game. Graded comics is a relatively small market, although it is a serious bulk of the big dollar vintage comic market. Having each book slabbed five or six times is more profitable than having them slabbed once.

[sacentaur]

I very much like Timely's suggestion to have taped books given a Qualified label, but unfortunately that train already left the station a long time ago.

[maloney414]

The biggest problem is buyers.

 

What Dale descibed happens because of buyers. Most buyers aren't educating themselves and doing research before buying. If your buying an expensive book you should educate yourself before buying. All low grade books with the same CGC numerical score are NOT equal!

 

Tape's right there plain as day on the slab's label, so the market should treat it as such. I do.

 

Changing policy would be insane on CGC's part.

 

While a color change to the label would change the value to buyers who buy the label NOT the book, it wouldn't be necessary if buyers were more educated. Continue to spread the word about tape to others.

[MCMiles]

Just don't see the tape issue as all that major.

 

I treat tape as I would very undesirable "restoration" like trimming.

 

Whether it sits in a higher graded blue label book or not, I'm going to be willing to pay more for the untaped version than the untaped version.

 

Apparently some people disagree and are willing to pay more for those books.

 

As long as its listed on the label, the market should be able to function.

 

I don't approve of the application of tape at all, but I agree with Hamlet. It's right on the label - "Tape". Does the color blue make it harder to read?

 

People can see a the PQ on the label, date stamps, writing, miscut, and many other undesirable defects on the book and adjust personal desirability based on those issues.

Choose no to buy or bid more for books with Tape and it will reflect on the value.

 

It's the way it is at this point. But I suspect the market will adjust and you may see books with "clean" labels doing as well as "noted" labels. For example a 3.5 Universal with no notes may sell as well as a 4.5 with "tape".

[Dale Roberts]

Just don't see the tape issue as all that major.

 

I treat tape as I would very undesirable "restoration" like trimming.

 

Whether it sits in a higher graded blue label book or not, I'm going to be willing to pay more for the untaped version than the untaped version.

 

Apparently some people disagree and are willing to pay more for those books.

 

As long as its listed on the label, the market should be able to function.

 

I don't approve of the application of tape at all, but I agree with Hamlet. It's right on the label - "Tape". Does the color blue make it harder to read?

 

People can see a the PQ on the label, date stamps, writing, miscut, and many other undesirable defects on the book and adjust personal desirability based on those issues.

Choose no to buy or bid more for books with Tape and it will reflect on the value.

 

It's the way it is at this point. But I suspect the market will adjust and you may see books with "clean" labels doing as well as "noted" labels. For example a 3.5 Universal with no notes may sell as well as a 4.5 with "tape".

 

 

This is what SHOULD happen. Just not convinced it will. Maybe at some point. And clearly......, it will have to do with the relative scarcity of the book in question.

[Dale Roberts]

 

 

 

 

I would pay alot to have one of those on my desk....

 

Or maybe I would rig it up as the doorbell to my house. Push his head and ....ding, dong, ding dong

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Yet there is a loophole in CGC's grading that allows for this procedure to happen, and its happening on some of the biggest books in the hobby, all for the sake of money.

Team Derail®, clean up on isle 3.

Almost fell over.. Butthurt over tape... Yet the "biggest books" in the hobby are being pressed and dry cleaned all the time. Staples removed? Fine.. Pressed? Fine.. Take the book apart and put it back together? Fine.. But TAPE!!!! RRRAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

No offense Pat, but the things you listed aren't damaging the book. Even if you think they are, it's nothing compared to what tape does to a book. Rewarding the application of damaging tape and considering a previous defect fixed, while keeping it in a blue label, is waaaaaayy bigger of problem. AINEC.

I know. But I cant help but feel that it is more than just that. I think anything destructive to a book is bad.

 

You mean like leaving spine roll in a book??

What percentage do you HONESTLY believe are pressed to remove spine roll? And from my experience, you will not remove a SEVERE spine roll without the book being taken apart.

 

But I do agree with the anti-destructive tone of NO TAPE. But I dont see why CGC and there label color needed to be stated. Unless you are really surprised that people are doing this for monetary gain? At which I will respond Seriously dude?

[lizards2]

The biggest problem is buyers.

 

Your absolutely right. Consider AF #15 - with every flipper owning three copies, and just flipping the books to other flippers, they are keeping this book at an artificial value, and out of the hand of true collectors, who can't afford them - true buyers. Terrible...., just terrible. Buyers will be the end of this hobby - cheap @sses all.

[Anfield Fox]

Tape is the most amateur of repairs. The problem is, like with most things, it will have to be all or nothing. Either all tape is restoration or none of it is. Tape was "grandfathered" in as acceptable and allowable as a defect, not restoration.

