WARNING: Watch out for altered Bronze-Age Price Variants in PGX holders.

[comicwiz]

So how are they altering it???

 

Just guessing because I don't have one in hand, but my bet is they are cutting the 35 cent box from a regular 35 center and pasting it over the 30 cent price.

 

There was a fale Star Wars 1 35 cent price variant in a CGC slab. It received a NG designation. The person likely cracked it out and sent it in to PGX. And then started doing it with other copies. I spoke to Mark Haspel at the time when the book was discovered in the wild and he said it wasn't a paste over, or a rub out of the previous price.

 

I could only guess without seeing it firsthand, but I remember in that CGC NG Star Wars 1 that Dicey sounded pretty convinced he knew how they did it (but didn't spill the beans).

 

The Star Wars 1 35 cent fake in the other thread had a 35 cent indicia that was much more convincing and looked correct for the most part (misaligned numbers, etc.)

 

Whereas the art for these 35 cent knock offs is not correct. These look more like a copy or paste job of a regular 35 cent issue. I doubt the same "artist" did them both.

 

I think there are two versions floating around - one with the misaligned numbers, and the other with the regular 35 cent font. I believe you are correct, the one I spoke to Mark about was the misaligned 35 cent price.

[ShieldAgent]

So I had a variant book once that had a neatly clipped UPC box. I purchased a regular version, sent both copies off, and a month later the book had been restored beautifully. The pictures are in the boardmembers thread in the resto section.

 

Is too far of a leap to believe that a similar operation could have been performed on the price box of these fakes? Cutout, replace, submit.

 

Without knowing what is on the inside covers as I type this, perhaps what is there, or the placement of the box on the cover precludes scammers from obtaining a cheap 35 cent variant donor book (any) to harvest the price box, and therefore the use of the regular font from another SW1 (reprint) was required.

 

[Dale Roberts]

So how are they altering it???

 

Just guessing because I don't have one in hand, but my bet is they are cutting the 35 cent box from a regular 35 center and pasting it over the 30 cent price.

 

A good paper mechanic could make it pretty seamless. Or at least seamless enough that it'd be hard to detect once stabbed.

 

This is exactly what is done. I know a guy that has a really nice Star Wars #1 where the 35c has been cut off another book and glued to the cover of a regular issue. He found it at a show and just kept it because he thought it was cool and knew he would never pay the big price (which is insane now) for a real one.

 

You really can't tell it without looking super close.

[comicwiz]

So I had a variant book once that had a neatly clipped UPC box. I purchased a regular version, sent both copies off, and a month later the book had been restored beautifully. The pictures are in the boardmembers thread in the resto section.

 

Is too far of a leap to believe that a similar operation could have been performed on the price box of these fakes? Cutout, replace, submit.

 

Without knowing what is on the inside covers as I type this, perhaps what is there, or the placement of the box on the cover precludes scammers from obtaining a cheap 35 cent variant donor book (any) to harvest the price box, and therefore the use of the regular font from another SW1 (reprint) was required.

 

 

In theory, this would be possible. But I have to say to the trained eye, these scream fake as soon as you see the price box. Even if a swipe scenario were to play out as you suggest, the perp would have to be sitting on a supply of test price variants to be able to fool a savvier collector, and I just don't see that scenario being feasible because of the cost, risk/reward, and supply factor to pull off a convincing price box swipe.

 

I do see this fooling the majority of people flipping through a long box, with the dollar signs blinding their better judgement, but from a front cover scan, this isn't fooling a seasoned collector:

 

[comicwiz]

So how are they altering it???

 

Just guessing because I don't have one in hand, but my bet is they are cutting the 35 cent box from a regular 35 center and pasting it over the 30 cent price.

 

A good paper mechanic could make it pretty seamless. Or at least seamless enough that it'd be hard to detect once stabbed.

 

This is exactly what is done. I know a guy that has a really nice Star Wars #1 where the 35c has been cut off another book and glued to the cover of a regular issue. He found it at a show and just kept it because he thought it was cool and knew he would never pay the big price (which is insane now) for a real one.

 

You really can't tell it without looking super close.

 

Just making sure I read this right; you're saying the price box swipe was from a 35 cent variant, or a regular 35 cent price box?

[InvstmntComcSuply]

I can't imagine a pasted over price block is not easy enough to detect by PGX or any competent grader for that matter.

 

Also, wouldn't it stand out like a sore thumb under UV?

[comicwiz]

I can't imagine a pasted over price block is not easy enough to detect by PGX or any competent grader for that matter.

 

Also, wouldn't it stand out like a sore thumb under UV?

 

I 100% agree. Again, the only exception would be someone who doesn't know how to tell, but I'd have to think someone dropping the kind of money a SW 1 35 cent price variant would at least know the basics. As far as lighting, even if someone were to try selling me one in a dark alley, I'd still be able to tell a fake from real.

