Noob Exasperation

[Westy Steve]

Hey guys,

 

I've tried to give myself a crash course in comic art. I've read through a lot of the thread geared toward noobs like me and I've come to a couple of conclusions:

 

First, I don't know if I can collect this stuff within my budget. I've collected everything under the sun...just about...and I'm pretty good at it. What I mean by that is I'm pretty good at wheeling and dealing and buying undervalued things with future potential. But I don't know if spending $100 a month is going to cut it. I could spend more if I quit following my other collections (mainly currency and comics), but I don't see that happening.

 

So then I tried to answer my own question of "How would I collect on a beer budget", and the answer seems to be that I need to try to focus on undiscovered talent that is still cheap. My Mom is a seriously gifted artist who could draw people or scenery with almost photo-quality, but alas...I didn't inherit that gene. I sometimes think that I've inherited an eye for art...which has really helped me in collecting. I can't make anything, but I feel I know what's good. So maybe I can try to hone that skill to accumulate new talent while it's cheap. Over the past few days, I think I've learned that real talent can be squandered if it never get's the exposure it needs. I know of a pretty good artist that (to me) does amazing work, but it seems like they have had sub-par inkers and so their talent is squandered. I can see that an artist could go their whole career that way...being partnered with poor inkers and working on unpopular books. So it seems really speculative.

 

The other route (to me) is to collect Frazetta-like art from artists that do mostly fantasy cover work. I'm gravitating toward this because...to me....the most fascinating drawings are pencil sketches. Lucky for me, these are cheap. I absolutely get a thrill out of fine sketchwork, and seeing something created from nothing. I know that full-on oil paintings are worth tons of money, but if I had to choose between 10 sketches worth $100 each, or one painting worth $1,000, I'd take the sketches....know what I mean?

 

So, right now, that's the way I'm leaning. Yet I know that there is an order to things. I know that sketches are inferior to pages and pages are inferior to splashes and splashes are inferior to covers. And I fully understand that the way to get a seat at the big table is to stick with the best. So that brings me back to square one.

 

I've come to the conclusion that I need a mentor. An internet junky who can answer questions about specific pieces of art. Or maybe I should stick to currency.

 

WC

[AKA Rick]

Here's some tips:

 

1) Don't buy out of boredom (i.e. the money burning a hole in your pocket scenario)

 

2) Don't buy out of impulse

 

3) Don't buy as an investment

 

4) Don't buy on credit (it's a hobby, don't go into debt because of it)

 

5) Do buy what you enjoy and what is aesthetic to you.

 

6) Do save up and have patience to either afford the piece you want or eventually a piece by a certain artist or with a certain character will make itself available.

 

7) Be at peace with the fact that you can't own everything, you win some you lose others, but the money as a known quality in your pocket is a better commodity than a piece of art you either can't afford (see #4) or that you'll have buyers remorse (see #1 or #2)

 

8) It doesn't matter what others think about your collection, as long as you like the art, the value or peer prestige is meaningless, so just enjoy yourself.

 

And addressing your "Ten $100 pieces VS One $1,000 piece" - - You'll need to figure that one out as far as what makes you most happy. Some like quality, some like quantity... and yesterday's $100 piece is tomorrow's $1,000 piece potentially... and even more so, it's possible, if you're being a speculative investor that the lower priced items goes up at a higher percentage (a $100 piece can more easily triple to $300, where a $1,000 piece may stall at that price or go up only 50% to $1,500 in that same time frame) and then you can sell/trade.

[Dave Aikins]

My addition to the wonderful advice above;

 

RESEARCH any artist you're thinking about getting a commission from. Research their technique, their consistency, and more importantly, their reputation. Deviant Art is full of wonderful "new" artists that might be affordable, but if I have to hear one more "someone on Deviant Art took my money and ran" story, I'm gonna lose it. This can also happen with professionals as well, so RESEARCH.

 

Otherwise- remember that happiness is defined by you, and not others. As stated above- just enjoy yourself.

[Greedo]

You can really enjoy this hobby on any budget. There are lots of cool sketches to be had on eBay and at conventions for cheap. Not "high-end" stuff but cool all the same.

 

I started with a "quick sketch" book that was mostly free and grow from there. My current budget is still small compared to alot of people.

 

About the 10 x $100 pieces vs. 1 x $1000 piece - this really depends on budget and with your budget I would go for more pieces to start, after all have 1 nice piece isn't much of a collection. But as you grow in the hobby you will start want bigger and better pieces.