 

If "new" tape added to a book is now considered restoration, 2 things will happen. Sooner or later someone will find a way to artificially age the tape, fooling CGC and others, or the tape will naturally age on its own and 25 years from now those "restored taped" CGC books will get cracked out and they will get universal grades. Either way, its not gonna fly.

 

Perhaps books with tape should be qualified for the tape! That will stop the new tape tapers! (thumbs u

 

 

Very insightful post. Any tape = green (thumbs u

[lizards2]

Almost fell over.. Butthurt over tape... Yet the "biggest books" in the hobby are being pressed and dry cleaned all the time. Staples removed? Fine.. Pressed? Fine.. Take the book apart and put it back together? Fine.. But TAPE!!!! RRRAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

Dear Abby:

 

Tape is bad....., especially when it is not disclosed. Bad, bad, very bad. Sometimes it is a symptom of another grading problem - which is the practice of bag-grading books. It's always a surprise for the buyer to find that undisclosed tape on the interior, much like undisclosed missing pages, which are also bad, bad, very bad. Luckily, that is something that can easily be blamed on the employees, who are usually terrible creatures. Another possible problem is grading and pricing an item based on the item's theoretical, pie-in-the-sky potential. Bad, bad, so bad.

 

Luckily, I can still get that warm and fuzzy feeling by deslabbing a HG CGC book and discovering it has been badly pressed to it's full minimum potential.

 

Sign me

Butthurt Maximus

[RockMyAmadeus]

Is this another thread about Tomorrows Treasures?

 

[Muaythai607]

what destroying the hobby is ebay and the poor grading of some of the sellers..

 

 

at least ebay does provide paypal, so our transactions are secure...

[RockMyAmadeus]

[The Troll King]

Is this another thread about Tomorrows Treasures?

 

 

(thumbs u

[Old Fashion PB and J]

Almost fell over.. Butthurt over tape... Yet the "biggest books" in the hobby are being pressed and dry cleaned all the time. Staples removed? Fine.. Pressed? Fine.. Take the book apart and put it back together? Fine.. But TAPE!!!! RRRAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

 

Dear Abby:

 

Tape is bad....., especially when it is not disclosed. Bad, bad, very bad. Sometimes it is a symptom of another grading problem - which is the practice of bag-grading books. It's always a surprise for the buyer to find that undisclosed tape on the interior, much like undisclosed missing pages, which are also bad, bad, very bad. Luckily, that is something that can easily be blamed on the employees, who are usually terrible creatures. Another possible problem is grading and pricing an item based on the item's theoretical, pie-in-the-sky potential. Bad, bad, so bad.

 

Luckily, I can still get that warm and fuzzy feeling by deslabbing a HG CGC book and discovering it has been badly pressed to it's full minimum potential.

 

Sign me

Butthurt Maximus

[skypinkblu]

I find it sad that I'd have to take a piece of regular tape, instead of archival tape to put back the corner i just knocked off my old book.

 

There was a time, I'd cut a tiny sliver and VOILA, I had a whole cover...but nooooo...not

since joining this board, I was cautioned as to what a disaster that would be (thank you Andy ) ...now I have envelopes...with the corners in them, that I slide in the back of the plastic cover...so some other person can tape the corner back on, if I sell my toy.

 

It's pretty easy to knock off corners or create spine splits if you... read them...

 

When I was a kid, I was a real criminal...I actually used DIFFERENT COLOR tape, because I thought it made them look pretty, and glitter and nail polish

 

Sometimes, it seems that these "comics" have become objets D'art, rather than the books they were once meant to be...

 

Now I certainly understand it with investments...and to each his own...but just allow

safe tape and note it, and all will be fine.

 

[DiceX]

I find it sad that I'd have to take a piece of regular tape, instead of archival tape to put back the corner i just knocked off my old book.

 

There was a time, I'd cut a tiny sliver and VOILA, I had a whole cover...but nooooo...not

since joining this board, I was cautioned as to what a disaster that would be (thank you Andy ) ...now I have envelopes...with the corners in them, that I slide in the back of the plastic cover...so some other person can tape the corner back on, if I sell my toy.

 

It's pretty easy to knock off corners or create spine splits if you... read them...

 

When I was a kid, I was a real criminal...I actually used DIFFERENT COLOR tape, because I thought it made them look pretty, and glitter and nail polish

 

Sometimes, it seems that these "comics" have become objets D'art, rather than the books they were once meant to be...

 

Now I certainly understand it with investments...and to each his own...but just allow

safe tape and note it, and all will be fine.

 

 

I've found that if you have a couple of Jolly Ranchers in your mouth, you can lick the piece and stick it back on without tape.

I don't think CGC considers this restoration.