[ShieldAgent]

Its not a "longbox" scam.

 

My only problem discussing this right now is that I dont have access to my books to look at interior cover ads.

 

The premis is this though: A decent copy of SW1, plus a donor price box from a more common price variant for sale any day of the week on ebay, plus a good paper resto person, can equal big profits when VG copies of SW1 variants can go for over $400 in G/VG.

[Dale Roberts]

So how are they altering it???

 

Just guessing because I don't have one in hand, but my bet is they are cutting the 35 cent box from a regular 35 center and pasting it over the 30 cent price.

 

A good paper mechanic could make it pretty seamless. Or at least seamless enough that it'd be hard to detect once stabbed.

 

This is exactly what is done. I know a guy that has a really nice Star Wars #1 where the 35c has been cut off another book and glued to the cover of a regular issue. He found it at a show and just kept it because he thought it was cool and knew he would never pay the big price (which is insane now) for a real one.

 

You really can't tell it without looking super close.

 

Just making sure I read this right; you're saying the price box swipe was from a 35 cent variant, or a regular 35 cent price box?

 

The one he bought was a regular 35 cent box. He pointed it out to the guy, and then paid the guy a somewhat reasonable price, just because he is a big Star Wars collector and thought it was cool. But there is no reason someone couldn't do it with a 35c variant.

[lscomics]

I can't imagine a pasted over price block is not easy enough to detect by PGX or any competent grader for that matter.

 

Also, wouldn't it stand out like a sore thumb under UV?

I'm not saying they are but you're assuming that PGX isn't complicit in this. We've all read the thread about CGC books being bought and grade bumped by the guy that's their head grader/doesn't work for them/has free access to their slabbing equipment haven't we?

[comicwiz]

Its not a "longbox" scam.

 

I'm just saying that someone who wouldn't be in the know would probably get all giddy seeing the 35 cent price on a Star Wars 1 in a long box.

 

I don't even see this as something that could fool anyone in the market for a book of this caliber, but do accept some people who aren't in the market and figure they hit the lotto might get fooled.

[comix4fun]

I can't imagine a pasted over price block is not easy enough to detect by PGX or any competent grader for that matter.

 

Also, wouldn't it stand out like a sore thumb under UV?

 

 

Maybe the lighting in the basement where they grade comics isn't so good.

[Mr. Zipper]

My sense is the slabbing is a key component in the ruse... at least for the more amateur examples with the regular 35 cent price box. Otherwise it probably would feel "off" if you ran your thumb over the altered section. In a raking light you could probably see something was amiss.

 

Whether the slabbing company is knowingly part of the ruse is for others to decide.

[comix4fun]

My sense is the stabbing is a key component in the ruse... at least for the more amateur examples with the regular 35 cent price box. Otherwise it probably would feel "off" if you ran your thumb over the altered section. In a raking light you could probably see something was amiss.

 

Whether the stabbing company is knowingly part of the ruse is for others to decide.

 

 

Are you typing on an Iphone perchance?

[comicwiz]

The premis is this though: A decent copy of SW1, plus a donor price box from a more common price variant for sale any day of the week on ebay, plus a good paper resto person, can equal big profits when VG copies of SW1 variants can go for over $400 in G/VG.

 

The premise is reasonable.

 

If you're the kind of person that is going to drop 1K+ on a Star Wars 1 raw, and if it is a swipe, there is no doubt in my mind that the work would stick out like a sore thumb by; a) examining the price box; b) opening the interior cover and looking at the darkened impression made by the added price box under light.

[comicwiz]

I can't imagine a pasted over price block is not easy enough to detect by PGX or any competent grader for that matter.

 

Also, wouldn't it stand out like a sore thumb under UV?

 

 

Maybe the lighting in the basement where they grade comics isn't so good.

 

[canickus]

I think that the replacement whether it is a "paste-on" or is a piece replacement could be from any regular issue if just replacing the 35 cents square or from another July 35 cent issue if replacing the complete price block.

 

In the first case of the paste-on, there is no way that a third party grader should miss the paste-on, particularly on a book like Star Wars 1.

 

In the second case of the piece replacement, the inside cover will show the alteration which will also be noticeable from the front when carefully examined or with some magnification.

 

This is alteration - not restoration.

[Forbush-Man]

if you buy anything PGX you get what you deserve.

 

 

You shouldn't pay more than you would for the same grade raw & restored.

[comicwiz]

I think that the replacement whether it is a "paste-on" or is a piece replacement could be from any regular issue if just replacing the 35 cents square or from another July 35 cent issue if replacing the complete price block.

 

Even in this scenario, it wouldn't be possible to align the price box with the interior ad without it looking off.

[Davenport]

Whether the slabbing company is knowingly part of the ruse is for others to decide.

That would be where CLink comes in, if they feel this kind of stuff has the potential to damage their brand. They know who listed the books.