 

I think the best advice that everyone will give you is to like/love everything you buy.

 

Their really nice stuff out there, even for the us on a budget. Infact I got a piece I absolutely love for $55 last week.

[Greedo]

My addition to the wonderful advice above;

 

RESEARCH any artist you're thinking about getting a commission from. Research their technique, their consistency, and more importantly, their reputation. Deviant Art is full of wonderful "new" artists that might be affordable, but if I have to hear one more "someone on Deviant Art took my money and ran" story, I'm gonna lose it. This can also happen with professionals as well, so RESEARCH.

 

Otherwise- remember that happiness is defined by you, and not others. As stated above- just enjoy yourself.

 

May I add artists like Dave here, do excellent work for very good rates. Dave, my son loves the his Sponge Bob - Superman you draw him at Balt -Con last year. (thumbs u

 

Dave can also do zombies with the best of them.

[Dave Aikins]

Aw geez, thanks! That Saturday at Baltimore was totally nuts...and then Sunday was slow. Go figure!

 

One of the reasons that I started to set up at cons was that i enjoy collecting art- especially con sketches. But, as the industry changes and prices go up, I find myself less interested in getting sketches from artists unless I'm a fairly big fan of their work. So, I don't tend to buy based on the art alone. I prefer to buy on what the artist has meant to my life as well as their work.

I also try to keep things to a budget that I can justify to myself. One of my favorite artists is doing $2000 commissions. They are wonderful, but it's still $2000. Can I afford it? Well, I could take the time to sell some art from my collection to fund the one commission. Can I justify it to myself... I'm not sure. Probably not.

 

So, everyone has a different approach to their collection. Different goals, different tastes, different budgets.

 

My other recommendation is to not get caught up in the craze of collecting. Know what you want and know your limits. Don't buy because you just want SOMETHING or because other collectors or friends are going crazy buying art. Think about what you're getting for the money and whether or not a headshot would be just fine instead or a full figure, etc...

Buyer's remorse really stinks... so do what you can do avoid those kinds of purchases that might lead to regret.

 

I bought a 2 figure sketch from an artist at Baltimore 3 years ago that cost $600. It turned out great, and it was done by one of my favorite artists... but he was also doing $50 head sketches that looked really nice. I could have gotten 12 head sketches for the price of my 2 figure commission. I just didn't stop to realize that until it was too late. I was too caught up in the craze to think clearly.

 

Buyer's remorse sucks.

[CollectingFool]

Hey WC,

 

One simple question, why do you want to collect comic art? I know it's become the trendy thing and when people stare at their comics collections and see it's the same as what everyone else has they are drawn to the uniqueness of comic art. Not to mention the people who collect just for the thrill of having other people comment on their stuff. They get caught up in the excitement and want to be "in the club". If you think any of this applies to you just save your money and forget this hobby.

 

I don't know about anyone else but when I started collecting I fought it for about a year and a half. I bought and sold art to be near it but refused to buy anything to keep because I knew it was going to open a door I wasn't ready to open. When I finally took the plunge it was because I saw a piece I just couldn't resist. From that day it was 10 years straight of constant obsession. Every spare penny went to comic art. That's the mindset of most of the collectors I know. I don't think this hobby is for people who want to "dabble" unless you have lots of expendable income, especially now.

 

It's been 20 years since I bought my first page. I can now make rational decisions about what I buy, not purely emotional but it took some time to get there. If you have an addictive personality I would suggest you avoid the hobby. The simple fact you said you can't see stopping comics and currency collecting for comic art means to me you're not ready to jump in and be what I consider collector of comic art. Until you see that piece you can't help but buy, save some money and bide your time.

[Westy Steve]

Thanks for the info, guys. Getting great advice, both on this board and by PM.

 

I guess technically I'm already a collector. I've been gathering collection sketches in a bound art book since 1996. Only obtained at Megacon. I've got a couple of Romitas, stick figure Perez, a stick figure Jusko, a stick figure Carmine Infantino, a couple from William Stout, Sheldon Moldoff, and Martin Nodell. It's a hell of a book considering most stuff in there was free. I tried to put only the best in that book. After a while, when I asked an artist to sketch, they'd see who else was hin there and sometimes they'd want their work next to those others. I saw Frazetta at Megacon once. I didn't even ask him for a sketch. I knew he wasn't doing them, but it irked me a little bit that he wouldn't even consider drawing for the fans who made him.

 

What moves me are those sketches, and most of them are just head drawings. But watching those artists create make them amazes me. I've seen my Mom paint with oils, and again...she's really good...but nothing impressed me more than the sketches.

