Card Scandal..eventually Comics?

[murph0]

A big scandal in the grading cards sector.. It seems like it will only be a matter of time before this starts becoming a problem in comics..we've already seen fake labels..

 

Brian

[murph0]

And for the lazy people...... A LINK!

 

Brian

[murph0]

Here's some excellent advice that people should REALLY take to heart (not really the "scandal" part but the rest) around here..this comes from MW1 on the Card forum..

"On a related note, I think one thing this Scandal will do is to teach collectors to look more carefully at the cards inside of the holders. The advice to "buy the card, not the holder" is a worthwhile maxim here"

It seems that since the advent of CGC many people are buying the plastic case and not really the comic inside.

 

Brian

[blowout]

"It seems that since the advent of CGC many people are buying the plastic case and not really the comic inside. "

 

I'm sure that this is definately true of speculators. But I would like to think that most, if not all, serious comic collectors would be looking at the comic inside the case as well as the grade. Most people on these forums certainly would be.

I always ask for large scans of books on auctions if they are not already up so that I can evaluate the grade of the book myself, if the seller will not send the scans then I won't bid. That is about as much as we, as buyers can do.

Obviously it is a big concern for those new to the hobby though.

 

[originalisbest]

Correctamundo Murph, a lesson (most) intelligent coin collectors learned a long time ago, once they figured out that, despite all promises to the contrary, not all "MS-65" Morgans look alike and they can't trade sight-unseen that effectively. Up to a point they can, but only in a very generic pricing sense.

 

Collectibles aren't like stocks - where every single share is a share is a share.

 

The grade on the label is a terrific starting point - if I hear "9.2 blue label" I don't expect a VF-. But still there is the need to have a look at the whatever-it-is inside and decide for yourself if it meets the standards you've set for what the label says. And this ability comes only from the experience of looking at a lot of slabbed (and not slabbed) whatever-it-is's.

[MW1]

Post deleted by dena

[murph0]

Good information, thankfully we don't have multiple graders in the realm of comics..but it does seem like it should be only a matter of time before there's some sort of scandal or fraud..we can hope not, but it's likely something will happen in some effect..

 

Brian

[Illiterati-migration]

thankfully we don't have multiple graders in the realm of comics..

 

I'd rather have multiple graders than a SINGLE company with NO competition. Where's their incentive to do better? Do you think we'd be having trouble with the "wedge" issue if there were more than ONE option out there for getting books graded? No, if this was happening and there were TWO companies, then you'd go to the other company... presumably making the non-wedger either try harder or go out of business. This is, of course, presuming that the other company WERE wedgers... and if they weren't, well, sending books in is just a pretty stupid thing to do with a valuable collectible, eh?

 

 

[FlComicFan]

I agree CGC should have a solid competitor

[hammer-migration]

"Not economically viable". If you're knowledgeable enough to GRADE them, and have enough expertise to know all the "intricacies" and nuances of the hobby, you can make FAR more DEALING the material than grading them, unless you ran a grading "grist-mill" (had an UNLIMITED supply of comics pouring in daily and 100 graders grinding them out, laboring at slave wages). There are certain "perks" of running a service that can "make or break" a collectible. Amongst the unlimited number of graders at a certain card service (not SGC), some dealers know EXACTLY who to give their cards to push through for favorable outcomes, and take full advantage of of a mutually rewarding, symbiotic "business" relationship.

 

Michael is 100% right. The biggest dogs have the biggest "fleas", and there's nobody in the biz that has the type of material that Michael and Brian turn up regularly. ALL SGCed (from what I've seen), and all 100% legit as well!!

[murph0]

Wow, so some people with "business dealings" with a few card graders..can get their cards graded by these people and have them do a little "favor" in the way of the grade?? Man, that's nuts..it's no wonder its hard to get into card collecting..

 

Brian

[GP_]

thats nothing, there ia coin "grading" company, and the owner sells his own graded stuff on E-bay! For the right price they will sell you the equipment and supplies to "grade/slab" your own!

[Bugaboo-migration]

For the right price they will sell you the equipment and supplies to "grade/slab" your own!

Do they sell CGC comic slab supplies???

[comicwiz]

The only thing that troubles me about CGC's holder is the inner-well. Not that there is anything wrong with the way it holds the comic -- but rather, the ease of which the label can be removed from it with no signs of tampering. Some have argued that the label is placed into the inner well through some form of heat-joined method, however, in some instances I have noticed that the label may even fall out of the well with a light tap.

 

In reply to your post about scandals in the card market, what's disturbing about this CGC label problem is the room for corruption or fraud within the comic grading market. I recieved a Mad 9 recently where the holder was so badly cracked, that I was compelled to remove the inner well for concerns that the holder would damage the comic:

 

 

 

Aside from the fact that the holder was cracked rather unusually (has anyone ever recieved a holder cracked in this manner by mail?), the sellers response was to return the comic. Normally, I don't have a problem with this; however, after spending over half the value of the actual comic on shipping, insurance and excise duties to enter into Canada, I would have lost my shirt on this transaction if I just returned it. Instead, I looked over the label thoroughly to ensure that it looked legit, and also examined the inner-well to make sure there were no signs of tampering -- and even after spending a good hour inspecting that comic, I still wonder. What if the seller had two copies of this comic, both slabbed -- one was a purple label, and the other a blue label... and the two labels were swiped, and I really ended-up with the restored copy. How would I know for certain that the book was exactly what the label read? I can already hear the counter arguments, but in all seriousness, if the book is still in its barex inner-well with no signs of tampering or removal from inside the well, why wouldn't CGC just make it more difficult for the label to be removed from the inner-well? A suggestion: maybe sealing the label, with no opening at the top of the inner-well would prevent any foul-play as a tamper evident system is far better than one where the label has been proven to fall out with a light tap or a slight pull with no signs of tampering. Just a thought

[originalisbest]

No arguments with the points you raise, Comicwiz! I do think CGC should consider wedges all of the time, not occasionally - and I would think somehow securing the label as part of the sealing process would be ideal. Hope they can address both of these concerns.