PRETTY BOOK of "EVER"

[tth2]

Jon, don't disagree with what you're saying, particularly that CGC didn't help themselves by giving the universal blue label to certain GA books with "tiny" glue and "very small color touch". This has been a topic discussed and debated at length on these boards. I would also be supportive of a more detailed restoration rating system. It does seem silly to me that all restoration currently seems to be lumped together by the market (although as I noted in another thread in reply to Lou_Fine, it seems to me this is a wonderful arbitrage opportunity for sophisticated purchasers, who can distinguish between different types of restoration and use this opportunity to purchase professionally restored books with moderate or less restoration on the cheap).

 

On the other hand, I continue to oppose using the same color label. Restored books need to be clearly identifiable as different from unrestored books. Why? Because the market DOES make a big distinction between restored and unrestored books. Why? Because most comics are not one-of-a-kind objects, but usually exist in multiple copies, even issues that are considered extremely rare. The primary manner in which their values have been differentiated amongst each other is based on their "real", unadulterated condition, which reflects how difficult it is for a bunch of pages of newsprint to survive in top condition over 40+ years without artificial assistance. Comics are not original art, which is valued for its uniqueness, not condition. Restore the Mona Lisa all you want (and it has been), it won't diminish the value because it'll still be the only Mona Lisa painted by DaVinci.

 

Perhaps the best analogy to original art would be to find out that an original artwork is a counterfeit. Then the whole uniqueness underpinning its value disappears, causing its value to plummet. In a sense, restoration of a comic book is like finding out that it's a counterfeit, because its apparent grade is "fake". Then what's so unique about a HG book? Anyone can have a HG book, they just have to pay enough to get the proper restoration work done, in the same way that anyone can have a Mona Lisa, they just have to pay enough for someone to do a good copy.

[lou_fine]

From my point of view, this will always be an area of controversy as long as CGC maintains the two-colour label system. As I have mentioned many times in the past, it would be far better if CGC adopts an one-colour label system and incorporate a formal restoration rating system along with the current condition grading system.

 

We would then see unrestored books with a restoration rating (RR) of R-0, books like the MH More Fun 52 with something like R-1, MH Adventure 40 with R-3, and extensively repaired books with a R-10. The marketplace would then be able to determine the acceptability and price of a book depending upon their restoration rating instead of CGC simply blessing them with a blue label or stigmitizing them with a purple label.

 

You never know, the marketplace may determine that R-3 is perfectly acceptable for a GA book similar to how VF/NM is acceptable condition-wise for GA books. Needless to say, however, R-3 or VF/NM 9.0 would be totally unacceptable for Modern books. With both of these criteria in place, the marketplace will be able to come up with the final determination as to acceptability and price. IMHO

 

 

My sentiments (and words). However, i think while restoration "lowers' value, "stigmatized"? I think not. Time for the hobby to grow up.

 

 

 

A modest proposal if you please. It is time for the hobby to define types, as well as degree, of restoration. What makes it “repairs”? What makes it “non-additive restoration”? What makes it “minor” restoration or “moderate” or “heavy”? How does a particular “action” performed on a book effect its price or should effect its price? I propose that the appropriate entities in the hobby send out surveys to the leading restorers in the hobby and have them list all types of work that can be performed on a book and what they consider to be “repair”, preventative repair (tape removal), restoration, etc. What do they consider makes it “very” minor or minor or moderate work. Which do they consider most intrusive to the book? A decision has to be made about tear seals. It is the length of the seal or other measures that determine the “nomenclature” that we see so often used in sales? What if repair/restoration is “reversed”? Let the hobby develop accepted categories for the terms so freely bandied about such as repair, preventive restoration, non-additive restoration, etc. Also although a book has been “restored”, how significant is it to the book? All of this should, (with admitted difficulty) be institutionalized into categories and, perhaps, lead to the creation of a Restoration Scale of R-0 to R-10 (or any number). If a book can be so classified maybe the hobby can “institutionalize” for the non-high demand non-pedigree books (as opposed to high demand/ pedigree books that seem more impervious to such “defects”) as to how the R value effects price. Such a dialogue conducted in an organized and informed fashion (as opposed to pre-conceived dogma of select few) is long over due and will add to the continued growth of the hobby.

 

Jon Berk 5/27/01

 

 

Jon;

 

Welcome to the never-ending topic of restoration rating. I initially brought up this topic way way back when I came onto the boards and credited you as the originator of this idea and attempted to direct everybody to read this excellent proposal of yours in the CBM. Can't seem to find this post anymore since CGC now allows you to archive only your past 250 posts.

 

Anyways, it's certainly nice to finally hear it from the horse's mouth, so to speak. For the longest while, I was the only one championing this cause. Timely (West) then came on board and was a respected voice on the push for a one-colour label system. Unfortunately, Timely can no longer speak out on this topic since he has now join the dark side and can't publicly take an anti-CGC stance. The CGC crowd appears to be tired of me voicing my opinion on this topic and just considers me to be an old nag when it comes to this issue. It's nice to finally have another respected voice on the pro side of this topic.

 

Also in agreement with you that the marketplace should be mature enough to read and think for itself and not have to be totally reliant on CGC for every minute liitle detail such as stigmitizing colour labels. Unfortunately, at this stage of the game, the majority of the CGC generation still seems to be teething on the CGC soother or spoon feeding off the CGC spoon.

[jbcomicbox]

I am not advocating that the market place 'value' restored books differently than unrestored. Certainly in the Silver and post-age there are thousands of these copies. (Restoration for these books may well be a kiss of death due to their greater availability) All i am suggesting is saying a book is "restored"- rendering it with the "Scarlet R" and kiss of death- is like saying someone has a knee problem. Not all knee problems are the same- nor is restoration. Simply, the market should be sophisticated enough to differentiate between types and degrees of restoration and price accordingly. Do not lump it all together.

 

Would I restore books that i did in the past? Probably not. It is just that the "R word" invokes collector hysteria. It is clear that CGC recognizes that all restoration/repair is not alike so tries to "de-stigmatize" the R designation. This whole thing on "unrestoring" is another way to get around to the extreme that being restored causing a book to be spit upon. I do not question where CGC (and where is Overstreet on this?) is trying to go.....I just question the way they are getting there.

 

Tear seal? Don't care. Small color touch...don't care, expecially if one says it reduced "The Value" of the book 50%.....Find the GA book first. Easy solutions? No. Suggestions? Yeah education of hobbyist.

 

Jon

[1962]

Excellent Post! It never ceases to amaze me in regards to GA books how some collectors would rather have the Fine Unrestored versus the NM- with a drop of color touch or glue that is given the PLOD and they are priced roughly the same. Gimme a Break! Now the story is a little different if we are dealing with a Frankenbook

[Norrin_Radd]