 

It's probably not very applicable, but my style of collecting is to know prices really well and then wait until I see a real bargain and pounce. When I buy currency or comics, I can usually sell them for at least twice of what I buy them for. However, even though admitting this could get me labeled as a "flipper", that's not what happens. I love and cherish what I buy and tend to keep it. The only reason I buy stuff this ways is because the universe is big enough to where there is always a good deal if I look hard enough and...most importantly...I know that at some point, my half-grown kids will need to go to college, or need a wedding, or I'll retire. I want to make sure I can get all or most of my $$$ back out of it if I need to. My hobbies MUST be almost self-funding this way, or I can't justify it because of these obligations. (I'm not a single guy with funds to burn). So I'm trying to evaluate whether this style will translate to art. How liquid are these things if I want to sell if I'm buying in the $100 range? I get the impression that they probably aren't. I'm not trying to be a sourpuss..I'm wrestling with this. I don't want to start off on the wrong path.

 

WC

[Garf]

I have a few long boxes but they have now been relegated to the loft for quite some time. Between moving house, having pets, having children and generally growing up and not finding the time to read like I used to I don't see them ever coming back down again. It's so much more convenient to go with digital when it comes to reading now. I have never been one for displaying my comics but as my pull list for physical copies has decreased there has been a void left to fill. I collect a mixture of modern stuff and 80's / 90's which represents what I have collected over the years.

 

It's a personal collection as such.

 

With the current speculation (bubble?) fueling the prices of moderns to silly prices the leap to OA really didn't seem like a big one. That gap has closed and as mentioned above it can make this hobby self funding if you are willing to sell some floppies.

 

TLDR: It fills the void created by progressing to digital, I'd rather spend on OA than a single comic released in the last month or couple of years that is now hot and probably near the price of a page, for me it currently pays for itself.

[lb jefferies]

Don't buy anything for 6 months. Research the market, find a focus and try your best to stick with it.

[mister_not_so_nice]

And don't forget, THIS THREAD is stickied for a reason. There are plenty of people with similar thoughts(I just wish someone would have spell checked mine before they went public )

[Pete Marino]

Don't buy anything for 6 months. Research the market, find a focus and try your best to stick with it.

 

I think this should be the default answer to anyone who's looking to start collecting OA. I waited about 8 months before I took the plunge and made my 1st "big" purchase.

 

For me, personally, in the 1 vs 10 argument, I'll take the 1 every time. I only have so much wall space, and already too much in portfolios. It's not about owning all the toys, just the ones you have the most fun playing with.

[SuperBird]

+1.

 

I would add that, if on a budget, try looking for things that you might value more than others. You can get relatively better deals that way, as opposed to chasing after the same things everyone else wants.

[JadeGiant]

Threads and forums like this are the best “mentor” you will find. Most in this hobby will suggest taking a measured approach when entering this hobby based upon their early experiences. Unfortunately, the reality for me was seeing something I had not ever considered but knew I desperately wanted. Many of us started by buying 10 pieces instead of one but a majority much prefer the one piece now. This doesn’t mean that you should skip the phase where you buy more pieces – just be aware of the experiences of other and constantly ask yourself – is there a $300 piece I would rather have than these 3$100 pieces. Odds are you will reach a point when you perspective shifts. Soon you will be asking yourself if you really want those $300-$400 pages instead of the cover or splash for $1,000 - $1,500 … repeat this cycle until you hit your ceiling. I got burned when the bubble burst on the comic and card hobbies during the early 90’s and almost got out of the hobbies completely due to the bad taste it left in my mouth. For this reason, I never use investment potential as a primary motivation for collecting anything. It is a factor, but very far down the list. If I buy a page that I love, it can’t go down in value to me (my value, not market value). Collecting art and assigning value can be hard to judge at times, especially if you are collecting at the $100 level which is probably heavy into the commission game. Published pages are probably more predictable but cost more. Good luck, try not to be exasperated – hope you enjoy the hobby!

[JadeGiant]

Also, it sounds like you like to do your homework. As such, find as many art related resources and read up. In addition to this site, check out the links below. They tend to range in the type of collector that visit but they both have good discussion content.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/comicart-l/

 

http://www.statueforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=34

 

 

[Westy Steve]

You guys are great help. Seriously.

 

In other fields of collectibles, I recommend finding items that meet three categories (1.) rare (2.) cool and (3.) high grade. Then I counsel people to find the stuff they can buy that meets all three categories in their budget. So for some comicbook collectors, that might mean collecting copper age, for others bronze, etc. What's interesting is that with art, there (generally) is only rare and cool. But defining "rare" and "cool" is gonna be hard to do. Might be interesting to define the sliding scale between the two.

 

And yes...I need to study the market. I've always heard that, I've even given that advice, and yet I never do. I'll give it a go this time. I've only bought one so far, and I have my eye on something that is underpriced and something that it is beautiful. I'll try to hold off. Though there is one item that might drop into my lap for pennies...I'll have to get that.

 

Hey, one last question. Speaking of not being able to hold off. I'm going to Megacon at the end of the week. Any artists there who I should definitely get a sketch from? Anything I should look for? I'm only going to be there a day and I have comicbooks to buy/sell/trade, but I'm going to have to look at some art.

 

WC

[Terry Doyle]

. . . I never use investment potential as a primary motivation for collecting anything. It is a factor, but very far down the list. If I buy a page that I love, it can’t go down in value to me (my value, not market value).

 

 

My sentiments exactly. (thumbs u

[Terry Doyle]

You guys are great help. Seriously.

 

In other fields of collectibles, I recommend finding items that meet three categories (1.) rare (2.) cool and (3.) high grade. Then I counsel people to find the stuff they can buy that meets all three categories in their budget. So for some comicbook collectors, that might mean collecting copper age, for others bronze, etc. What's interesting is that with art, there (generally) is only rare and cool. But defining "rare" and "cool" is gonna be hard to do. Might be interesting to define the sliding scale between the two.

 

And yes...I need to study the market. I've always heard that, I've even given that advice, and yet I never do. I'll give it a go this time. I've only bought one so far, and I have my eye on something that is underpriced and something that it is beautiful. I'll try to hold off. Though there is one item that might drop into my lap for pennies...I'll have to get that.

 

Hey, one last question. Speaking of not being able to hold off. I'm going to Megacon at the end of the week. Any artists there who I should definitely get a sketch from? Anything I should look for? I'm only going to be there a day and I have comicbooks to buy/sell/trade, but I'm going to have to look at some art.

 

WC

 

Speaking, personally, I don't need advice from anybody on what OA to buy, or what artists to buy from.

 

I know what I like.

 

Don't you?

 

Follow your heart, not the $$$s potential.

[Pete Marino]

You guys are great help. Seriously.

 

In other fields of collectibles, I recommend finding items that meet three categories (1.) rare (2.) cool and (3.) high grade. Then I counsel people to find the stuff they can buy that meets all three categories in their budget. So for some comicbook collectors, that might mean collecting copper age, for others bronze, etc. What's interesting is that with art, there (generally) is only rare and cool. But defining "rare" and "cool" is gonna be hard to do. Might be interesting to define the sliding scale between the two.

 

And yes...I need to study the market. I've always heard that, I've even given that advice, and yet I never do. I'll give it a go this time. I've only bought one so far, and I have my eye on something that is underpriced and something that it is beautiful. I'll try to hold off. Though there is one item that might drop into my lap for pennies...I'll have to get that.

 

Hey, one last question. Speaking of not being able to hold off. I'm going to Megacon at the end of the week. Any artists there who I should definitely get a sketch from? Anything I should look for? I'm only going to be there a day and I have comicbooks to buy/sell/trade, but I'm going to have to look at some art.

 

WC

 

Speaking, personally, I don't need advice from anybody on what OA to buy, or what artists to buy from.

 

I know what I like.

 

Don't you?

 

Follow your heart, not the $$$s potential.

 

Terry, not being independently wealthy, I have to wholeheartedly disagree.

 

There are many things that I love, that are owned by people / dealers that will only sell for multiples of the art's value. I am not going to throw buckets of money at something because I love it. I'll wait for the next one to come at a reasonable price.

 

I know what I like, I know what it's worth, and I hope that it will retain value in case some day I need to get some of my money out of it. I am not worried about losing a few bucks here and there, but I would not say "buy what you love with caution to the wind" either!

[mister_not_so_nice]

Hey, one last question. Speaking of not being able to hold off. I'm going to Megacon at the end of the week. Any artists there who I should definitely get a sketch from? Anything I should look for?

 

WC

 

All advice given regarding OA applies equally to covers, splash pages, panel pages, sketches, old art, new art, painted art, watercolor, sculptures, play-doh, finger paints, etch-a-sketch, that thing that you put the colored pegs in and the light bulb illuminates from the back and any other type of art you may find.